BMW G20 3 Series
10-10-18, 03:18 PM
#77
Lexus Champion
It's interesting to me that the most consistent criticism I read on the F30 is the steering feel yet Fröhlich doesn't mention it here. He discusses center of gravity, new dampers, structural rigidity, etc. I really haven't been reading of complaints in those areas on the F30. Perhaps I'm just not informed enough, but I'd like to hear about what they are doing to bring back the precise steering, as I assume they are tweaking the EPS.
10-10-18, 04:42 PM
#78
Pole Position
I've owned a few BMW's over the years, but never the 3 Series although I have of course driven several of them.
The 3 is still the most iconic BMW of the modern era and this one looks like it will be the best for a while. Looking forward to taking a drive once the G20 hits the dealers.
The 3 is still the most iconic BMW of the modern era and this one looks like it will be the best for a while. Looking forward to taking a drive once the G20 hits the dealers.
10-10-18, 06:23 PM
#79
Lexus Test Driver
M340i will be amazing!
I predict the xdrive variant will do 0-60 in under 4seconds.
Plus it should have the great exhaust setup like the X3 M40i has.
Engine will be the updated B58 thats in the Z4 and Supra with 382hp.
New M3 will come in 2020 as a 2021MY.
I predict the xdrive variant will do 0-60 in under 4seconds.
Plus it should have the great exhaust setup like the X3 M40i has.
Engine will be the updated B58 thats in the Z4 and Supra with 382hp.
New M3 will come in 2020 as a 2021MY.
10-11-18, 12:21 AM
#80
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
BMW Digital Key for the G20
https://www.bmwblog.com/2018/09/13/b...-and-8-series/
This is an outdated article but the new G20 3 Series will have the Digital Key too as an option.
What the BMW Digital Key is: If you have an Android Smartphone, you can use it as a key to unlock your car by holding the phone next to the door and then putting the phone onto the wireless charging pad to start the car.
While I love the idea of one day removing the car key all together, the BMW Digital key seems more like a hassle than an innovative movement forward. What I mean by that is - you have to take out your phone to unlock the car and to start it too. But the traditional key-less entry fob, you don't have to take out anything.
Why would we go backwards from not taking out your key to taking out your phone?
Personal opinion - this is an option I would skip until it gets better.
This is an outdated article but the new G20 3 Series will have the Digital Key too as an option.
What the BMW Digital Key is: If you have an Android Smartphone, you can use it as a key to unlock your car by holding the phone next to the door and then putting the phone onto the wireless charging pad to start the car.
While I love the idea of one day removing the car key all together, the BMW Digital key seems more like a hassle than an innovative movement forward. What I mean by that is - you have to take out your phone to unlock the car and to start it too. But the traditional key-less entry fob, you don't have to take out anything.
Why would we go backwards from not taking out your key to taking out your phone?
Personal opinion - this is an option I would skip until it gets better.
10-11-18, 12:27 AM
#81
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
The F30 M3 does 0-60 in 3.8 seconds. The M340i will have less power than the F30 M3 - its rumored to have 380HP. The M340i will run low 4s 0-60 at best.
10-11-18, 09:24 AM
#82
Super Moderator
While I love the idea of one day removing the car key all together, the BMW Digital key seems more like a hassle than an innovative movement forward. What I mean by that is - you have to take out your phone to unlock the car and to start it too. But the traditional key-less entry fob, you don't have to take out anything.
Why would we go backwards from not taking out your key to taking out your phone?
Why would we go backwards from not taking out your key to taking out your phone?
10-11-18, 09:55 AM
#83
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
as for starting, i'm with geko and don't like phone in my pocket while driving so putting it in a convenient place which charges as well as lets me start the car seems like a win win to me.
10-11-18, 10:57 AM
#84
Lexus Test Driver
The F80 M3 is held back by lack of traction at launch. My M3 has 285s in the back and still brakes traction like crazy. This is why new M5 is AWD and look at the insane times it’s putting down.
M340i with xdrive will definitely do under 4seconds.
10-11-18, 01:23 PM
#85
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
I'm 50/50 on it. As described, it shouldn't be difficult at all to unlock the car without taking out your phone. Just make sure your pocket or purse is close to the car when you grab the handle and it'll likely be fine. But having to take it out and place it in a particular spot to start the car is definitely sub-optimal, even if it charges while it's there. I mean, I would do it anyway since I can't stand having my phone in my pocket while I drive. But it is unnecessarily limiting.
To unlock the car with the BMW Digital Key - you have to put the phone near the door handle so the NFC communication on the phone and the door handle can read each other to unlock the car. (This is similar to how the credit card key on the Tesla Model 3 works. You have to let the NFC read each other and that only works at super close.)
And I believe NFC technology doesn't read through jeans and purses.
it's probably nfc communication so has to be pretty close (few inches or cms) to unlock.
as for starting, i'm with geko and don't like phone in my pocket while driving so putting it in a convenient place which charges as well as lets me start the car seems like a win win to me.
as for starting, i'm with geko and don't like phone in my pocket while driving so putting it in a convenient place which charges as well as lets me start the car seems like a win win to me.
What about for the driver's that don't care if the phone is in their pocket? It seems really limiting, like Geko put it; to force drivers to take out their phone, put it in a specific location, and then you can start your car. This forces drivers to put their phone somewhere - that's not very luxurious or comforting because it doesn't offer you an option.
While you not caring about the requirement to take out your phone is preference, it still doesn't explain or excuse the BMW Digital Key because its still a not a innovative movement forward; rather its backwards.
Think about it this way:
First was the "key". Just a key. You have to go up to the door and manually unlock it. Then start the car with it.
Second was the "key plus a remote". You take out your key, push a button, and unlock the car. Then start the car with it. This removes the hassle of manually having to unlock it.
Third was the "key with the remote attach to it/switch blade keys". It reduced the extra remote and fused the key/remote together. You take out your key and unlock the car still. Then start the car with it. This removes the hassle of manually having to unlock it and reduced space.
Fourth was the "modern day key-fob". You take out nothing to unlock the car and start the car. This removes the hassle of taking the car out to unlock and start the car.
Future?:
Fifth is "digital key"?. You take out your phone to unlock the car. And then put the phone in a wireless charging platform to start the car. This starts to sound like we went back the "second and third" key design. This brings back the hassle of having to take out something; thus, innovation backwards.
10-11-18, 01:35 PM
#86
Super Moderator
Making sure your pocket or your purse is close to the car when you grab the handle doesn't work. The BMW Digital Key does not function like a traditional key-less entry fob, where you can grab the handle and unlock the car from arm's length away.
To unlock the car with the BMW Digital Key - you have to put the phone near the door handle so the NFC communication on the phone and the door handle can read each other to unlock the car. (This is similar to how the credit card key on the Tesla Model 3 works. You have to let the NFC read each other and that only works at super close.)
And I believe NFC technology doesn't read through jeans and purses.
To unlock the car with the BMW Digital Key - you have to put the phone near the door handle so the NFC communication on the phone and the door handle can read each other to unlock the car. (This is similar to how the credit card key on the Tesla Model 3 works. You have to let the NFC read each other and that only works at super close.)
And I believe NFC technology doesn't read through jeans and purses.
What might be kind of cool (if it's possible, depends on how they implemented it) is to pair an NFC Ring with the car instead of your phone. Solves the proximity issue for opening the door, since it'd be physically touching the sensor. And depending on how the starting piece works, would be way cool way to impress your friends to start your car by just resting your hand in the center console.
Watches with NFC would also solve both problems, but only for left-handed people
10-11-18, 02:11 PM
#87
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
Range is about four inches, and is not significantly impacted by clothing. In fact, there's a whole industry of clothing with NFC built-in. So while, yes you can't do it at arm's length, it certainly could work the way I described.
What might be kind of cool (if it's possible, depends on how they implemented it) is to pair an NFC Ring with the car instead of your phone. Solves the proximity issue for opening the door, since it'd be physically touching the sensor. And depending on how the starting piece works, would be way cool way to impress your friends to start your car by just resting your hand in the center console.
Watches with NFC would also solve both problems, but only for left-handed people
What might be kind of cool (if it's possible, depends on how they implemented it) is to pair an NFC Ring with the car instead of your phone. Solves the proximity issue for opening the door, since it'd be physically touching the sensor. And depending on how the starting piece works, would be way cool way to impress your friends to start your car by just resting your hand in the center console.
Watches with NFC would also solve both problems, but only for left-handed people
But lets say - it is 4 inches. Lets say you have the new G05 BMW X5. How are you going to align the phone that's in your pocket to the door handle? Are you going to jump if you are shorter than 5ft 8in (average male height in the USA)?
The point is - you still gotta take your phone because a situation where your phone perfectly aligns with the NFC on the door handle is extremely low. Essentially your car door handle and hip area have to match. Then you have to put the phone on a charging platform before pushing the start button.This, in total, is not more convenient than the modern day key fob.
The thing is NFC in clothing is not the issue here. The BMW Digital Key doesn't pair with clothes. Only Android NFC for now.
But I'll agree with you here - NFC accessories and watches are a good way to solve the proximity issue but it brings up another issue - it'll force people to wear rings, bracelets, watches and etc... Some people just don't like wearing those. And isn't the point of the Digital Key to make one less thing you have to carry? Adding it to an accessory, that not all people will want to have on them, removes the idea the digital key is trying to achieve - which is "making one less thing for people to carry."
I believe that one day in the future keys will be the thing of the pass. But the BMW digital key is going to be a gimmick that will get looked pass like Apple Pay and Samsung Pay. Majority of the population still use credit cards. We have to look for a solution that makes it an innovation situation forward.
We have to keep the idea of not taking anything out to unlock/lock the car and start the car.
We have to keep the idea of not forcing someone to have an extra item on themselves at the same time.
10-11-18, 06:32 PM
#89
Lexus Fanatic
Actually - the range is significantly less than 4 inches. All BMW tutorials that describe the BMW digital key puts the phone no more than 2 inch away from the door handle.
But lets say - it is 4 inches. Lets say you have the new G05 BMW X5. How are you going to align the phone that's in your pocket to the door handle? Are you going to jump if you are shorter than 5ft 8in (average male height in the USA)? The point is - you still gotta take your phone because a situation where your phone perfectly aligns with the NFC on the door handle is extremely low. Essentially your car door handle and hip area have to match. Then you have to put the phone on a charging platform before pushing the start button.
This, in total, is not more convenient than the modern day key fob.
The thing is NFC in clothing is not the issue here. The BMW Digital Key doesn't pair with clothes. Only Android NFC for now.
But I'll agree with you here - NFC accessories and watches are a good way to solve the proximity issue but it brings up another issue - it'll force people to wear rings, bracelets, watches and etc... Some people just don't like wearing those. And isn't the point of the Digital Key to make one less thing you have to carry? Adding it to an accessory, that not all people will want to have on them, removes the idea the digital key is trying to achieve - which is "making one less thing for people to carry."
I believe that one day in the future keys will be the thing of the pass. But the BMW digital key is going to be a gimmick that will get looked pass like Apple Pay and Samsung Pay. Majority of the population still use credit cards. We have to look for a solution that makes it an innovation situation forward.
We have to keep the idea of not taking anything out to unlock/lock the car and start the car.
We have to keep the idea of not forcing someone to have an extra item on themselves at the same time.
But lets say - it is 4 inches. Lets say you have the new G05 BMW X5. How are you going to align the phone that's in your pocket to the door handle? Are you going to jump if you are shorter than 5ft 8in (average male height in the USA)?
The point is - you still gotta take your phone because a situation where your phone perfectly aligns with the NFC on the door handle is extremely low. Essentially your car door handle and hip area have to match. Then you have to put the phone on a charging platform before pushing the start button.This, in total, is not more convenient than the modern day key fob.
The thing is NFC in clothing is not the issue here. The BMW Digital Key doesn't pair with clothes. Only Android NFC for now.
But I'll agree with you here - NFC accessories and watches are a good way to solve the proximity issue but it brings up another issue - it'll force people to wear rings, bracelets, watches and etc... Some people just don't like wearing those. And isn't the point of the Digital Key to make one less thing you have to carry? Adding it to an accessory, that not all people will want to have on them, removes the idea the digital key is trying to achieve - which is "making one less thing for people to carry."
I believe that one day in the future keys will be the thing of the pass. But the BMW digital key is going to be a gimmick that will get looked pass like Apple Pay and Samsung Pay. Majority of the population still use credit cards. We have to look for a solution that makes it an innovation situation forward.
We have to keep the idea of not taking anything out to unlock/lock the car and start the car.
We have to keep the idea of not forcing someone to have an extra item on themselves at the same time.
10-11-18, 07:00 PM
#90
I can see the benefits and disadvantages of this 'phone key'. Question, does the BMW still come with a standard key fob? What if my phone is dead? With the Lexus, if the key fob is dead you just pull out the key shank, open the door, and touch the dead key fob to the start button as the failsafe. With Jaguar you take the dead key and put it into a slot and it charges it (at least that's how the XF was I drove a few years ago). What is protocol on the bimmer?