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Toyota Cost Cutting, really grinding my gears.

 
Old 02-06-19, 10:34 AM
  #1  
LexsCTJill
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Default Toyota Cost Cutting, really grinding my gears.




I guess I have not much to do today, the city has shut down again as we had another freezing rain storm. So everyone at work either did not come in today or they have left and gone home.

On this forum, I honestly find the criticism of any brand more valuable than the praise. So here is my issue.

When my parents took ownership of their new Avalon, they method something that was a little odd, my father said that when he goes to open his driver side window, sometimes the passenger side window would open as well. I did not think much of it, however when I borrowed his car for a week, I noticed it as well, it seemed to happen more when it was dark out at night. Well yesterday, we were at the car park and there was newer Toyota's as well as older ones, I finally figured it out. Toyota in an ever so cheap way, removed the power window button spacer between each window switch.

Here are some pics to see the issue: I am not to pleased with something so small and seemingly irrelevant, but if people are not aware of something like this, then who knows what else they could cost cut in the future, or maybe already have (example, Toyota removed the door lock for the newer 4Runners)

Pics coming any minute.





Previously, it was impossible to open both windows with one touch, now it is very easy to do if you are not precise.

Anyways, the good news is that the Lexus ES350 uses the spacer. So it must be a Toyota cost cutting thing...

Last edited by LexsCTJill; 02-06-19 at 09:00 PM.
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Old 02-06-19, 10:44 AM
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I think it's more of a design flaw than cost savings. Realistically speaking, how much can Toyota save on that thin strip of plastic, given the relatively low volume of the Avalon. Plus the amount of plastics used on the giant grill tells me Toyota isnt trying to save a tenth of penny.
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Old 02-06-19, 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by situman View Post
I think it's more of a design flaw than cost savings. Realistically speaking, how much can Toyota save on that thin strip of plastic, given the relatively low volume of the Avalon.
It is on all of their new TNGA products. The pic above was from the Prius.
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Old 02-06-19, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by situman View Post
Plus the amount of plastics used on the giant grill tells me Toyota isnt trying to save a tenth of penny.
Every front end of every car is pretty much all plastic.
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Old 02-06-19, 12:52 PM
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Well, two things, Jill. First, I agree with you that Toyota/Lexus has been steadily cheapening their interiors, trim, and sheet metal for years...that is nothing new. (I myself have posted in Car Chat about it many times). Second, though, with or without a switch-spacer, one must still watch what switch he or she is actually pulling up with their finger.....it only takes a couple of seconds or so with your eye off the road, so it's not like texting or fumbling with a cell phone. Most switches in today's cars are lit at night, to help make it easier in the dark.

Speaking of cell phones, BTW, I got a new one today (first new one in a LONG time)....will do a thread in Clubhouse about it.
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Old 02-06-19, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by mmarshall View Post
.....it only takes a couple of seconds or so with your eye off the road,.
See, but that is the issue. In the past, it was impossible to accidentely open the passenger side window. Now, if you don't perfectly hit the left driver side switch, both will open very easily. Your eyes should NOT need to come off the road to correctly open one window.

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Old 02-06-19, 01:04 PM
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I would take the first one with the chrome tips and no spacer vs the black plastic and a spacer. That doesn't look like cost cutting, simply design. I would have zero issues operating those switches. Unless someone has legitimate shakes, I don't see this being an issue, just a complaint
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Old 02-06-19, 01:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Hoovey2411 View Post
I would take the first one with the chrome tips and no spacer vs the black plastic and a spacer. That doesn't look like cost cutting, simply design. I would have zero issues operating those switches. Unless someone has legitimate shakes, I don't see this being an issue, just a complaint
Its very easy to dismiss it. Next time drive one of the more modern Toyota's, try and keep this in mind.
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Old 02-06-19, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by mmarshall View Post
Well, two things, Jill. First, I agree with you that Toyota/Lexus has been steadily cheapening their interiors, trim, and sheet metal for years...that is nothing new.
I actually strongly disagree with this. For a while, this was the case but IMHO this trend is all but reversed in the last few years. All the new Toyota/Lexus models are a clear step up in interior material and interior/exterior trim quality. Its starkly clear in fact.

Just compare the previous Camry and Avalon to the current Camry and Avalon, the new ones are huge improvements and I don't see any place where they slipped. Same is true of the new ES and the old ES.

I mean, maybe theres no divider between the switches, but the new Avalon's interior is WORLDS better than the old Avalon. Much better materials, technology, displays...


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Old 02-06-19, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by LexsCTJill View Post
Its very easy to dismiss it. Next time drive one of the more modern Toyota's, try and keep this in mind.
My friend has a new body style Prius and the window switches look like this example. No problems. When one puts their finger on the switches the tactile feel can differentiate it's two separate buttons with the space between the two switches. If one has 'fat' fingers then perhaps its possible to press both, but I don't have any problem with this. Sounds like you just have a preference for a spacer. nbd


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Old 02-06-19, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by SW17LS View Post
I actually strongly disagree with this. For a while, this was the case but IMHO this trend is all but reversed in the last few years. All the new Toyota/Lexus models are a clear step up in interior material and interior/exterior trim quality. Its starkly clear in fact.
I agree. No offence to Marshall, (I consider him a friend of mine), but he has an ax to grind with Toyota. That being said, the new ES is light years better than the outgoing ES which was better than the 07 ES. The new Avalon, Camry are all better than their previous models. The new Camry hatch is excellent. Not sure about Rav4 and the LS500 took a bit of step back in the cost cutting department whereas the LX got better.

Originally Posted by SW17LS View Post
but the new Avalon's interior is WORLDS better than the old Avalon. Much better materials, technology, displays...
I looked at all the competition at the car park, every car make has the divider. New TNGA Toyota, they do not. There is reason as to why the divider was there. Lexus has them.
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Old 02-06-19, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by SW17LS View Post
I actually strongly disagree with this. For a while, this was the case but IMHO this trend is all but reversed in the last few years. All the new Toyota/Lexus models are a clear step up in interior material and interior/exterior trim quality. Its starkly clear in fact.

Just compare the previous Camry and Avalon to the current Camry and Avalon, the new ones are huge improvements and I don't see any place where they slipped. Same is true of the new ES and the old ES.

I mean, maybe theres no divider between the switches, but the new Avalon's interior is WORLDS better than the old Avalon. Much better materials, technology, displays...
Yeah agreed. Sure there may have been a regression in material quality in the mid 2000s-2015ish. But since, material has improved significantly on most ToMoCo models.
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Old 02-06-19, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Hoovey2411 View Post
My friend has a new body style Prius and the window switches look like this example. No problems. When one puts their finger on the switches the tactile feel can differentiate it's two separate buttons with the space between the two switches. If one has 'fat' fingers then perhaps its possible to press both, but I don't have any problem with this. Sounds like you just have a preference for a spacer. nbd

Why do feel the Lexus models would keep the spacer?
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Old 02-06-19, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by situman View Post
I think it's more of a design flaw than cost savings. Realistically speaking, how much can Toyota save on that thin strip of plastic, given the relatively low volume of the Avalon. Plus the amount of plastics used on the giant grill tells me Toyota isnt trying to save a tenth of penny.
I would tend to agree with this. I can't say that I know the cost of that piece of plastic, but I can see some design engineer pushing for a "sleeker look" in eliminating that divider.

And agreed, it can't really be an Avalon-only part. This has to be a parts bin piece, making its way into redesigned Toyota products.
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Old 02-06-19, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by LexsCTJill View Post
Why do feel the Lexus models would keep the spacer?
Well I haven't thought about it because I don't lose sleep over it. I could speculate, but I don't like to assume. If it bothers you that much, then why don't you write ToMoCo and ask their reasoning?

My above responses are that spacer or no spacer, I can operate a window switch
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