chromedome

Yeah, the irony of an American-style Korean car selling similar amounts to big-engined American cars - as in not selling at all. The funny thing is that American cars with big petrol engines sell for a lot cheaper than Euro diesels but Hyundai wants Lexus money for the Genesis.

Diesels and manuals still rule across the pond. Hyundai sell a lot of their diesel SUVs and small hatchbacks in Europe, so I'm wondering why they even bothered to bring the Genesis in its current form.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

bmw, audi, mercedes have it locked up and for the most part with fairly plain, low featured interiors with 4 cylinder diesels, so the g80 was never going to compete having a smooth but thirstier 3.8L v6 and loads of features making its price high relatively.

Big Andy

FYP

Seriously, why would I buy a Genesis and get financially raped when for the same money I could have:

Audi A8 4.2Tdi 380bhp SE Executive Auto Tiptronic
a BMW 730d or a 540i MSport Xdrive and £10k change
or Mercedes E Class E43 AMG 4MATIC with over 400 bhp or an S Class S30d SE-L Long wheelbase

All of these will have plenty of toys as standard.

It just doesn't make any sense.

Aron9000

I don't know what they are pricing things like in England, but if you are comparing new to new, here in the states a Genesis G80(the discontinued car) is about $45,000, well equipped. The cheapest car on your list of "comparables" is that BMW 540i, which is $57k with zero options, so more like 67k equipped the way you want it. S-class on your list, that's a $100,000 car you're comparing to the Genesis. E43 AMG with the V6, that's over $70,000 as well. Same thing with the 7 series and A8 with base engines, those are over 80k.

Owning a German car in England is much more of a prestige thing.

Over here in America, we have what we call "stealth wealth". People that could afford one of those expensive BMW or Benzes on your list, but don't like flashing their cash. But they still want a big, luxurious car with all the toys that's an order of magnitude nicer than your average Camry. Thus you have things like the Genesis G80/G90, Lexus ES and LS(those still have a rather flashy badge IMO), Toyota Highlander instead of the Lexus RX, GMC Denali instead of the Cadillac Escalade, Buick, and all those Titanium/Platinum model Fords as an alternative to a Lincoln. Just to name a few examples.

Granted there are a lot of badge *****s in the US who will pony up for that dirt cheap lease on a Benz CLA that they can barely afford, but there are a ton of very conservative rich people who are turned off by the thought of buying something as "vulgar" as a Mercedes Benz. That's the market Genesis, Buick, GMC, Acura, and to a lesser extent Lexus is going after.

I don't know if there is that type of market in England, or if people with money who don't want a "vulgar" Benz or BMW just stick with some little diesel hatchback like a Golf, Astra, etc.

Mr Bond

A huge majority of the BMW, Audi and MB cars here in europe are sold as company cars. Thats why there is so many smaller engines avaliable. If you show up with an regular BMW 3 or 5 here most people would presume that its your company car and dont even ask about it. People who want to show off buys more extreme cars like Jaguar F type R or maybe top SUV models from Range Rover or Porsche. Huge sedan models like S class are very rare. If you see one its most likely 10-15 years old and driven by elderly or brand new and used as limo at luxury hotels or airports.

mmarshall

If everybody took that view, though, no car company would ever succeed. Don't forget, there was a time, especially here in the U.S. , when almost no one would buy a Toyota or Hyundai.....or even a Honda, for that matter. Once they DID, however, and the word spread how good a vehicle they were, Honda and Toyota literally took over the industry. It took a little while longer with Hyundai, though....because, unlike Honda and Toyota, Hyundai did not start off with reliable vehicles here in the U.S....for almost 15 years they built sub-standard vehicles.

Aron9000

^ Some of the very early 1960's Japanese cars sold in the US weren't all that great either. Quality was suspect, rust was a very real problem in some parts of the country, took Japan until the late 80's to finally figure out how to rust-proof their cars. Of course same could be said about a lot of American iron of that vintage, but I feel that certain Japanese cars/trucks were way worse than their American contemporaries in terms of rusting out.

Toys4RJill

If I recall, LS400 without the air suspension was offered in the UK 25 years ago when introduced. It had a V8. This failure by Genesis​ IMO is just people not wanting the brand.

SW17LS

The UK is a totally different place today than it was 25 years ago. None of those engine or fuel taxes existed, nor did the smog of congestion blocks in London, etc.

mmarshall

That's because, 25 years ago, Britain was on the tail end of the Iron Lady (Maggie Thatcher's) Leadership. She wouldn't put up with that nonsense.

chromedome

London was also a much smaller, less densely populated place back then. Try driving in London now, you're much better off walking and taking the Tube.

Europe made the mistake of promoting diesel because of its lower CO2 emissions but NOx and smog levels went through the roof. EV sales have been pretty good though, especially with short range EVs like the Leaf and Zoe.

bitkahuna

iTrader: (20)

no it isn't, because i don't believe the genesis BRAND was launched in the uk, just the hyundai genesis (what the genesis g80 used to be called).

and looking at this page (found through google, not a link from the uk site now) they don't have all the prices listed, but it does say: from £51,585
http://www.hyundai.co.uk/new-cars/genesis

big andy said an mb e43 4matic is similar price but their website says it's £57,320 so a lot more ($9k) and i've no doubt the genesis comes with more features for its price than the mb does for its price quoted.
http://www.mercedes-benz.co.uk/conte...ec/prices.html

regardless, it didn't sell, and given the 'german lockup' in the uk, it's unlikely hyundai even with dedicated genesis brand could make much headway, just as lexus before them overall has made very little dent in the uk.

mmarshall

One thing that could (?) be working against Lexus in the UK is that Jeremy Clarkson, who seems to have a lot of cultural influence in that country, is generally not a big fan of Lexus, except for the LFA, which he considers one of the best cars in the world. He has an especially strong contempt, though, for the now-discontinued SC430.

I'm not saying that everybody in the UK bases their buying decision on what Jeremy says, but his show(s) are very popular there, and have a lot of influence.

SW17LS

Lexus isn't successful in the U.K. because of Jeremy Clarkson? Do you seriously mean that?!?

you do know Lexus existed for 13 years before Top Gear was ever popular right?

mmarshall

Like I said, only partly. But the fact is that he has made a history of dissing the brand, except for the LFA. I also clearly said, in the post, that there were other factors, not just him.


Existing and being successful are often two different things.