edwardh11

http://money.cnn.com/2018/05/13/news...mes/index.html

DennisMik

Any time you make a product easier for the general public to use, you also make it easier for criminals to steal it.

oldcajun

My Lexus beeps when you walk away with the key fob while the engine is running. With the old key ignition, there was no warning. This seems to me like a way for lawyers to make a profit from the car companies.

4TehNguyen

iTrader: (1)

wanna bet its probably old people that this is happening to? The ones that are least used to this new tech

Toyo/Lexus makes a beeping noise if you walk away from it. Fords even honk the horn when you do this.

mmarshall

Those fobs beep for a reason. In many states, it is illegal to have a vehicle unattended with the engine running, though that law is (admittedly) not widely enforced. And, yes, that also apples to winter warm-ups.

http://sites.law.duq.edu/juris/2015/...ed-is-illegal/

Johnhav430

This suddenly is newsworthy again. I asked my buddy, please explain, and now he says yeah that 2nd Audi loaner that I got last year (he no longer owns an Audi his wife said get rid of it after she was stalled for the 3rd time), I left it running for almost all day. They ought to have a warning.

Now he's my best friend, so I have been insisting, warning for what? How is it different than leaving a car running with the key in it? Maybe Porsche got it right then leaving this out for a very very long time when the competition had it. Or Lexus on the 3rd gen LS where there's a smart key and the twisting still takes place. But I don't think so.

Johnhav430

More people should be like my wife, jack rabbit starts when the vehicle has been parked overnight and it's 10F outside. She says her uncle in Munich who's a technician at BMW said no warmup is needed. I told her that's true, but you should also go gently until the vehicle does warm up. Warmup is for comfort, and my BMW has full heat by the time I reach the end of the driveway (and again, I don't live at Southfork. But her car is a GM and no heat for about 2 miles).

p.s. cars don't kill people, lawyers are the only ones who would say that

05ls430518

iTrader: (1)

Damn you beat me to it here is my article I was gonna post lol

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2018/05/14/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll.html

05ls430518

iTrader: (1)

Also this is beyond stupid same thing as saying guns kill people, inanimate objects do not harm people its the negligent people operating the devices that do.

JDR76

Any reports as to how many people leave their cars with a keyed igintion running on accident?

If you'll walk away from a beeping/honking running car without noticing it, I would think you would just as easily not notice that you left the key in the ignition and turned.

spwolf

oh wow, in 12 years, really?

Also, many of current vehicles do have start/stop, which would help here since engine would mostly be off.

As someone else noticed, I wonder how the stats compare to regular vehicles. There were CO2 poisoning way before start buttons, so it is not possible that only start button vehicles have this "issue".

Johnhav430

I do believe that the car cos. are doing the right thing by refusing to cave, but maybe if we reach a point where the majority of drivers don't understand the button is to start, and to stop, then it becomes something like those law labels on sofas or mattresses. Affix a label covering the button itself that only the new owner can remove: "Under penalty of law this tag not to be removed except by consumer."

When any vehicle, used, new, private party sale, has a engine stop/start button, it must be sealed with a decal that is as hard to remove as a UPS label on a box. It shreds, leaves a sticky residue, can never be completely removed, etc. Nobody is allowed to remove it except the new owner, and that label tells them, must push to stop engine, or it will keep running.

Johnhav430

Being totally serious, I'm not sure if there have been any studies showing a decline in IQ over the last few decades, or, an unwillingness to understand how things work?

Here's an example. Not 100% sure what year, maybe 2016? BMW cars had no detent for the turn signals, nor wipers. So if you ever went down the road, and you saw a BMW signal left, change lanes, then signal right, then signal left, then signal right, this was indicative of a new BMW driver who did not inherently understand how a BMW turn signal stalk had no detent. To try to accommodate that, BMW built in that if you were to tap the stalk up, it would cancel. Again, many drivers like the above would not get the hang of no detent.

The same was true with the wiper controls.

So what has BMW done? They removed the stalks without detents, after how many years, and installed stalks like everybody else. Perhaps car mfgs should remove the engine stop start and either do what Porsche did, or simply go back to keys. Because in our society, if there is a decline in IQ or willingness to understand, at some tipping point, we must adapt to it and change the design. Keeping it 100.

edwardh11

maybe off topic but why were the detents removed?
what was to be the benefit of the change.

seems many changes are for the sake of being able to advertise all new/ redesigned ??

Johnhav430

I believe that with BMW, it's to increase sales, they will do whatever it takes, even if it means selling 4 cyl. FWD cars. I found some old threads dating back to like 2004 where people were whining about the turn signal stalks that I've described. But nobody went as far as stating they killed people. From what I understand, Tesla does what BMW did in 2004. Maybe they have more power to do so--you don't like it, don't buy our cars. Whereas perhaps on a BMW, someone doesn't like it, they lease a Lexus, or a MB, or an Audi, etc.