BMW to unleash 26 M Cars
12-07-17, 05:00 PM
#1
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
BMW to unleash 26 M Cars
Lexus missed the boat. They aren't just behind, they haven't even started.
The question is: will they come to the table and even if they did, is it too late for this company that pivots like it's the Titantic and just as blind as well?
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/n...sion-onslaught
The question is: will they come to the table and even if they did, is it too late for this company that pivots like it's the Titantic and just as blind as well?
https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/n...sion-onslaught
New BMW M3 to lead 26-car BMW M division onslaught
The sixth-generation of the hot 3 Series, due in 2019, will be spearhead a major expansion of the firm's performance brand line-up
by Greg Kable
7 December 2017
BMW’s M division is to take the fight to Mercedes- AMG and Audi Sport by staging a major expansion of its line-up.
A series of new M and slightly softer M-Performance models is planned, with the overall aim of clawing back the sales advantage currently being enjoyed by the performance divisions of its arch-rivals.
Opinion: will BMW's expansion affect its key cars?
In pictures: future BMW M models
At the heart of M’s new-car development progamme is the sixth-generation M3 and its mechanically identical sibling, the second-generation M4 Coupé and Cabriolet. The next BMW M3 is tentatively scheduled to make its world debut at the 2019 Frankfurt motor show, prior to the start of UK sales in early 2020.
The architect of the plan to broaden the M line-up is Frank van Meel, the 51-year-old Dutch-born engineer poached from Audi Sport (formerly Quattro) in 2014 to lead BMW’s performance car division. Van Meel described the new M3 as a linchpin in BMW M’s plans to match Mercedes-AMG with combined global sales of M and M-Performance models of more than 100,000 per year in the longer term.
“Along with the M5, the M3 is a crucial car for BMW M,” he said. “It wasn’t the first fully fledged M car but it continues to stand for everything the brand is based upon.”
Based on the new 3 Series, the M3 is set to adopt the latest evolution of BMW’s CLAR platform, a structural basis already used by the 5 Series and 7 Series and their M variants, the M5 and M760iX.
Review: 2018 BMW M5 driven
Through the greater use of aluminium and high-strength steel, the new platform is claimed to play an integral role in reducing the weight of the new M3 despite an increase in its exterior dimensions.
Insight: how new BMW platforms can cope with multiple powertrains
In addition to the new platform, BMW M is also planning to provide the new M3 with a number of lightweight carbonfibre components as standard in a bid to further bring the car’s weight below the 1585kg of the recently unveiled M3 CS. Although nothing is official, the new M3 is expected to follow the lead taken by the latest M5 in featuring a carbonfibre roof as standard.
Earlier reports suggested the new M3 would be powered by a petrol-electric hybrid drivetrain with a gearbox-mounted electric motor providing additional performance via an extra driving mode. However, sources at BMW M say those reports were wildly speculative. The latest word from M division’s Garching headquarters is that the M3 will stick with a conventional combustion engine in the form of an upgraded version of BMW M’s twin-turbo 3.0-litre inline six-cylinder unit mated to either a standard-fit six-speed manual or an optional eight-speed automatic.
Details remain scarce, although a combination of both mechanical and software developments are claimed to raise power by nearly 10% beyond the evolution of the engine used by today’s M3 at around 465bhp. That’s 21bhp more than today’s M3 Competition and 9bhp more than the new M3 CS.
The same sources have told Autocar that the next M3 is likely to remain rear-wheel drive, with earlier plans to provide it with a fully variable four-wheel-drive system similar to that offered on the new M5 now ruled out because of cost and weight.
Full-blown M variants of the recently introduced third-generation X3, second- generation X4, upcoming fourth-generation Z4 (below) and resurrected 8 Series feature among the hot new BMW models already undergoing development at BMW M’s workshops. The new 8 Series is set to sire two new M models in coupé and cabriolet bodystyles that will act as upmarket replacements for the existing M6 Coupé and Cabriolet.
Also slated for launch within the next two years, according to well-placed BMW M division sources, are a number of new mid-range four-wheel-drive M-Performance models. These include powered-up variants of the new X2, next year’s sixth-generation 3 Series and the all-new X7 — models that are aimed at providing stiff competition to Mercedes- AMG’s upcoming GLA 35, C43 and GLE 43, among others. Other new BMW M cars are on the drawing board but have yet to be officially committed to production. Among them are M-Performance variants of the upcoming 4 Series GT as well as the second-generation 4 Series Coupé and Cabriolet — all due out in standard guise in 2019.
BMW M’s strategy has been described to Autocar as the most ambitious yet undertaken by the performance division. Hot on the heels of the recently revealed new 592bhp M5, it plans to add up to 26 new or enhanced models by the end of 2020: 11 hardcore M models and 15 M-Performance variants.
As well as concentrating its efforts on bolstering the line-up with fresh new models, BMW M is also planning to sharpen its appeal through the launch of image-leading track-based variants within each model line.
This will echo the approach taken with the recent introduction of the M3 CS and M4 CS. They will be complemented in 2018 by a similarly conceived version of the M2, which is also planned to receive a 400bhp-plus version of BMW’s turbocharged 3.0-litre six-cylinder petrol engine together with various aerodynamic and weight- saving measures to enhance its performance potential.
BMW M has turned its attention to more affordable models, too. Nothing is official, but in a bid to match the likes of the Audi S3 and upcoming Mercedes-AMG A35, early development work has started on an M-Performance variant of the third-generation 1 Series, which forgoes the rear-wheel drive of today’s model for front-wheel drive.
As with a similarly conceived M-Performance variant of the newly unveiled X2, it is set to be offered exclusively in four- wheel-drive guise featuring a powered-up version of BMW’s turbocharged 2.0-litre four- cylinder, which, in a first for an official BMW M model, will be mounted transversely.
Van Meel played an integral role in the widening of Audi’s performance car portfolio with a combination of both S and RS models. Now he has applied this similar strategy to BMW M’s activities using a modular drivetrain strategy and technology drawn from other areas of BMW’s vast operations. This includes the sourcing of lightweight carbonfibre technology originally developed for the company’s i-branded models.
Van Meel said: “BMW itself has significantly more models than BMW M. But we are looking at where we can expand our programme in the future. There is huge potential for growth. We are looking at all BMW models to see if we can make an M or M-Performance model out of them, although there must be sufficiently large customer demand before we commit. With M-Performance, we can reach buyers not possible with classic M models.”
The sixth-generation of the hot 3 Series, due in 2019, will be spearhead a major expansion of the firm's performance brand line-up
New M3: tipped to be rear-wheel drive with 465bhp six-pot. This is our image of how it might look
M8 Coupé, seen here testing at the Nordschleife, will pack a 4.4-litre V8 with close to 600bhp
M8 Coupe flagship will be joined by a cabrio version
M version of the Z4 roadster is due in 2019
M version of the new Z4 roadster is due in 2019
M3 has always been key to the M brand identity
by Greg Kable
7 December 2017
BMW’s M division is to take the fight to Mercedes- AMG and Audi Sport by staging a major expansion of its line-up.
A series of new M and slightly softer M-Performance models is planned, with the overall aim of clawing back the sales advantage currently being enjoyed by the performance divisions of its arch-rivals.
Opinion: will BMW's expansion affect its key cars?
In pictures: future BMW M models
At the heart of M’s new-car development progamme is the sixth-generation M3 and its mechanically identical sibling, the second-generation M4 Coupé and Cabriolet. The next BMW M3 is tentatively scheduled to make its world debut at the 2019 Frankfurt motor show, prior to the start of UK sales in early 2020.
The architect of the plan to broaden the M line-up is Frank van Meel, the 51-year-old Dutch-born engineer poached from Audi Sport (formerly Quattro) in 2014 to lead BMW’s performance car division. Van Meel described the new M3 as a linchpin in BMW M’s plans to match Mercedes-AMG with combined global sales of M and M-Performance models of more than 100,000 per year in the longer term.
“Along with the M5, the M3 is a crucial car for BMW M,” he said. “It wasn’t the first fully fledged M car but it continues to stand for everything the brand is based upon.”
Based on the new 3 Series, the M3 is set to adopt the latest evolution of BMW’s CLAR platform, a structural basis already used by the 5 Series and 7 Series and their M variants, the M5 and M760iX.
Review: 2018 BMW M5 driven
Through the greater use of aluminium and high-strength steel, the new platform is claimed to play an integral role in reducing the weight of the new M3 despite an increase in its exterior dimensions.
Insight: how new BMW platforms can cope with multiple powertrains
In addition to the new platform, BMW M is also planning to provide the new M3 with a number of lightweight carbonfibre components as standard in a bid to further bring the car’s weight below the 1585kg of the recently unveiled M3 CS. Although nothing is official, the new M3 is expected to follow the lead taken by the latest M5 in featuring a carbonfibre roof as standard.
Earlier reports suggested the new M3 would be powered by a petrol-electric hybrid drivetrain with a gearbox-mounted electric motor providing additional performance via an extra driving mode. However, sources at BMW M say those reports were wildly speculative. The latest word from M division’s Garching headquarters is that the M3 will stick with a conventional combustion engine in the form of an upgraded version of BMW M’s twin-turbo 3.0-litre inline six-cylinder unit mated to either a standard-fit six-speed manual or an optional eight-speed automatic.
Details remain scarce, although a combination of both mechanical and software developments are claimed to raise power by nearly 10% beyond the evolution of the engine used by today’s M3 at around 465bhp. That’s 21bhp more than today’s M3 Competition and 9bhp more than the new M3 CS.
The same sources have told Autocar that the next M3 is likely to remain rear-wheel drive, with earlier plans to provide it with a fully variable four-wheel-drive system similar to that offered on the new M5 now ruled out because of cost and weight.
Full-blown M variants of the recently introduced third-generation X3, second- generation X4, upcoming fourth-generation Z4 (below) and resurrected 8 Series feature among the hot new BMW models already undergoing development at BMW M’s workshops. The new 8 Series is set to sire two new M models in coupé and cabriolet bodystyles that will act as upmarket replacements for the existing M6 Coupé and Cabriolet.
Also slated for launch within the next two years, according to well-placed BMW M division sources, are a number of new mid-range four-wheel-drive M-Performance models. These include powered-up variants of the new X2, next year’s sixth-generation 3 Series and the all-new X7 — models that are aimed at providing stiff competition to Mercedes- AMG’s upcoming GLA 35, C43 and GLE 43, among others. Other new BMW M cars are on the drawing board but have yet to be officially committed to production. Among them are M-Performance variants of the upcoming 4 Series GT as well as the second-generation 4 Series Coupé and Cabriolet — all due out in standard guise in 2019.
BMW M’s strategy has been described to Autocar as the most ambitious yet undertaken by the performance division. Hot on the heels of the recently revealed new 592bhp M5, it plans to add up to 26 new or enhanced models by the end of 2020: 11 hardcore M models and 15 M-Performance variants.
As well as concentrating its efforts on bolstering the line-up with fresh new models, BMW M is also planning to sharpen its appeal through the launch of image-leading track-based variants within each model line.
This will echo the approach taken with the recent introduction of the M3 CS and M4 CS. They will be complemented in 2018 by a similarly conceived version of the M2, which is also planned to receive a 400bhp-plus version of BMW’s turbocharged 3.0-litre six-cylinder petrol engine together with various aerodynamic and weight- saving measures to enhance its performance potential.
BMW M has turned its attention to more affordable models, too. Nothing is official, but in a bid to match the likes of the Audi S3 and upcoming Mercedes-AMG A35, early development work has started on an M-Performance variant of the third-generation 1 Series, which forgoes the rear-wheel drive of today’s model for front-wheel drive.
As with a similarly conceived M-Performance variant of the newly unveiled X2, it is set to be offered exclusively in four- wheel-drive guise featuring a powered-up version of BMW’s turbocharged 2.0-litre four- cylinder, which, in a first for an official BMW M model, will be mounted transversely.
Van Meel played an integral role in the widening of Audi’s performance car portfolio with a combination of both S and RS models. Now he has applied this similar strategy to BMW M’s activities using a modular drivetrain strategy and technology drawn from other areas of BMW’s vast operations. This includes the sourcing of lightweight carbonfibre technology originally developed for the company’s i-branded models.
Van Meel said: “BMW itself has significantly more models than BMW M. But we are looking at where we can expand our programme in the future. There is huge potential for growth. We are looking at all BMW models to see if we can make an M or M-Performance model out of them, although there must be sufficiently large customer demand before we commit. With M-Performance, we can reach buyers not possible with classic M models.”
Last edited by Hoovey689; 12-07-17 at 05:25 PM. Reason: removed two duplicate pictures
12-07-17, 05:06 PM
#2
The latest word from M division’s Garching headquarters is that the M3 will stick with a conventional combustion engine in the form of an upgraded version of BMW M’s twin-turbo 3.0-litre inline six-cylinder unit mated to either a standard-fit six-speed manual or an optional eight-speed automatic.
12-07-17, 05:17 PM
#3
Good way to play the game
Instead of a big budget super/hyper car program, they spread the investment around to a bunch of performance products that they can sell in moderate numbers and expand the M brand mightily
Instead of a big budget super/hyper car program, they spread the investment around to a bunch of performance products that they can sell in moderate numbers and expand the M brand mightily
12-07-17, 05:50 PM
#5
Lexus Fanatic
My question is, does Lexus need to come to the table? Missed the boat? Perhaps for a certain niche of buyers, a niche they've never played to...
12-07-17, 06:01 PM
#6
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
I thought Lexus considered themselves equal to Mercedes, BMW or even Audi these days?
The only equality they share these days are those attributes and characteristics that lean heavily towards the geriatrics department.
100,000 cars isn’t too shabby and I wouldn’t call that niche and that’s just BMW’s projections. Obviously these luxury brands see something Lexus doesn’t.
The only equality they share these days are those attributes and characteristics that lean heavily towards the geriatrics department.
100,000 cars isn’t too shabby and I wouldn’t call that niche and that’s just BMW’s projections. Obviously these luxury brands see something Lexus doesn’t.
12-07-17, 06:05 PM
#7
Lexus Fanatic
I thought Lexus considered themselves equal to Mercedes, BMW or even Audi these days?
The only equality they share these days are those attributes and characteristics that lean heavily towards the geriatrics department.
100,000 cars isn’t too shabby and I wouldn’t call that niche and that’s just BMW’s projections. Obviously these luxury brands see something Lexus doesn’t.
The only equality they share these days are those attributes and characteristics that lean heavily towards the geriatrics department.
100,000 cars isn’t too shabby and I wouldn’t call that niche and that’s just BMW’s projections. Obviously these luxury brands see something Lexus doesn’t.
I think the bottom line is, Lexus doesn't have to do everything BMW does in order to be successful. I wish Lexus would stay true to Lexus and find their own way,.
I couldn't give two diddly farts about M cars. I wouldn't even want to ride in one someplace, let alone buy one. If you do...then buy an M Car. I don't understand why people want Lexus to be BMW. Why not just buy a BMW?!
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12-07-17, 06:11 PM
#8
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
Well, maybe Lexus is content to revolve around geriatrics and other old at heart types. It’s obviously what they want because they haven’t done anything to change that other than put on a mad scowl grille.
Only time will tell if it’s the right move...although their sales tally isn’t helping.
Only time will tell if it’s the right move...although their sales tally isn’t helping.
12-07-17, 06:16 PM
#9
Lexus Fanatic
And hey, not everybody likes the same kind of cars as you do, and not every carmaker needs to go ofter you as a buyer. I'd like to see Lexus continue to deliver what customers like me want too, a extremely refined, smooth and quiet car. The sort of car where people get into it and go "Wow, this car is incredibly smooth and quiet". They aren't making those cars anymore. As it is now, I'll have to go to Genesis or Mercedes to get what a traditional "Lexus" would be, yet you say nothing has changed at Lexus?
If I wanted an M car I'd buy an M car.
12-07-17, 06:18 PM
#10
Lexus Champion
I don't know about geriatrics and stuff, but I must say it's kind of interesting that even in my small city the Lexus drivers are uhmm, really ancient. The LS guys are like ready for the funeral home. There are two, or three of the 460s. Saw a 2GS once and that guy looked like he was a leftover from a Boz Scaggs concert. I kid, but it's illustrative.
IMHO, it is still a styling issue. If you can't do cohesive styling, you're not going to appeal to the prestige crowd. Lexus has lots of fast cars. IS, GS, RC. But there seems to be something missing. What does this new Lexus want to be? A ride biased car company with huge shouty grills and strange creases etc? Or a competitor to the Germans who will always give you a pretty car with quality and reliability niggles.
The ride crowd as far as younger buyers are concerned is a very small subset of Lexus buyers. Most flagships like the S class are bought by ancient old men who have deep bank accounts, but they have traditionally had the best of both worlds with wicked handling and performance options. Want to be known as an old man's car? Keep doing what you're doing as a car company. Get too edgy with styling quirks and odd proportions, and you're stuck in a niche.
IMHO, it is still a styling issue. If you can't do cohesive styling, you're not going to appeal to the prestige crowd. Lexus has lots of fast cars. IS, GS, RC. But there seems to be something missing. What does this new Lexus want to be? A ride biased car company with huge shouty grills and strange creases etc? Or a competitor to the Germans who will always give you a pretty car with quality and reliability niggles.
The ride crowd as far as younger buyers are concerned is a very small subset of Lexus buyers. Most flagships like the S class are bought by ancient old men who have deep bank accounts, but they have traditionally had the best of both worlds with wicked handling and performance options. Want to be known as an old man's car? Keep doing what you're doing as a car company. Get too edgy with styling quirks and odd proportions, and you're stuck in a niche.
12-07-17, 06:26 PM
#11
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
I don’t know how many times I’ve read some press release or some news interview from some random Lexus exec stating their desire to attract younger buyers.
How is else would you explain their edgy styling? Problem is, they forget an equally important element if they truly want to roll back the clock so to speak: their dang engines.
These other brands get it, Lexus doesn’t.
Having a fast car these days doesn’t mean sacrificing ride comfort, harshness or dead silence, no, no, no, not anymore.
I personally think BMW is smart. Especially the M SUVs. Just another way to differentiate and stand apart.
How is else would you explain their edgy styling? Problem is, they forget an equally important element if they truly want to roll back the clock so to speak: their dang engines.
These other brands get it, Lexus doesn’t.
Having a fast car these days doesn’t mean sacrificing ride comfort, harshness or dead silence, no, no, no, not anymore.
I personally think BMW is smart. Especially the M SUVs. Just another way to differentiate and stand apart.
Last edited by Rhambler; 12-07-17 at 06:29 PM.
12-07-17, 06:32 PM
#12
I thought Lexus considered themselves equal to Mercedes, BMW or even Audi these days?
The only equality they share these days are those attributes and characteristics that lean heavily towards the geriatrics department.
100,000 cars isn’t too shabby and I wouldn’t call that niche and that’s just BMW’s projections. Obviously these luxury brands see something Lexus doesn’t.
The only equality they share these days are those attributes and characteristics that lean heavily towards the geriatrics department.
100,000 cars isn’t too shabby and I wouldn’t call that niche and that’s just BMW’s projections. Obviously these luxury brands see something Lexus doesn’t.
12-07-17, 06:41 PM
#13
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
The only downside is that will this move diminish the M line similar to the hollowing out of the AMG line as Mercedes greatly expanded its performance lineup?
I personally don’t think so but the risk is there. I have no problem with the 43s as I would rather have that than the non AMG one, although the 63s are the way to go.
I personally don’t think so but the risk is there. I have no problem with the 43s as I would rather have that than the non AMG one, although the 63s are the way to go.
12-07-17, 06:47 PM
#14
The only downside is that will this move diminish the M line similar to the hollowing out of the AMG line as Mercedes greatly expanded its performance lineup?
I personally don’t think so but the risk is there. I have no problem with the 43s as I would rather have that than the non AMG one, although the 63s are the way to go.
I personally don’t think so but the risk is there. I have no problem with the 43s as I would rather have that than the non AMG one, although the 63s are the way to go.
12-07-17, 08:55 PM
#15
bmw and mb both going in the same direction. not my favorite move but from marketing and branding point of view this is the way to do it.
lexus is falling behind pretty badly. but then again i feel that lexus is not trying to go after mb and bmw anymore. not sure if that's a positive comment
lexus is falling behind pretty badly. but then again i feel that lexus is not trying to go after mb and bmw anymore. not sure if that's a positive comment