LOL nobody buys the Metris for personal use. I see them as work fans with unpainted bumpers. It has a nice front end, but the rear is ugly. The MB R class failed miserably too. Lexus should not waste resources into making a passenger van and should instead be building a smaller cute ute, new hatch, 4 door coupe. All Im saying is that there are other products they should be looking at first. With a 7 passenger RX, they already have enough vehicles to fit 7-8 passengers.

Almost no resources wasted. They would just add a Lexus interior to the Sienna.

Great idea Jill - a Lexus "VX" or "MX" etc etc.

Does anyone really find the space in the 3rd of of 7-seater SUV's useful for adults?
Is it actually legal for adults to sit in the 3rd row of SUV's?

Outside of the big Suburban/Expedition class of SUVs, the only ones I've personally seen with what I'd call adequate room for average or larger-sized adults are in the 1Gen GM triplets.....Chevy Traverse, Buick Enclave, and GMC Acadia. Note that, however, it might not apply to all of the 2Gen versions....the Acadia, in particular, has been downsized some.

I don't know of any jurisdiction in the U.S. that specifically outlaws it. If you can fit in, and the seat belt can get around you and be buckled (which IS the law in most places)....then fair game.

We’ve had adults in the third row of our Highlander. Not especially comfortable but certainly adequate for shorter drives.

A Lexus version of the Sienna makes no sense to me. The Sienna already tops out at what, $50k? Put a Lexus interior in it and charge $60k? My gut feeling is that the interior of a $60k Sienna is what the $50k Sienna ought to have. We looked at the Sienna but I couldn’t pay anywhere near $50k for that interior.

Yeah, the Highlander's 3rd-row seat isn't bad by mid-size SUV standards. The 1Gen FWD/AWD GM triplets, though, are the best I've seen outside of the Suburban/Expedition class itself.

Okay, we have people complain about Lexus brand prestige erosion and then others wanting them to build a sienna? :D

The Mercedes V Class MPV/minivan hasn't diluted Mercedes' big badge one little bit...

Went to the LA auto show and saw the RX350L first hand. First impression is that you couldnt tell at all it was the extended version unless u looked at the badge. Several key observations from this thread i noted as well:

- there is basically no changes internally ir externally from my 2017 RX350 that i can tell
- its really spacious in the cargo area with the 3rd row down! People will probably buy it for that fact alone
- the rear valence lacks the exhaust tips and utilizes the hybrid one because the mufflers do not extend out from the stock non-L version at all. Furthermore, they pit the spare tire underneath the car now
- there are rear seat AC controls, and confirmed still none for 2nd row

all in all, the “facelift” or mid life refresh was basically put into adding the L into the lineup and nothing else. Im seriously deliveberating about trading in mine because i really do need the extra cargo capacity! It will definitely sell like hotcakes!

It’s not a facelift/refresh. That should come next year.

agreed.

lol, yes, and if it was illegal then the law should apply to most coupes too (lc, porsche 911, mustang, etc.) :D

I think I might have worked out why 7-seater SUV's have a cramped 3rd row compared to MPV's.

SUV's have a raised floor pan due to the bigger rolling diameter tires for a higher ground clearance.
MPV's also have a raised floor pan too, but this time the ground clearance is still low compared to a sedan, but the MPV's floor pan is virtually inverted, resulting in flat floor with no sills, or albeit inverted door sills.

SUV's & MPV's are virtually the same for exterior height.
So then how come 3rd row SUV's are different to 3rd row MPV's?

Because both SUV's & MPV's are essentially the same height, but the SUV's have a higher ground clearance, the SUV's actually have a slimmer profile.

The higher seats used by SUV's & MPV's in the front & middle rows are virtually the same.
However, it is the 3rd row that is actually different.

The SUV has a 3rd row footwell floor that is raised relative to it's middle row footwell floor, resulting in a very shallow SUV 3rd row floor in the Audi Q7 photo on the right.
On the otherhand, the MPV has a floor that is virtually flat from the front footwell floor, all the way to the trunk floor in the rear - hence the MPV has 3rd row seats with considerably deeper foot well for greater vertical legroom.

Theoretically, the SUV's could deepen their 3rd row footwell floor for vertical legroom to match the MPV's, by lowering both their rear axle and fuel tank - but then the SUV's would no longer enjoy their higher ground clearance!
Once again, SUV's & MPV's have similar exterior height; it is actually the SUV's higher ground clearance that kills the 3rd row vertical legroom space & volume.

Furthermore, because SUV's have large rolling diameter tires for a high ground clearance, there are huge wheel arches surrounding the SUV 3rd row seats, hence often only two 3rd row seats.
MPV's have relatively small rear rolling diameter tires and small mudguards, hence the MPV 3rd row seats aren't heavily impeded by the rear wheel arches, and the MPV 3rd row may even sit on top of the rear wheel arches.


https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.clu...5c2f51cdaa.jpg






The deeper trunk floor of MPV's is also a rough indication of how much deeper the 3rd row footwell is for the MPV's over the SUV's - the latter which have a very high and shallow trunk floor, and a much higher and shallower 3rd row foot well floor.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.clu...0eb66a9195.jpg

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.clu...bd65be9d1b.jpg



Finally, MPV's like the Sienna have a wheelbase that is some 10" longer than the Highlander/RX, while a Mercedes V Class has a wheelbase that is roughly 17" longer than the Highlander/RX - hence overall, MPV's have a much more spacious 3rd row bench.

I once wondered whether SUV's with the 3rd row of seats like the Lexus RX-L could totally replace and phase out MPV's, but according to this analysis - the answer is probably no; both SUV's and MPV's serve different functions, and will co-exist.
SUV's provide a limited capacity to seat 7, and limited capacity off roading, while MPV's are specialized for 7 seating...

.

wow great research @peteharvey :thumbup: