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Using only the 0W-20 as recommended by the company, the previous owner of my RX told me that changing oil at 5k miles was nonsense and that this car, using the correct oil should go to 10k for oil changes. I'm thinking that this rule-of-thumb may require some new logic seeing as the vehicle is getting high in miles.
So at 125,000 miles, how often should I be changing oil? (goes without saying that I would continue to use 0W-20)
Using only the 0W-20 as recommended by the company, the previous owner of my RX told me that changing oil at 5k miles was nonsense and that this car, using the correct oil should go to 10k for oil changes. I'm thinking that this rule-of-thumb may require some new logic seeing as the vehicle is getting high in miles.
So at 125,000 miles, how often should I be changing oil? (goes without saying that I would continue to use 0W-20)
IMO assuming synthetic is used I'd change every 5000 miles. If you are going to keep the vehicles for a while. Since the previous owner seems to have had a rather cavalier attitude towards maintenance I'd also look into differential. transfer case and ATF fluids. It may cost a bit now, but much less than repairs later on.
spend 28 on a blackstone oil analysis...they will tell you a good recommendation for your oil change based on the oil you use, your specific vehicle and driving conditions. 5k on very short daily trips over the course of a year is very different than 5k done on mostly longer highway driving intervals in a shorter span.
10K for normal use. Best bet is to check color/transparency of the oil starting at 5K, if clear, check for every 1K miles put in, until the 10K miles is reached. Then change the oil.
I read and learned that the opinions on Blackstone Lab is not any good based on hard SCIENTIFIC DATA to back up as posted on the RCF forum on CL. Knowing what I learned, might as well just change my oil every 5K miles and save the 28 bucks!!!
Originally Posted by fastnoypi
spend 28 on a blackstone oil analysis...they will tell you a good recommendation for your oil change based on the oil you use, your specific vehicle and driving conditions. 5k on very short daily trips over the course of a year is very different than 5k done on mostly longer highway driving intervals in a shorter span.
I read and learned that the opinions on Blackstone Lab is not any good based on hard SCIENTIFIC DATA to back up as posted on the RCF forum on CL. Knowing what I learned, might as well just change my oil every 5K miles and save the 28 bucks!!!
If you actually know how to read the analysis and compare against Blackstone's findings you'll have the useful info to make an informed decision. Blackstone is just one of many labs out there. I'm not sure what you're reading on the rcf forum but the lab results that come back are SCIENTIFIC DATA results . If you want some real input regarding oil, hang out and discuss in oil forums where there are some actual tribologists commenting. Fwiw, as having worked in the heavy equipment industry, past fleet owner clients of mine spend alot of money on oil analysis services from Blackstone, Catapillar, John Deere to name a few...to keep their diesel rigs, delivery trucks and farm equipment at top operational shape to minimize downtime and unnecessary oil changes which affect their bottom line.
fastnoypi,. I can hang out at any forms I like and express my opinions. Is this good old country, USA, GREAT OR WHAT? LET'S MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN,. LOL !!😀😀😀😁😁😁👍👍👍👍
It is my opinion and in my opinion I refer you to the following recent post on the RCF CL post below. danielTRLK was examining the following Blackstone oil analysis from lobuxracer and danielTRLK's opinion is below. But before going into the details I just cannot help with generating lots of QUESTIONS in my mind and these are purely my opinions (whereas your opinions may differ):
1. What EXACTLY certifications (if any) does one need "personally" and equipment wise to start such an operation in the business of analysis of used oil from engines/ machines? Who certifies the people doing it and the equipment involved. Any real scientific double blind tests, if any? How repeatable is the analysis results of the SAME SAMPLE?
2. HOW much are the equipment needed? What about the people doing the tests (how involved as far as training, experience, and etc )? Does it require a PhD degree?
3. Who will be the target market? General mass public consumers (then probably can not charge but like $30 or less per test otherwise the cost/benefit ratio will be upside down for most people). OR specific BIG industries such as government's BIG EXPENSIVE MACHINES, BIG ships' engines, locomotive engines, airplanes' engines, and etc.(then yes can charge a lot more, probably $200+ per test because A LOT MORE IS AT STAKE AND ONLY TOP BEST EXPENSIVE EQUIPMENT AND PERSONNEL WITH THE HIGHEST CERTIFICATIONS are used. Would an airline send an oil sample in for the $30 or less UOA? IDK. If it was indeed done, then what type of useful information THAT IS CRITICAL to safeguard the safe operation in an airline's engines flying around carrying 200+ passengers around up on the air? Would the $30 or less UOA test give enough CRITICAL data to safely STRETCH THE OIL A LITTLE BIT LONGER WITHOUT FAILING? OR MORE CRITICAL DATA will be needed which is UNOBTAINABLE FROM THE $30 OR LESS TEST? BUT WITH BETTER AND MORE SOPHISTICATED EQUIPMENT AND PERSONNEL (READ EXPENSIVE) WILL EASILY AND READILY EXTRACT MORE CRITICAL AND RELIABLE DATA TO SAFELY EXTEND THE LIFE OF THE OIL? I wonder?
Below is the excerpt between lobuxracer and danielTRLK (Again, these are purely opinions of each respective authors. Your opinions may differ):
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> @lobuxracer @lobuxracer , 02-22-17 02:46 PM
Lab results. Please tell me what I am missing.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
"@danielTRLK @danielTRLK , 02-25-17 05:04 PM
Am I supposed to use the twitter thing “@” to refer to another member?
@lobuxracer…….I’m sure in real life you are an awesome guy, however you have asked me to interpret your data and tell you what you’ve missed. Pardon me in advance if I offend you in any way or manner, but I will give you complete honesty.
Where do I begin? Blackstone…….this is a misguided lab, their equipment is old and outdated, they're making recommendations on misguided information, and in turn put out a lot of bad info and damage a lot of peoples engines…..lol…..They’re not even ISO 9001 which is a joke of a certification anyways. I personally don’t see them ever achieving ISO17025:2005, without changing ownership and spending $2-3mil. Ryan doesn’t care to certify his lab, well because all of his customers are on the retail/consumer end side. I apologize; none of you on these forums have any idea on how to interpret data, one bit. Until you understand the ASTM methods of testing procedures and have experience working with the manufacturers making the engines and testing their racing teams, you’ll be lost. Can’t publicy acknowledge affiliations at this time but some of you will catch the drift.
I’m assuming from the values I’ve seen you’re running the oe oil filter and air intake filter…….I could be wrong but the information was not provided, I will assume OE as such.
As an FYI, for you stump the dummies out there, yes it is possible to stump me but that’s because you’re lying. And please don’t urinate in the oil, we can tell through ICP you’re low on nutrients.
Lobuxracer, you’ve had elevated iron readings needlessly for YEARS. Part of that is the M1 formulation, in the past it wouldn’t protect in the high pressure areas on the engine, which is why in 2012 they changed the formulation to include a different additive package. Magnesium Sulfinate was used as an additive and it provides antiwear in extreme pressure areas and it boosts the TBN value by a decent amount. They what they did was drop the calcium carbonate/sulfinate additive pack and compensated with the magnesium sulfinate to stay below the sulfinated ash test. Zinc changed somewhat to a ZDTP ester, which provided some of the AW they were looking for in 2013. It’s still and was a good formula. It’s done fine but you’ve needlessly had fueldilution the entire time you’ve owned this car. This is a reason blackstone is misguided, and partially why they’re not certified. The oil in your IS-F has been diluted by fuel not by sheer. Because the viscosity improvers in M1 are actually pretty good.
The insoluble’s have consistently been too high the entire time. In other words, the oil is carrying too much stuff, becomes worn and now actually becomes a third party wear agent.
This engine is extremely well built, props to Yamaha for developing the head and the clearances on them, and props to the guys at Toyota that made the rest. I remember when this engine was first being developed and ultimately lead to the collaboration on the LF-A,
Chromium – I don’t think your rings have ever fully seated. There’s not one trace of them in any of your tests, dating all the way to the begin. Would explain the fuel dilution from almost the beginning. If I had met you sooner, I would have told you to seat those rings, aggressively.
Iron- 35ppm, exceedingly high, not damage level or harmful, probably just some oil pump wear taking place, mostly fuel dilution related. Historically you have long term wear, and now that there are a lot of miles, there is probably some micro corrosion wear, the AF test, cannot be performed by Blackstone, you can even see on their website, they publicly state they test some things “at another facility” a.k.a. they call someone like us to do the real stuff.
The oil is not being filtered well, 35 is way too high, however not horrible considering 14,000 miles. I guess I’d be interested in your driving habits…..
Copper – M1 does a very good job mitigating strong acids causing issues, in the beginning you saw it elevated as it seated, mostly the heat exchangers dumping it. Good reading
Lead – there is no conforming lead in the composition of this engine. I did see it early on, probably from gasket making materials and or something used as an antiknock index additive in the fuel. Consistently been low, since there is no lead in this engine. Fine
Tin- interesting…...So there really shouldn’t be any tin, it’s not normally a bearing alloy until you get deep into the bearing, may indicate some long term wear. It’s likely related to the valvetrain somewhere and/or there is also a timing chain tensioner wearing, chain stretch likely also taking effect. Not Good and very concerning.
Nickel – wrist pins are taking a big beating, and needless fuel dilution is taking place. Nickel is a valve guide alloy in this engine. Not good, should be 0 and was for a while
Silver – Most likely the heat exchanger braze coming loose, i.e. the engine got hot, wasn’t running right or dirt ingress that took place or just the oil becoming abrasive from Post EGR fuels residuals.
Titanium – zero, would be used as a tracer in this engine, good.
Potassium – clean historically, never had coolantingress, so likely contamination from sampling by the lab at some point during possession.
Boron – normal oil additive, completely depleted for this extended drain, would switch to M1 0W-20 EP unless you are racing or tracking your IS-F
Silicon – Elevated, likely dirt ingress…..some…..it’s also an alloy in the cyclinders and pistons. You need to get this under 10ppm, especially for the2UR
Sodium – additive in the oil and also dirt, not sure physically where you are at, but I would study the dirt in your area to get an idea of what it looks like ingested post burn, but it’s in the normal ranges. Only other place I can think of is from fuel tanks that were previously used for diesel and then they cleaned them and used them for gas.
Magnesium – additive from Infineum, please don’t ask how I know that.
Zinc, Phos – normal, tells you nothing looking at these values since you can’t see the active capability and there is no knowledge on the AW capability.
Barium – dye marker or grease trace, usually comes from the oil filter treads
Visc – too thin! The oil has historically been too thin. It is an SAE 30 right now only because it thickened itself back up. It’s far too thin; if you buy a 5W-30 do you want an SAE 30? If you want a 20, just go buy one, it’ll do better than this 30 has in staying in grade.
Oil did sheer and thin from post EGR fuel dilution, meaning residuals are causing problems in the engine, classic on these new modern engines where a lot of compromise has to be made.
Flash Point – 390….this is probably an open cup flash where they do it under a hood…..it is not an accurate test for today’s new fuels. Should be well above 400, this car has chronically had FD it’s entire life.
Fuel % - completely inaccurate, they are making calculations and not actually testing for this. Another machine blackstone does not have, GC. FD has likely been at 1%-2% the entire time. RED FLAG.
Antifreeze % - they’re doing water by crackle test……not accurate but I agree there probably isn’t coolant
Water PPM – crackle test? They’re not doing Karl Fischer. Their method is so inaccurate, I don’t know how much water you have in your engine or don’t have.
Insolubles – 0.3%?? <0.6%, what is wrong with those people. On a clean engine you should have 0-0.1%. You’ve never been there. Your
and oil filtration is hammering this oil. It’s not M1’s fault! This is a VVT engine with 4 cams, and many many valves. You’re tearing this engine up for no reason. Wasted $$$ on bad analysis, engine has long term wear damage in my opinion at this point.
You need to get a better oil filter, I recommend the WIX XP, I’ve tested the filter many times at work and I can tell you this filter is probably better than WIX knows it is.
TBN – it’s depleted, they say it’s strong? Ok the acid is probably in reasonable control, but with the fueldilution you get varnish formation from fuel, it’s really hard to read. Most labs don’t do a good job of knowing it’s there. You need different tests at this point
Honestly, analytically if you accept this much wear, you can probably go to 18,000. The car isn’t in tune, never has been……… you’re beating the F--- out of your engine.
Also, I’d recommend changing out the plugs and coils and boots at this point. Check for chain stretch, switch your oil and filter. And get a new
in there or look at the CAI for leaks. M1 EP 0W-20 with WIX XP is my recommendation for what you want to do and this engine. This is why Lexus doesn't want people going 14k. I would seriously consider some introspecting and ask if you would be willing to accept maybe your science project is over and you move down to 10K..........And no I will not divulge for the people that have PMed, how I know the inner design of the 2UR-GSE.
Blackstone has royally misguided you unintentionally."
I didn't agree with deviating from the manufacturer's oil change interval. But I would have thought that having a Blackstone oil analysis done would provide a reliable insight into the condition of an engine. I mean, people like me don't know anything about this stuff so we have to depend on the so-called experts.
So if Blackstone is not reliable, who would you recommend to do oil the analysis on our engines?
Edit: Also, you mentioned something about his filter. I wonder if he's using the Tundra filter like some of the IS and RC owners... It's another debate that I've been involved in. They say it fits, so it's good. I say it's different color and likely doesn't filter as well (i.e. made from different materials).
#39 danielTRLK , 02-25-17 07:18 PM
Problem with these extended drains is what happens when something fails in the beginning of that drain? It's way too much to risk in my opinion.
Figure this analysis took close to 6 hours with years of experience working with manufacturers, professional racing teams, and formulating oils with the oil companies themselves. The typical guy at Blackstone has a light automotive background with a booklet that gives him AVERAGE values in the industry, not specific references, nor has he ever worked with guys at Toyota or Ferrari or GE Transportation or he'd be making mid six figures and sure as hell would not be at Blackstone. When they say 19ppm is ok, they're looking at industry averages, which is cookie cutter. It's not up to par on a $70k car though. on an old rusty SOHC Civic? eh ok, even then he can't look at the analysis and tell you if your chain is stretched. This car has 4 cams for goodness sake! There's a lot more to look at when you need a real analysis. A real analysis will actually tell you what's going on, but you can't really find many people left that know this stuff.
It would be my guess he is using the stock filter.
On the 2UR-GSE I would recommend the WIX XP, that filter is so darn good. The problem when you go 10k or 15k is your filter doesn't hold up as well as the oil, the oil would be in much better shape if the air filter and oil filter were corrected. Cheap air filter as possible every 10k. Stay away from K&N, unless you replace every 10k and even then there's usually problems with them. and if they're not oiled properly? oh boy!
In regards to Blackstone, they're well intentioned people, but there's just no way they can do what they claim for $28. To get what I did for Lobuxracer, you can just PM me, I can do these things for probably close to $50~, or if you want the same as Blackstone, I can do it for $25. the interpretation is more $ though but you get good stuff. I like to think of it this way, you can get five sloppy hookers or you can pony up and get the real deal. ugh! I can't believe I was forced to compare myself to a hooker now!
#40 lobuxracer , 02-26-17 02:28 PM
I have a thick skin. I am not afraid of hearing truth. Thank you for taking the time to comment on something you would normally be compensated to do at no charge to me. I truly appreciate it.
All OEM filters, all OEM configuration, never deviated and have owned this car since new. I have used both the YZZ4 filter (most Lexus dealerships will hand you this if you ask for a 2UR-GSE filter) and I currently have a case of the filter intended for the 2UR engines specifically. This last sample was with that filter. Previous tests were YZZ4. I previously changed oil filters every 5k and topped off to restore some of the additive package, but saw no difference in the numbers when I went 10k on changes. I looked for WIX filters and Purolator, but the Purolator does not fit - the end caps are too big for the IS - fine for the Tundra - but not the IS (edit - Purolator have since changed the design to remove the end caps and it has the same appearance as the OEM and WIX filters). The WIX filter is part number 57310 and there is no mention of it being XP at all. Probably because we don't use spin on cartridge filters. Is this the filter I should be buying?
.
This engine has been run hard from day one. Not sure why there is no ring chrome in the oil, but it surely isn't from lack of WOT. It went WOT to 140 mph the first day I had it. This engine has seen at least four road course track weekends with 4 - 30 minute sessions each day, and only one cut short a day for a fatal incident on track (not me on track at all at the time, but a good friend).
If Blackstone doesn't own the necessary equipment to do reliable testing, I'd rather pick another lab. I spent many years in the nuclear forensics world, and understand practical mass spec and nuclear decay measurement very well. I have not worked in a petroleum lab, so I know little about how the tests are performed outside of mass spec. I had read some comments on BITOG about Blackstone being less than stellar, but did not realize they are missing some important fundamentals. Testing needs to be repeatable and consistent. It doesn't sound like that's what I have received. I would gladly pay more for the confidence the results and analysis meet reasonably accepted standards.
Without asking for a direct recommendation - what certifications should I look for in a quality lab? What credentials should I look for in a quality analysis?
While it is disappointing to know I've been misled to believe what I am seeing isn't a problem, I'd rather know sooner than later. I can always rebuild the engine, it's not that big a deal.
The one thing that does confuse me is there is zero varnish inside this thing. I just had the valve covers off for the valve lash inspection, and there is no brown death at all. Zip. Zilch, Nada. I would expect to see varnish if the oil were having trouble, and I'd expect to see damage on sliding surfaces, but I don't see anything unusual at all. Keep in mind, I built roadrace motorcycle engines (some won championships in the right hands), and I carefully inspect any engine I pull apart. So I'm pretty confused why I don't see any obvious indicators with the kind of mileage and use this engine has seen.
I fully understand fuel dilution which explains why I see little variation in the oil level over the OCI. It pretty much has to be water or fuel, because I know every engine burns oil. Hopefully not much, but it's impossible to avoid. I had thought it was more from humidity here in Atlanta than from my gas tank. Maybe fuel is what RRRacing's AOS is pulling out of the PCV system, not oil as they suspect, and maybe this isn't as unusual as it seems for these engines.
#41 danielTRLK , 02-26-17 04:03 PM
I know they sell the WIX XP at O'Reilly's but they usually take a day or two to come in. I would recommend the Purolator but if it doesn't fit, it doesn't fit. use the WIX XP - best for this engine. That's interesting you say you used to change the filter, one of my recommendations would be to have this filter changed more often if you wanted to stay at 14k OCI.
Ironically a gentleman that I work with, is the same guy that started BITOG with Bob. However, things went there ways and he never really got on board with some of the things they were doing. Blackstone's owner is very business savy......he jumped on BITOG knowing it would be a market virtually untouched by the bigger labs(Polaris, Analyst, ANA, ALS Tribology, Test Oils, Tribologik) and no one would look to make sure he was running the lab right. Most people in this game are about volume not making $9 after expenses on an analysis, but if no one is looking, you can make money. He also purchased all of the old aviation files so everyone would by default turn to him.
truly wish I had the time to spend with people on forums, figuring things out, etc but I'm limited to working on large corporate level deals where the cost of data means saving millions or saving lives and in return for my company equals a million or more. I have tried getting into the automotive racing market at the lower end of the spectrum but there's either not enough money or people doing it consistently to make it worthwhile. Other than having seen your data in a split flash and knowing there was significant wear and FD, I would have chalked it up to just forum stuff.
The problem is oil analysis is mostly cookie cutter stuff, looking for significant traces of glycol or FD. To have a deep interpretation of an analysis, that requires years of racing experience, experience spending time with proprietary information formulating oils, etc. Blackstone isn't a horrible lab, but it's not a lab I would trust to go 14K on my car, safely.
Look for a lab with ISO 17025:2005. but that's just to insure the tests are accurate and repeatable. Problem is the interpretation. I'm trying to start a new segment of business at our company for situations like this. Honestly I can give you a much better test than what Blackstone does for $20. If you want to have a real test which includes Gas Chromatography, the only way to really know fuel % in oil, Karl Fischer, only way to know water % accurately, TAN with TBN and both viscosity's 100 and 40c, more elements, I can run them for $50. The interpretation is what we're having trouble pricing, we're thinking around $200 per sample and make it $150 for every sample after.
edit: it turns out the WIX XP is made for this engine.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Originally Posted by fastnoypi
If you actually know how to read the analysis and compare against Blackstone's findings you'll have the useful info to make an informed decision. Blackstone is just one of many labs out there. I'm not sure what you're reading on the rcf forum but the lab results that come back are SCIENTIFIC DATA results . If you want some real input regarding oil, hang out and discuss in oil forums where there are some actual tribologists commenting. Fwiw, as having worked in the heavy equipment industry, past fleet owner clients of mine spend alot of money on oil analysis services from Blackstone, Catapillar, John Deere to name a few...to keep their diesel rigs, delivery trucks and farm equipment at top operational shape to minimize downtime and unnecessary oil changes which affect their bottom line.
I read and learned that the opinions on Blackstone Lab is not any good based on hard SCIENTIFIC DATA to back up as posted on the RCF forum on CL. Knowing what I learned, might as well just change my oil every 5K miles and save the 28 bucks!!!
My point exactly, at $28 you are almost halfway to the cost of an oil change, might as well buy peace of mind and change it.
Blackstone reports are useful to fleet owners of big trucks that take 16 - 30 litres of oil. On these you get an ROI, but on ours I can't see it.
If you actually know how to read the analysis and compare against Blackstone's findings you'll have the useful info to make an informed decision. Blackstone is just one of many labs out there. I'm not sure what you're reading on the rcf forum but the lab results that come back are SCIENTIFIC DATA results . If you want some real input regarding oil, hang out and discuss in oil forums where there are some actual tribologists commenting. Fwiw, as having worked in the heavy equipment industry, past fleet owner clients of mine spend alot of money on oil analysis services from Blackstone, Catapillar, John Deere to name a few...to keep their diesel rigs, delivery trucks and farm equipment at top operational shape to minimize downtime and unnecessary oil changes which affect their bottom line.
fastnoypi, it's more of Blackstone not being certified, using out dated techniques and testing methods for their UOA. Lobuxracer eventually did another UOA with Blackstone and Tribologik, where I was able to show the differences in testing and methods. It's why Blackstone almost always shows 0% fuel, even though it's present. Blackstone leaves many users blind, it's part of their business model to remain cheap so for them it works.
Good UOA tells you when your spark plugs are fouled, O2 sensors are bad, timing chain is stretched, tune is too rich/lean, and many many more things. Basic metals are not enough to give you this information, you need additional testing to reveal this.
Blackstone's ICP data isn't bad, it's just not the best. I like their insolubles and viscosity testing. Their fuel and water are always off. I often times will see their data is good but their interpretations are off. It's because you have someone with little knowledge regarding oil making his best guess statements. You need to understand mechanical engineering, metallurgy, tribology, chemistry(both organic and inorganic), particle physics and mathematics to make the best conclusions.
I've discussed issues with the Caterpillar labs and many others. Welcome discussion on those labs as well.
Cocal, don't think a good UOA doesn't help, it does, they're just hard to find. They will pinpoint many failures of routine maintenance well before a CEL is thrown. It's tough to find good UOA, so I can understand your thoughts.
Lets try to reset and bring the discussion back to what OP wants to know.
Simple rule is the engine oil deterioration depends upon TIME the engine runs and the stress it endures. [let's ignore rpm, humidity, quality of gas, engine tuning, altitude ... get the picture]
For motor vehicle we do not have the measurement of time, so we rely on Milage. On top of that we want to choose a number we can remember and try to get to a multiple of service milestones [in reality the service milestones are based on study of all things that need attention].
Simple math tells that the oil change intervals are 1000, 3000, 5000, now the harder on to remember 7500, 10000, 12500, 15000
The owner can decide the best number based on what type/quality of oil and factor for actual Time vs milage.
Example if engine has to idle in stop and go traffic [0 miles and higher temp] then choose less milage. Synthetic high quality oil and filter, take the higher milage.
If you choose less milage, then you are changing oil more frequently and all you are doing is maybe wasting $$ for peace of mind.
Just make your choice between 3K, 5k, 7K5, 10K. [you can choose 1k and 12K5 but they are extreme]
If using Dino then my choice is 3K.
If using Good synthetic my choice is 5K.
Every time I change oil, I look at what comes out and if needed (just an option which I never have used) switch to a lower milage.
Lets try to reset and bring the discussion back to what OP wants to know.
Simple rule is the engine oil deterioration depends upon TIME the engine runs and the stress it endures. [let's ignore rpm, humidity, quality of gas, engine tuning, altitude ... get the picture]
For motor vehicle we do not have the measurement of time, so we rely on Milage. On top of that we want to choose a number we can remember and try to get to a multiple of service milestones [in reality the service milestones are based on study of all things that need attention].
Simple math tells that the oil change intervals are 1000, 3000, 5000, now the harder on to remember 7500, 10000, 12500, 15000
The owner can decide the best number based on what type/quality of oil and factor for actual Time vs milage.
Example if engine has to idle in stop and go traffic [0 miles and higher temp] then choose less milage. Synthetic high quality oil and filter, take the higher milage.
If you choose less milage, then you are changing oil more frequently and all you are doing is maybe wasting $$ for peace of mind.
Just make your choice between 3K, 5k, 7K5, 10K. [you can choose 1k and 12K5 but they are extreme]
If using Dino then my choice is 3K.
If using Good synthetic my choice is 5K.
Every time I change oil, I look at what comes out and if needed (just an option which I never have used) switch to a lower milage.
Granted not exact, but good enough.
Salim
Salim, to answer the OP's question better, look at what happens when you base decisions on opinions. Some guys say 10K, some say 5, some say 3. How is the OP supposed to know what works for him? You guys don't even know what works for yourselves as you base your changes on what you "see" in the oil. You can't see things in oil, your eyes are not a $450,000 microscope nor a multimillion dollar ICP. UOA is the only way to know anything. One poster did mention to get a UOA and he is the only one that answered OP with a good answer. Why not 15k? I mean if numbers just get throw around? Remember, a poor selection by the OP could result in long term fuel economy and power loss, and ultimately wearing an engine more than needed.
OP, short of doing a UOA to properly determine, your individual OCI based on YOUR driving, and YOUR vehicle. If I had to make a blanket statement, which I hate to make, but it seems I will be forced to make one here. Run either the Mobil 1 Extended Performance, with a WIX XP or Purolator filter in conjuction with a quality fuel. Change your air filters every 10K to keep the combustion dynamic of the power cylinder burning CLEAN. Amsoil Signiture Series is another good performer in the engine in this RX, as is the RLI BioSyn. There are other oils out there but those three personally did the best at 7,500 in the RX engine, at 10K the oil was becoming a third party abrasive. Pennzoil UP is another option but did not hold grade as well as the other three. There are lots of oils out there, selecting the one that fits your needs requires a UOA as every engine burns differently and wears differently. But those three would be what I would pick from if I couldn't perform a thorough UOA on my engine.
Technically, I can not disagree with the wisdom shared by danielTRLK.
I approach things in a lot more simple way.
For simplicity lets assume the owner will keep the vehicle for 150,000 additional miles and is weighing the choice between 10k and 15K oil change intervals [again my choice of numbers is based on simple math]
15k change --> 10 oil changes
10K change --> 15 oil changes.
I would opt of the extra 5 oil changes in say 10 - 12 years of ownership and spend the time enjoying and using the vehicle.
06-30-17, 09:24 PM
125k miles. Change oil at 5k or 10k?
... get the picture]
