Lexus LS500/LS500h
09-14-17, 06:51 PM
#46
Lexus Test Driver
There's nothing wrong with that, but in this day and age, power and speed are important elements to many (especially for the car crowd, or what's left of us versus SUVs) and that's why you see most manufacturers going full-blown insane mode.
It's a golden age of HP and 0-60 times and Lexus is the only one of the "big luxury three or four" that either doesn't care or just doesn't know how.
I don't know how many times I've read recently on some article that some Lexus exec states the LC isn't a sports car. That's code word for slow. Fact of the matter, those insane mode "sports car" can cruise around just as comfortably as the LC.
It's a golden age of HP and 0-60 times and Lexus is the only one of the "big luxury three or four" that either doesn't care or just doesn't know how.
I don't know how many times I've read recently on some article that some Lexus exec states the LC isn't a sports car. That's code word for slow. Fact of the matter, those insane mode "sports car" can cruise around just as comfortably as the LC.
09-14-17, 07:09 PM
#47
Lexus Fanatic
Nobody has even taken an independent 0-60 time on the LS500 yet lol. Wait and judge.
I've been around Lexus a long time, the LS used to actually get better 0-60 times when magazines tested it than what Lexus claimed. I can't refute or deny your claim that the LS460 in real world tests comes in slower than what Lexus says, because like I said before I have no idea what Lexus or anybody else says the car does 0-60.
I haven't driven an LC, but there are plenty of gushing reviews, I think it was Motor Trend perhaps that said it was the best luxury touring coupe on the road today.
I've been around Lexus a long time, the LS used to actually get better 0-60 times when magazines tested it than what Lexus claimed. I can't refute or deny your claim that the LS460 in real world tests comes in slower than what Lexus says, because like I said before I have no idea what Lexus or anybody else says the car does 0-60.
I haven't driven an LC, but there are plenty of gushing reviews, I think it was Motor Trend perhaps that said it was the best luxury touring coupe on the road today.
09-14-17, 07:09 PM
#48
There's nothing wrong with that, but in this day and age, power and speed are important elements to many (especially for the car crowd, or what's left of us versus SUVs) and that's why you see most manufacturers going full-blown insane mode.
It's a golden age of HP and 0-60 times and Lexus is the only one of the "big luxury three or four" that either doesn't care or just doesn't know how.
I don't know how many times I've read recently on some article that some Lexus exec states the LC isn't a sports car. That's code word for slow. Fact of the matter, those insane mode "sports car" can cruise around just as comfortably as the LC.
It's a golden age of HP and 0-60 times and Lexus is the only one of the "big luxury three or four" that either doesn't care or just doesn't know how.
I don't know how many times I've read recently on some article that some Lexus exec states the LC isn't a sports car. That's code word for slow. Fact of the matter, those insane mode "sports car" can cruise around just as comfortably as the LC.
09-14-17, 07:12 PM
#49
Lexus Champion
It's a good pricing strategy for Lexus but as others have pointed out, the S class does not have anything to worry about. At $75K the LS is a great deal for a very small segment compared to the trend towards SUV/CUV's. You have to remember that households with this much disposable income and the capability to lease/buy this class of car can cross shop without really worrying about pennies and nickels.
IMO the V6TT is a great deal but I still don't know if this car can hold up against the onslaught that comes from behind - Genesis, and of course the styling, prestige and tech from in front - the S class. It's a proactive move by Lexus to make sure that Genesis doesn't outflank their flagship with a V8 powered limo and that Benz doesn't drop down their S class to a 6 cylinder and start nibbling at Lexus.
From what I've seen, the majority of the old grey/silver hairs are not about screaming around city streets and highways in big bruiser/cruisers in this category of sedan. So there is some validity that you don't need to appeal to sporty instincts in a driver... unless you appeal to the Dodge Hellcat crowd apparently
IMO the V6TT is a great deal but I still don't know if this car can hold up against the onslaught that comes from behind - Genesis, and of course the styling, prestige and tech from in front - the S class. It's a proactive move by Lexus to make sure that Genesis doesn't outflank their flagship with a V8 powered limo and that Benz doesn't drop down their S class to a 6 cylinder and start nibbling at Lexus.
From what I've seen, the majority of the old grey/silver hairs are not about screaming around city streets and highways in big bruiser/cruisers in this category of sedan. So there is some validity that you don't need to appeal to sporty instincts in a driver... unless you appeal to the Dodge Hellcat crowd apparently
09-14-17, 07:15 PM
#51
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
We encourage civil disussion and opposing opinions especially in car chat. If you don't like rhambler's posts you can use the ignore function.
09-14-17, 07:23 PM
#53
Lexus Fanatic
If Lexus is projecting 1,000 units a month they're projecting to be at least #2 in the segment. The only car that does more than that number is the S Class. So, "they have nothing to worry about", eh...they might be a little worried lol.
History has shown us that in fact buyers in this segment do care about value. Otherwise the G90 wouldn't be compelling, and the LS400 wouldn't have ever caught on...value was a huge part of its proposition.
I'm right in the segment in terms of everything but age, I'm really young, but income, legacy with the car, etc. I definitely care about value.
History has shown us that in fact buyers in this segment do care about value. Otherwise the G90 wouldn't be compelling, and the LS400 wouldn't have ever caught on...value was a huge part of its proposition.
I'm right in the segment in terms of everything but age, I'm really young, but income, legacy with the car, etc. I definitely care about value.
09-14-17, 07:46 PM
#54
Lexus Champion
Absolutely, you are the prime customer for this car and you are from the Lexus family. This car could be for you. But you are one person on a Lexus forum who owns a current LS sedan. You cross-shop but you don't like the lease prices or the final sales price. The reality is that in your class of buyer, there are others who will happily spend much more and have very little worry about if a car costs $75K, $85K or $95 - $125K.
You like a smooth easy-going cruiser, but you would be surprised what the image of a big German bruiser will do for a car's sales. I expect the LS500 to actually perform well but ultimately the styling and options of the S class might just edge out this new LS. It's not quite 1989.
You like a smooth easy-going cruiser, but you would be surprised what the image of a big German bruiser will do for a car's sales. I expect the LS500 to actually perform well but ultimately the styling and options of the S class might just edge out this new LS. It's not quite 1989.
09-14-17, 08:05 PM
#55
Lexus Fanatic
I have no doubt the S Class will continue to be the sales leader, especially with the new S450 entry starting at $89k. Thats still a more compelling car IMHO, really as it always has been. I can't think of a time when an S Class didn't feel like an upgrade from the LS.
My point is people do buy on value in this class, thats not to say everybody does...but enough people to create a good showing for the LS? I think so. Understand that something thats the best value doesn't mean its the cheapest. At this pricing, I would say the LS is a better value than the G90 even though the G90 is cheaper. Its cheaper but you lose the prestige, the dealer network, the resale value...its cheaper and you get less...which doesn't mean its a better value.
IMHO the S Class sells as well as it does because despite being the most expensive, it actually has a lot of value.
My point is people do buy on value in this class, thats not to say everybody does...but enough people to create a good showing for the LS? I think so. Understand that something thats the best value doesn't mean its the cheapest. At this pricing, I would say the LS is a better value than the G90 even though the G90 is cheaper. Its cheaper but you lose the prestige, the dealer network, the resale value...its cheaper and you get less...which doesn't mean its a better value.
IMHO the S Class sells as well as it does because despite being the most expensive, it actually has a lot of value.
09-14-17, 11:16 PM
#56
Lexus Champion
We'll see how the new LS fares when these reviews drop and the sales come in. I don't see the S class as that much better than anything in the segment, I see it as a go-to vehicle because it's name.
09-14-17, 11:53 PM
#58
Have you driven all of the cars in this segment? Can you provide details on why you feel this way?
09-15-17, 04:51 AM
#59
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by jwong77
Have you driven all of the cars in this segment? Can you provide details on why you feel this way?
09-15-17, 06:11 AM
#60
Lexus Fanatic
my coworker's 535 stickered at 74k, and he got it for 58k, flew to Cape Cod to get it. These list prices are outrageous. Ride in the vehicle and yes it's definitely a 50k car, but 74k? The 54k i3 with cardboard dash is really funny.