2018 Kia Stinger GT Unveiled: Wow!
01-11-17, 06:57 PM
#61
Lexus Champion
I'm not as bothered by the Kia name as I am the fact that most of the commercials have been for the Soul and have featured hamsters with beat boxes. Yes, they have sold lots of Souls, but they need to make their marketing less "cute" and more sophisticated if they want to play in a higher league. For the Stinger, they will probably feature scorpions driving.
01-12-17, 05:28 AM
#62
Lexus Test Driver
01-12-17, 06:15 AM
#63
Lexus Fanatic
Kia interiors aren't stylish? Most stylish in their segments IMHO.
01-12-17, 08:04 AM
#64
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
something about the steering wheel on many models i don't like (looks cheap to me), and i don't like the old school shifter design. but this new cadenza interior certainly looks nice:
this view better shows why i think the shifter looks crappy.
this view better shows why i think the shifter looks crappy.
Last edited by bitkahuna; 01-12-17 at 08:09 AM.
01-12-17, 08:22 AM
#65
Lead Lap
Thread Starter
Interesting news from Albert Biermann (previously head of BMW M):
The 2018 Kia Stinger made a huge impression at the 2017 Detroit Auto Show. A grand tourer with serious performance chops, it’s a clear sign that Kia is ready to pursue performance cars. While Kia shared plenty of details on the car earlier this week, we sat down with Albert Biermann, head of Kia’s Vehicle Test and High Performance Development group – and formerly head of BMW’s vaunted M division – to find out even more about the new Stinger.
1. It was tested for even longer than normal on the Nürburgring
Hyundai and Kia established a testing center at the ‘Ring several years ago to help the companies put their cars through the wringer. Biermann says the challenging circuit, with its length laps, intense cornering forces, and impressive elevation change is a great place to test a sports car.
“You push the cars there,” he says. “We have professional drivers, they are very fast. They drive above, like, 95-percent level.”
Biermann says the company plans to put its cars through 10,000 kilometers (about 6,200 miles) of ‘Ring testing, but at least one Stinger prototype ended up undergoing twice as much Nürburgring abuse.
“Actually, the Stinger did it twice because we wanted to test some different elastokinematic features, and we were running out of time, so they just took the same car again and did another 10,000 kilometers,” he says. “We test many of our cars on the Nürburgring, but I can’t remember if we ever tested the same car twice.”
2. It balances both sportiness and luxury
There is a lot of performance potential, but the Stinger also has a very practical hatchback cargo area and a relatively large back seat. So it has to blend both going fast and cossetting passengers.
“It has quite a long wheelbase, so that makes it quite stable for high speeds, very enjoyable even at … autobahn speeds,” Biermann says. “But at the same time you want a nimble, agile car with good steering response that can also master a challenging mountain road. That was definitely a challenge on the car.”
3. Engineers benchmarked many other German and Japanese sports cars, but most of all BMW
“In this segment you find BMWs, Lexus, Infinitis, Mercedes, everybody’s out there,” Biermann says. “We looked at the BMW 4 Series, sometimes used it as a comparison car.”
4. There’s some artificial sound enhancement
Like many modern sports cars, Kia made the Stinger so quiet in the cabin that you wouldn’t be able to hear the engine note without some extra amplification.
“The cabin is sealed in a very nice way … you don’t get a lot of exterior sound,” he says. “So we use active-sound system in the car, especially in Sport mode.”
As to the exhaust note in general, Biermann says that in the U.S., it’ll be loud and exciting. In other markets, though, he says regulations required Kia to tamp down exhaust noise.
“Are you from the U.S.? OK, you don’t need to worry,” he says. “You will have a nice exhaust sound in the U.S.”
5. The driver’s seat is really low in the car.
Biermann says the Stinger’s hip point – where the driver’s hit sits – is lower than in rival cars to give a snugger, more sporting feeling.
“You feel a lot different, you really feel like you’re sitting in a sports car. The very low seating position, that’s the whole magic of the packaging,” he says. “If you go from this car to sitting in a competitor’s car, you feel like you’re sitting on a bench. Here you really sit deep into the car.”
6. Kia focused on improving chassis stiffness more than cutting weight
The Kia Stinger is made primarily from high-strength steels; aluminum is only used in some suspension components. That means the Kia Stinger is not especially light. Figure 1,640 kilograms (3,615 pounds) for the base 2.0-liter model up to about 1,800 kg (3,968 lb) for a fully loaded Stinger GT all-wheel-drive, Biermann says. But he says that engineers were more concerned about making the chassis as stiff as possible, rather than cutting every ounce of weight.
“I’m really not worried to spend 15 or 20 kilograms more [33-44 lb] on the body-in-white, because in the end this pays off a great way,” he says. Chassis stiffness, Biermann says, “it’s really important.”
7. You can turn off the stability control and smoke the tires
“We have an ESC fully-off mode, where there is no restriction at all,” Biermann says. “You can do drifting with the car.” Even with the stability control left on, the car’s Sport mode has a much more lenient programming for the ESC systems.
8. Rear-wheel-drive versions have a mechanical limited-slip differential
That’s not as fancy as the electronically controlled diffs in some modern sports cars, but Biermann assures us the mechanical, torque-sensing limited-slip is lighter and more affordable.
“It does a good job to improve the traction, but also for the driving dynamics it does a good job *– especially in the ESC-off mode,” he says.
The all-wheel-drive versions, by contrast, do have a torque-vectoring capability. The AWD system primarily sends power to the rear wheels, but can shuffle up to 50 percent of the torque to the front wheels for better grip. There’s also an electronic, brake-based “differential” system to reduce power-on understeer with AWD. And the AWD system behaves differently in Normal versus Sport driving modes.
“We are very dynamic in shifting torque back and forth between front axle and rear axle,” Biermann says, “And then also with torque-vectoring by brake we manage a lot.”
9. Engineers never even tried to develop a manual transmission
The eight-speed automatic, which has paddle shifters, was planned from the outset because Kia knows very few customers would want a stick-shift option.
“There was no request from the marketplace for that,” he says. “There is no demand.”
10. The Stinger could hit the track in stock condition, but it’s not intended for it
Though Kia calls the Stinger a gran turismo, “we could attract some of these track-day enthusiasts,” says Biermann. He promises the car would hold up OK overall for short stints, but upgraded brakes would be needed for heavy track uses. “It can handle nicely on the track, but not with the consistency like a high-performance car. The cooling of the car, the braking, is not designed for that,” he says. “But with some new brake pads, yeah, and some track tires, you can get a lot of fun with it.”
11. Aerodynamic aids include a flat underbody tray
There’s no huge spoiler on the trunk, but Biermann says the slight upkick in the trunklid, as well as the “air curtains” around the front wheels, cut aerodynamic drag while also helping reduce lift.
“It’s a very stable car,” he says.
The vents in the hood, by the way? “This is something that came more from a design point of view” that function, he says.
12. Expect good value for money
Kia officials won’t talk pricing this far out *– the Stinger won’t go on sale until the end of this year – but say to expect a good value-for-money proposition. In all its cars in all segments, Kia tends to include more equipment than rivals for the same or less money. We’ll still have to wait to find out exactly what the means for the Kia.
13. The Kia Stinger chassis could handle more power
“I think it can take a lot more power,” Biermann says. As to a specific number? “It’s hard to say but, it’s good for more power.”
http://www.motor1.com/news/133262/13...8-kia-stinger/
The 2018 Kia Stinger made a huge impression at the 2017 Detroit Auto Show. A grand tourer with serious performance chops, it’s a clear sign that Kia is ready to pursue performance cars. While Kia shared plenty of details on the car earlier this week, we sat down with Albert Biermann, head of Kia’s Vehicle Test and High Performance Development group – and formerly head of BMW’s vaunted M division – to find out even more about the new Stinger.
1. It was tested for even longer than normal on the Nürburgring
Hyundai and Kia established a testing center at the ‘Ring several years ago to help the companies put their cars through the wringer. Biermann says the challenging circuit, with its length laps, intense cornering forces, and impressive elevation change is a great place to test a sports car.
“You push the cars there,” he says. “We have professional drivers, they are very fast. They drive above, like, 95-percent level.”
Biermann says the company plans to put its cars through 10,000 kilometers (about 6,200 miles) of ‘Ring testing, but at least one Stinger prototype ended up undergoing twice as much Nürburgring abuse.
“Actually, the Stinger did it twice because we wanted to test some different elastokinematic features, and we were running out of time, so they just took the same car again and did another 10,000 kilometers,” he says. “We test many of our cars on the Nürburgring, but I can’t remember if we ever tested the same car twice.”
2. It balances both sportiness and luxury
There is a lot of performance potential, but the Stinger also has a very practical hatchback cargo area and a relatively large back seat. So it has to blend both going fast and cossetting passengers.
“It has quite a long wheelbase, so that makes it quite stable for high speeds, very enjoyable even at … autobahn speeds,” Biermann says. “But at the same time you want a nimble, agile car with good steering response that can also master a challenging mountain road. That was definitely a challenge on the car.”
3. Engineers benchmarked many other German and Japanese sports cars, but most of all BMW
“In this segment you find BMWs, Lexus, Infinitis, Mercedes, everybody’s out there,” Biermann says. “We looked at the BMW 4 Series, sometimes used it as a comparison car.”
4. There’s some artificial sound enhancement
Like many modern sports cars, Kia made the Stinger so quiet in the cabin that you wouldn’t be able to hear the engine note without some extra amplification.
“The cabin is sealed in a very nice way … you don’t get a lot of exterior sound,” he says. “So we use active-sound system in the car, especially in Sport mode.”
As to the exhaust note in general, Biermann says that in the U.S., it’ll be loud and exciting. In other markets, though, he says regulations required Kia to tamp down exhaust noise.
“Are you from the U.S.? OK, you don’t need to worry,” he says. “You will have a nice exhaust sound in the U.S.”
5. The driver’s seat is really low in the car.
Biermann says the Stinger’s hip point – where the driver’s hit sits – is lower than in rival cars to give a snugger, more sporting feeling.
“You feel a lot different, you really feel like you’re sitting in a sports car. The very low seating position, that’s the whole magic of the packaging,” he says. “If you go from this car to sitting in a competitor’s car, you feel like you’re sitting on a bench. Here you really sit deep into the car.”
6. Kia focused on improving chassis stiffness more than cutting weight
The Kia Stinger is made primarily from high-strength steels; aluminum is only used in some suspension components. That means the Kia Stinger is not especially light. Figure 1,640 kilograms (3,615 pounds) for the base 2.0-liter model up to about 1,800 kg (3,968 lb) for a fully loaded Stinger GT all-wheel-drive, Biermann says. But he says that engineers were more concerned about making the chassis as stiff as possible, rather than cutting every ounce of weight.
“I’m really not worried to spend 15 or 20 kilograms more [33-44 lb] on the body-in-white, because in the end this pays off a great way,” he says. Chassis stiffness, Biermann says, “it’s really important.”
7. You can turn off the stability control and smoke the tires
“We have an ESC fully-off mode, where there is no restriction at all,” Biermann says. “You can do drifting with the car.” Even with the stability control left on, the car’s Sport mode has a much more lenient programming for the ESC systems.
8. Rear-wheel-drive versions have a mechanical limited-slip differential
That’s not as fancy as the electronically controlled diffs in some modern sports cars, but Biermann assures us the mechanical, torque-sensing limited-slip is lighter and more affordable.
“It does a good job to improve the traction, but also for the driving dynamics it does a good job *– especially in the ESC-off mode,” he says.
The all-wheel-drive versions, by contrast, do have a torque-vectoring capability. The AWD system primarily sends power to the rear wheels, but can shuffle up to 50 percent of the torque to the front wheels for better grip. There’s also an electronic, brake-based “differential” system to reduce power-on understeer with AWD. And the AWD system behaves differently in Normal versus Sport driving modes.
“We are very dynamic in shifting torque back and forth between front axle and rear axle,” Biermann says, “And then also with torque-vectoring by brake we manage a lot.”
9. Engineers never even tried to develop a manual transmission
The eight-speed automatic, which has paddle shifters, was planned from the outset because Kia knows very few customers would want a stick-shift option.
“There was no request from the marketplace for that,” he says. “There is no demand.”
10. The Stinger could hit the track in stock condition, but it’s not intended for it
Though Kia calls the Stinger a gran turismo, “we could attract some of these track-day enthusiasts,” says Biermann. He promises the car would hold up OK overall for short stints, but upgraded brakes would be needed for heavy track uses. “It can handle nicely on the track, but not with the consistency like a high-performance car. The cooling of the car, the braking, is not designed for that,” he says. “But with some new brake pads, yeah, and some track tires, you can get a lot of fun with it.”
11. Aerodynamic aids include a flat underbody tray
There’s no huge spoiler on the trunk, but Biermann says the slight upkick in the trunklid, as well as the “air curtains” around the front wheels, cut aerodynamic drag while also helping reduce lift.
“It’s a very stable car,” he says.
The vents in the hood, by the way? “This is something that came more from a design point of view” that function, he says.
12. Expect good value for money
Kia officials won’t talk pricing this far out *– the Stinger won’t go on sale until the end of this year – but say to expect a good value-for-money proposition. In all its cars in all segments, Kia tends to include more equipment than rivals for the same or less money. We’ll still have to wait to find out exactly what the means for the Kia.
13. The Kia Stinger chassis could handle more power
“I think it can take a lot more power,” Biermann says. As to a specific number? “It’s hard to say but, it’s good for more power.”
http://www.motor1.com/news/133262/13...8-kia-stinger/
01-12-17, 09:30 AM
#66
I hope this car is priced "right" as if it gets too expensive people would most likely lean to its similarly priced German rivals. Hoping an AWD V6 lands somewhere near $35-$40k, that's the sweet spot and I'd most likely get one at that price.
01-12-17, 09:35 AM
#67
Lead Lap
Thread Starter
Serously doubt it. The Cadenza goes in that price range. The only thing European you're getting for that price range is a A3 or a CLA anyways. Not sure if you noticed, but most V6/I6 Germans are $50k+ now. I think Kia will do just fine having their AWD V6 TT priced in the $43k-$50k (loaded) range, with the 2.0T starting at just under $40k.
01-14-17, 06:43 AM
#68
Pole Position
If it handles well, has a quality interior materials and finishing and is reliable like most Kias are, it will really cut into 3 series sales.
01-14-17, 07:14 AM
#69
Lexus Fanatic
i.e........that's one reason why I don't like E-shifters.
01-14-17, 07:20 AM
#70
Fine, but what's more important.....how a shifter looks, or how it actually operates in your hand (or shift-paddle), so that you can simply and quickly select the gear you want, error-free, without possible shock or damage to the drive train? My money goes on the latter....even if it might not have what some consider chic looks.
i.e........that's one reason why I don't like E-shifters.
i.e........that's one reason why I don't like E-shifters.
01-14-17, 08:44 AM
#72
Lexus Champion
I agree that this car could effect the 3 Series as well as others in the segment like the IS, A4, C Class, Q50, TLX etc. On the other hand, my guess is that the volume of the Stinger will be small enough that spread out among the competition any impact will be minor.
01-14-17, 12:13 PM
#74
Lexus Fanatic
The G8 flopped because, while Holden-impressive on the outside, its interior was the typical Pontiac El Cheapo junk-plastic, much more so than its GTO predecessor (of course, the GTO also flopped, but for different reasons). By the time Pontiac folded, its general build-quality and interior quality had gotten worse than even its less-expensive Chevrolet cousins, and the public was shunning them in droves.
That is generally not a problem with today's Kias, which, though not particularly plush or lavish inside, generally use good materials and are very well-built. Few brands in the U.S. market currently offer more value for the money.
If the Stinger does flop (which, though possible, I personally don't think will happen), it is probably not going to be because of any real fault with the car itself....more likely just lingering public suspicion, though now WAY out of date, of Kia's junk-years back in the 1990s.
That is generally not a problem with today's Kias, which, though not particularly plush or lavish inside, generally use good materials and are very well-built. Few brands in the U.S. market currently offer more value for the money.
If the Stinger does flop (which, though possible, I personally don't think will happen), it is probably not going to be because of any real fault with the car itself....more likely just lingering public suspicion, though now WAY out of date, of Kia's junk-years back in the 1990s.
Last edited by mmarshall; 01-14-17 at 12:21 PM.
01-14-17, 12:57 PM
#75
Lexus Test Driver
But this car is almost the complete opposite of the G8. The G8 was an engine and drivetrain in search of a car. And the car they put it in was a dated foreign subsidiary model. Pontiac somehow thought that the V8 RWD format would be the selling point, no matter how sub-par the rest of the car was.
This is an all new car, and opens up the sport-sedan category to an entirely new customer base. Will it pull customers away from BMW, Audi, MB and Lexus? Probably not. But people who are tired of settling for a Maxima as their "sports sedan" will be interested. I have a BMW, and I can't tell you how many threads there are on the BMW forums Accord v 320--a loaded FWD family sedan vs a stripped down BMW. Now there will be another option--a well equipped Kia with RWD sports sedan dynamics.
Its the same conversation we all had years ago about the Genesis--"No one will buy a Genesis instead of an LS--it will be a flop." Well, I don't know where Hyundai is pulling their customers away from, but it's such a flop that they are spinning off a new division.
Same was said about Toyota spinning off Lexus--"Who's going to pay $50,000 for a Toyota?"
This is an all new car, and opens up the sport-sedan category to an entirely new customer base. Will it pull customers away from BMW, Audi, MB and Lexus? Probably not. But people who are tired of settling for a Maxima as their "sports sedan" will be interested. I have a BMW, and I can't tell you how many threads there are on the BMW forums Accord v 320--a loaded FWD family sedan vs a stripped down BMW. Now there will be another option--a well equipped Kia with RWD sports sedan dynamics.
Its the same conversation we all had years ago about the Genesis--"No one will buy a Genesis instead of an LS--it will be a flop." Well, I don't know where Hyundai is pulling their customers away from, but it's such a flop that they are spinning off a new division.
Same was said about Toyota spinning off Lexus--"Who's going to pay $50,000 for a Toyota?"