saw new ES, it ain't a GS
 

GS is gonna get the axe

Big threads on that topic, let's not recreate here - thanks

I have to swing by the dealer this afternoon to get some new wiper inserts, hopefully they'll have a new ES.

People got caught by surprise of GS being axed so they got emotional reaction telling themselves that Lexus has something in their pocket when it comes to upcoming ES. Unfortunately that was not the case and that will never be the case. Lexus won't screw with the winning formula as the ES is their best selling car by a mile. ES is the only vehicle in Lexus line up that still thrives the original LS philosophy: more for less. And that's exactly what ES is, it's a discounted mid size sedan with luxury amenities and plush ride. In order for ES to have a cabin quality of GS it means price increase which pushes of ES into German trio turf and suddenly whole discount thing is gone which means sales numbers would be gone too. Lexus Europe is kind of stuck with presenting ES as A6/5er/E competitor cause they desperately need one and can't waste marketing money explaining how both IS and ES are A4 competition.

GS is never coming back that nameplate will get retired much like SC. Some spiritual successor in form of four door RWD sedan might show up but it will not carry GS badge. Just don't hold your breath for it since Lexus is in deep trouble when it comes to moving their RWD products. They are stuck and it will get only worse. We can argue that IS/RC are safe for one more generation but what happens after that it's anyone's guess at this point. My fear is they will be axing one by one as long as they can move Toyota CUV reskins like crazy.

One simply has to look at the Lexus site to see what the future holds. It's all there in plain sight.

We have the compact SUV in the form of UX
A larger SUV style LF-1 Limitless (this will be a refreshing departure from the boxy GX/LX)
LF - FC ( which seems to be the 'fast car' evolution of the GS) It does not need to be a mid grade blend of ES and LS models. I think the GS in the past lineups tried to 'fit' between these two as a good, better, best product offering. The FC can stand on it's own, and offer a 'more' performance experience.
Compact urban vehicle in LF-SA
and a topless coupe in some format.

All practical concepts. The flagship and ES series are ready for market. UX is due this Winter and whoever is next is anyone's guess until all models are introduced/refreshed. In this manner, it gives the 'new' car the biggest possible spotlight and repeat this process so that there's always something exciting and new at Lexus.

In short, the GS series is most likely definitely dead with this plain sight review. Bring on the Fast Car model, which does things that neither ES, GS, nor LS can do. Calling it a GS would be out of character since Lexus has put emphasis on getting RX alternatives out pronto (NX and UX) to complete a good, better, best line up.

Is this spot on or an over reach?

UX

• Future Vehicle

LF-1 LIMITLESS

• Concept Vehicle

LF-FC

• Concept Vehicle

LF-SA

• CONCEPT VEHICLE

LF-C2

• CONCEPT CONVERTIBLE

The ES is a poor A4 / 3 Series / C class fighter as they are the original sports sedans in the segment. The Lexus IS presents itself well in this segment but the ES is a boat and handles like crap compared to those cars. The new 3 series is going to be a monster and the ES is a piss poor competitor in that segment. The ES sells well being a Buick fighter at most. Lets not pretend is a sports sedan.

I was in luck, they did have a new ES at the dealer. ES300h luxury package, sticker was just over $50,000. I was able to sit in it briefly but couldn't drive it, this one is a display only and cannot be driven, When they get one I can drive I will do so and post a review.

In short, its a good looking car, but absolutely does not feel as premium as the GS. No way somebody seriously looking at an E Class or 5 Series or A6 is going to consider the ES, unless financially those cars are just out of reach and they want a midsized car. Interior is better than the outgoing ES in places, but still has plenty of cheap plastics to complain about, lower door panels, lower dash, around the console. Stitching on the seats didn't look or feel especially high end either. I actually like the look of the dash of the outgoing car better, although the materials and tech in the new one are better. I hate the new gauge cluster.

This car isn't a UL, no triple LEDs etc, so my guess is a loaded 300h will be about $55k, or 5K more than the outgoing car.

It was sitting next to an LS, and I know on the 5LS forum some people were talking about whether the 7ES would be a replacement for the LS, no way if you care about quality, etc. The interior of the 5LS blows the 7ES away (as it should being twice as much), and the finish and detailing of the LS outside vs the ES continues to be on another level.

Here's a quick picture I snapped of the black ES next to the autumn shimmer LS:


https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.clu...d2e89a8091.jpg

In person they don't, the LS is a lot bigger, wider, the lines down the side are really different and the rear ends are really different. From dead on in your rearview mirror it would be hard to tell from a ways back if it were an LS or ES but not from other angles.

That is so ugly.

I like the styling of both personally.

I agree. It is more distinctive and different than the outgoing ES. You have to look closer to see the differences. What was just posted up suits the 'baby LS' name. Everything about it is scaled down, yet scaled up from previous 6ES and yet more luxurious and a touch more refined than the maxed out Avalon. There's no real need for a GS to fit perfectly in between these two looks. The premium or upscale buyer will almost always choose the top shelf product (LS460 or LS500). Yeah, there's plenty of LS460 to choose from that are still in very good condition.