Why 2nd Gen (XE20) IS F is Better Than the E90 M3
03-11-18, 01:39 PM
#32
Lexus Test Driver
One of my best friends is a BMW fanatic and his buddy runs a popular BMW shop in our area. Let's just say I have been around them enough to NEVER want to get near one.
BMW M cars have been historically reliable? That has got to be some kind of joke, right?
Let's give credit where credit is due....they are great when they are running right, but even BMW fanboys would need to be drunk or really high on some sht to claim their M car is reliable.
BMW M cars have been historically reliable? That has got to be some kind of joke, right?
Let's give credit where credit is due....they are great when they are running right, but even BMW fanboys would need to be drunk or really high on some sht to claim their M car is reliable.
Its all about expectations - will an M car with high strung engine be as reliable through 250k miles as a Camry, answer is NO.
But if you don't abuse the car and do regular maintenance, there is no reason why it will not be reliable. There are are plenty E36, 46, 9x M3s running around with well over 100k miles. Most of these cars are modified in some way (intakes, exhaust, FI etc.) and that also impacts reliability.
03-11-18, 01:46 PM
#33
Lexus Test Driver
A bare bones E30 will not work for most ppl that need a daily, modern tech or have kids.
Not to mention all the safety features you need now.
Go drive an F80 M3 with CompPack like I have and I guarantee you will be smiling non stop from the enjoyment.
03-11-18, 02:35 PM
#34
Lexus Fanatic
Well you're missing out on some amazing cars then.
A bare bones E30 will not work for most ppl that need a daily, modern tech or have kids.
Not to mention all the safety features you need now.
Go drive an F80 M3 with CompPack like I have and I guarantee you will be smiling non stop from the enjoyment.
But many today would say, dang that nav su***, and you can't even connect anything via USB. No pandora or Apple play, garbage! What an awful car. lol (had an external oil cooler standard imho that's pretty serious)
03-11-18, 05:54 PM
#35
Well you're missing out on some amazing cars then.
A bare bones E30 will not work for most ppl that need a daily, modern tech or have kids.
Not to mention all the safety features you need now.
Go drive an F80 M3 with CompPack like I have and I guarantee you will be smiling non stop from the enjoyment.
03-12-18, 07:54 AM
#36
I don’t think on a good day an ISF is faster than the M3 but the important thing is they’re more reliable and cheaper to maintain on the bad days. When I’m looking for weekend sport cars to own, I need them to be cheap to sit and cheap to maintain. I’m not trying to go for the fastest lap times. The M3 might be the faster sport car but overall the ISF is the better sport car once you add reliability and the money factor.
03-12-18, 08:52 AM
#37
Lexus Fanatic
You were supposed to be smiling as a result of the way the vehicle performed.
What I do notice is that opinions are so differing nowadays, there's little that anyone agrees upon. So it's altogether possible I guess that the M3 is no good, unreliable, and just plain doesn't stack up, to Lexus.
Actually, some of this is demonstrated by the most popular YouTube'rs. They can have 2 mil. subscribers, yet still be very set in their ways and opinions. Normal, just becomes more apparent with the web. This just jogged my memory. I remember an article where MT rejoiced that in the G37S vs. 335i test, the BMW was heat soaked and went into limp mode. You bet the G forums gloated and concluded that the Infiniti was a much better car.
What I do notice is that opinions are so differing nowadays, there's little that anyone agrees upon. So it's altogether possible I guess that the M3 is no good, unreliable, and just plain doesn't stack up, to Lexus.
Actually, some of this is demonstrated by the most popular YouTube'rs. They can have 2 mil. subscribers, yet still be very set in their ways and opinions. Normal, just becomes more apparent with the web. This just jogged my memory. I remember an article where MT rejoiced that in the G37S vs. 335i test, the BMW was heat soaked and went into limp mode. You bet the G forums gloated and concluded that the Infiniti was a much better car.
03-12-18, 08:59 AM
#38
Lexus Fanatic
I was next to one near my house a couple weeks ago, 325i. Older gentleman was driving, he probably got it new. I rather like that car. It definitely was from a time when there was a huge difference between a German car, and everyone else, as far as road manners. The car was designed for driving, not streaming audio and video....
03-12-18, 02:15 PM
#40
You have no clue what you're talking about.
Its all about expectations - will an M car with high strung engine be as reliable through 250k miles as a Camry, answer is NO.
But if you don't abuse the car and do regular maintenance, there is no reason why it will not be reliable. There are are plenty E36, 46, 9x M3s running around with well over 100k miles. Most of these cars are modified in some way (intakes, exhaust, FI etc.) and that also impacts reliability.
03-12-18, 03:29 PM
#41
Lexus Champion
I think the reliability issue really starts out with minor electronic problems such as moon roof stuck open or major problems like weird sensors going off while driving and rendering the car in limp mode. While Lexus has suffered similar problems before, the reported incidents are significantly less than the ones from BMW's owners.
03-12-18, 05:50 PM
#42
Lexus Test Driver
Again guys - im not saying Lexus is not More reliable than BMW overall, most likely it is BUT that is to be expected.
Race cars need their engines rebuilt all the time because of the stress they are under. The more performance oriented the cars usually the more maintenance and parts that will need attention.
Having been a BMW owner for over 10years, these cars are solid and don't break out of nowhere.
This is not a Pinto or some temperamental Italian exotic. BMWs can be daily driven but due cost a premium to maintain over a Typical Honda or Toyota - this should be expected.
Race cars need their engines rebuilt all the time because of the stress they are under. The more performance oriented the cars usually the more maintenance and parts that will need attention.
Having been a BMW owner for over 10years, these cars are solid and don't break out of nowhere.
This is not a Pinto or some temperamental Italian exotic. BMWs can be daily driven but due cost a premium to maintain over a Typical Honda or Toyota - this should be expected.
03-12-18, 09:39 PM
#43
In 2011 there was a test run (Motor Trend I think) of a Mustang GT and a M3. The Mustang was faster in a straight line but the surprise was on the road course. Driven by the writer, the Mustang was faster. Driven by the pro racer, the M3 was faster by .09 sec.
The Mustang has no failures of the engine main bearings or HP fuel pumps. It is also $30K cheaper.
This was the old solid axle Mustang, the new car would be even better.
The Mustang has no failures of the engine main bearings or HP fuel pumps. It is also $30K cheaper.
This was the old solid axle Mustang, the new car would be even better.
03-13-18, 12:17 PM
#44
... so it just sounds like you're misinformed. Let me enlighten you a bit. There is a big difference between F and F-Sport. The former is a full fledged performance version of a Lexus model whereas F-Sport is aggressive cosmetic changes, slightly larger brakes, firmer suspensions (usually with an adaptive mode), and more aggressive bolstered seats of normal trimmed Lexus's.
So of course an RC350 F-Sport won't handle like an M4. An RC F is more akin to the M4 than its F-Sport sibling. Audi S-Line, BMW M-Sport, Lexus F-Sport are all sport trims. RS, M, and F are the full fledged models.
So of course an RC350 F-Sport won't handle like an M4. An RC F is more akin to the M4 than its F-Sport sibling. Audi S-Line, BMW M-Sport, Lexus F-Sport are all sport trims. RS, M, and F are the full fledged models.
