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I don't really see the ES as a 3-series competitor, other than perhaps on price. The new ES is, as I said, a bit soft, but certainly feels less like a boat than the last generation. The steering is reasonably heavy and reasonably quick, and the body roll is noticeable but certainly won't rear its head unless provoked. I would expect the 3-series to be a lot sharper in its responses, if it's anything like the IS, but I haven't driven one.
It would be interesting, let's say the new 3 is like the 2006-2011 3. A significant number of those were ordered without sport packages, even though it was like $1400, and many said that's worth it for the seats alone. My theory is many don't want to deal with getting winter tires or unequal sizes front/rear. Maybe the new ES competes with 3 buyers who are not interested in the sport packaged models, and want just a "premium" small car, although the ES doesn't strike me as small either, like a 3 would.
I sampled the latest-generation ES with the 45-series tires, and was not impressed at all with the ride comfort or noise-level. However, I'll have an open mind that the ES models with 55-series tires may (?) be better in both categories. I did sample a new 2019 Avalon XLE (a car built on the same platform) with the 55-series tires, and found its comfort level acceptable.....close to, but not quite the equal of my 18" wheel 50-series Lacrosse.
I sampled the latest-generation ES with the 45-series tires, and was not impressed at all with the ride comfort or noise-level. However, I'll have an open mind that the ES models with 55-series tires may (?) be better in both categories. I did sample a new 2019 Avalon XLE (a car built on the same platform) with the 55-series tires, and found its comfort level acceptable.....close to, but not quite the equal of my 18" wheel 50-series Lacrosse.
You are the literally the only person I have seen that does not think the new ES is a quiet car.
You are the only person I have seen that does not think the new ES is a quiet car.
Please read my post. I said with 45-series tires. With 55's, it would likely be better. The Avalon XLE, with 55s, was noticeably quieter and smoother. It is not always the case (the 2Gen Hyundai Genesis, for instance, managed to be quite comfortable with 45s), but in most cases, all else equal, one can notice the difference between 50s and above vs. 50s and below....especially in my case, with many years of sensitive evaluations of a vehicle's ride comfort. Sometimes temperature makes a difference, too.....warm or hot tires, especially on a hot day where the hydraulic fluid in the shock-absorbers is thinner and the tire-rubber more flexible, will produce a noticeably smoother/quieter ride, on the very same tires, than on a cold winter day. That was especially noticeable on my last two cars.....the Verano and Outback.
Motor Trend just knocked it down for being too loud, which really surprised me. I, too, find it to be quiet.
Unfortunately, the ES rides a bit louder than we'd like, particularly the F Sport model, which doesn't control wind noise as well. On both models, you'll hear quite a bit of road noise at 65 mph on the highway.
Which is at odds with Alex on Autos who test drive the F sport.
I have a great deal of respect for Alex (probably more so than for any other single reviewer)...but I also have to trust what my own two ears and seat of my pants are telling me. Alex, however, is correct probably 98-99% of the time.
I don't get it. It was a pretty windy day yesterday, and I'd say the road and wind noise were quieter than my IS. The road noise was certainly a bigger difference than wind - I'd say the IS does a good job with wind - but a difference nonetheless. Also, impacts in the road, like smaller potholes and cracks, make much less of a noise in the ES. Mine didn't have the 45-series tires - it had the base wheels, and with those, it was quiet.
Originally Posted by Johnhav430
It would be interesting, let's say the new 3 is like the 2006-2011 3. A significant number of those were ordered without sport packages, even though it was like $1400, and many said that's worth it for the seats alone. My theory is many don't want to deal with getting winter tires or unequal sizes front/rear. Maybe the new ES competes with 3 buyers who are not interested in the sport packaged models, and want just a "premium" small car, although the ES doesn't strike me as small either, like a 3 would.
Yeah I guess that's true. Many people just want a premium-branded vehicle at the right price - for them, the ES might be a good alternative to something like the 3 series. They don't need the handling or acceleration of the 330i.
There must be some variation between cars! My car has the 235/45X18 tires and is extremely quiet. At 80 mph there is virtually no wind noise and very little road noise. I do have the noise reducing wheels so that may be helping. The low speed ride is a little bit "jiggely" on rough streets but certainly not uncomfortable. Larger bumps and potholes are absorbed without the sharp jarring that I have found on most softly sprung cars like my 2014 ES350. At highway speeds it is totally smooth. Combined, the smooth ride and quiet interior make a great cruiser, on par with my 2009 LS460. We drove up a mountain road recently and the handling was exceptional. It is not a BMW like canyon carver, but is very comfortable on winding roads at speed limit or slightly above. Overall, I find it a great ride/handling compromise for my driving style. Hard core enthusiasts will still hate it.
I don't get it. It was a pretty windy day yesterday, and I'd say the road and wind noise were quieter than my IS. The road noise was certainly a bigger difference than wind - I'd say the IS does a good job with wind - but a difference nonetheless. Also, impacts in the road, like smaller potholes and cracks, make much less of a noise in the ES. Mine didn't have the 45-series tires - it had the base wheels, and with those, it was quiet.
Yeah I guess that's true. Many people just want a premium-branded vehicle at the right price - for them, the ES might be a good alternative to something like the 3 series. They don't need the handling or acceleration of the 330i.
Originally Posted by oldcajun
There must be some variation between cars! My car has the 225/50X18 tires and is extremely quiet. At 80 mph there is virtually no wind noise and very little road noise. I do have the noise reducing wheels so that may be helping. The low speed ride is a little bit "jiggely" on rough streets but certainly not uncomfortable. Larger bumps and potholes are absorbed without the sharp jarring that I have found on most softly sprung cars like my 2014 ES350. At highway speeds it is totally smooth. Combined, the smooth ride and quiet interior make a great cruiser, on par with my 2009 LS460. We drove up a mountain road recently and the handling was exceptional. It is not a BMW like canyon carver, but is very comfortable on winding roads at speed limit or slightly above. Overall, I find it a great ride/handling compromise for my driving style. Hard core enthusiasts will still hate it.
Sounds like the new ES is one quiet car. Thanks for the posts. 👍
The 2019 Lexus ES 350 with 55 series tyres is a luxury cruiser downunder responds effortlessly to the the warmer climate
and harsher roads. Gliding through the inner city high rises to the Sydney Opera House or cruising to Bondi Beach on a warm
summer day, the Lexus ES 350 imported from Japan has reached new standards in excellence. Sydney Opera House
I drove the new ES and thought it was very quiet. Not quite as quiet as the LS, but very quiet. Its just as quiet as anything comparable to it (Lacrosse, MKZ, G80, etc)
Road noise is an area where Lexus struggles, the cars are very quiet but they don't do as good a job of isolating their cars from road noise as other competitors, that's why tires are so important on a Lexus where they aren't on say, a Mercedes.
For instance if you look at the LS and the S Class, they are very similar in terms of quietness but what the S Class does better is isolation from road noise when pavement changes, etc.
I drove the new ES and thought it was very quiet. Not quite as quiet as the LS, but very quiet. Its just as quiet as anything comparable to it (Lacrosse, MKZ, G80, etc)
I own a 18" wheel Lacrosse. The 45-series ES is not in the same ballpark.....the 55-series Avalon is close.
The ES does, however, have some advantages on the Lacrosse, primarily in overall build quality.
Road noise is an area where Lexus struggles, the cars are very quiet but they don't do as good a job of isolating their cars from road noise as other competitors,
At one time, they did. Cost-cutting ate up some of the insulation in the wheel wells...except on the super-quiet LS.
that's why tires are so important on a Lexus where they aren't on say, a Mercedes
Well...agreed...and that was my point. That's why I said there is a significant difference between the 45s and 55s.
Unfortunately, the ES rides a bit louder than we'd like, particularly the F Sport model, which doesn't control wind noise as well. On both models, you'll hear quite a bit of road noise at 65 mph on the highway. That said, the sedans benefit from excellent forward visibility, with no bulky pillars in the way and side mirrors that are just the right size.
I drove the new ES and thought it was very quiet. Not quite as quiet as the LS, but very quiet. Its just as quiet as anything comparable to it (Lacrosse, MKZ, G80, etc)
Road noise is an area where Lexus struggles, the cars are very quiet but they don't do as good a job of isolating their cars from road noise as other competitors, that's why tires are so important on a Lexus where they aren't on say, a Mercedes.
For instance if you look at the LS and the S Class, they are very similar in terms of quietness but what the S Class does better is isolation from road noise when pavement changes, etc.
Yes, I 100% agree. I think the G80 does a nicer job with road noise than the ES, but the ES with its base-trim wheels is still a lot quieter than my IS. My IS was a touch quieter with the stock tires, too, before I swapped to the BFGoodrich tires it's currently wearing. Honestly I think road noise was better-controlled in my old Camry than it is in my IS. It's a shame, because it's quiet on a smooth road. As soon as you hit bad pavement it gets noticeably louder. Not to say it's loud. You can still have a conversation, but to your point, the road noise makes a disproportionate difference in overall cabin noise levels. That said, with the right tires I think their cars are quiet. The 2018 IS 350 I sampled a few months ago, with its OE tires, seemed to be quieter than mine - in fact that was my wife's first comment about it. So perhaps they're working on improving it.
04-02-19, 05:57 AM
