Volkswagen diesel scandal
09-25-15, 06:59 AM
#151
Pole Position
09-25-15, 09:15 AM
#152
I know there are bigger problems in the world, but this has me seriously considering yanking my deposit on a GT4... It's amplifying all the talk about somewhat shady ways that Porsche intentionally gimps the Cayman to keep the 911 as their halo car. Plus, as a consumer, I feel like it's about time I put my money where my mouth is, as this is seriously shady on VW's part.
09-25-15, 09:25 AM
#153
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
Not quite correct. Just because you left a company doesn't mean you can't be held responsible for actions you took or did not take. Actually, the company is far more likely to sell you down the river while propping up those who are still with them. So if Browning was aware and is associated with any documents provided to the US, then he can be held accountable.
Browning could be held accountable by the legal authorities in the USA but any attempts by VW would be just finger-pointing (and hoping that the legal authorities look where the finger is pointed). Unless there is a smoking gun, I doubt that Browning would serve any time or pay any fine. He may have to spend time testifying in any investigations that are conducted but any number of those investigations may be non-criminal investigations that have the purpose of getting to the truth rather than trying to find someone to hang.
09-25-15, 09:46 AM
#154
Volkswagen to dismiss R&D heads of Audi and Porsche: Reuters
Source: http://www.marketwatch.com/story/vol...ers-2015-09-24
It seems weird to me they would fire the Porsche guy, their one diesel uses urea injection unlike the VW and Audi TDI's.
Embattled German car maker Volkswagen AG VLKAY, -4.75% VOW3, -3.63% is planning to dismiss the heads of research & development at its Audi and Porsche units, Reuters reported Thursday, citing an unnamed senior source at the company. The dismissals will be carried out at a supervisory board meeting scheduled for Friday, according to Reuters. VW, Audi and Porsche declined to comment. Volkswagen shares have been roiled since news broke last week that it had used special software to fudge diesel emissions tests.
09-25-15, 04:18 PM
#155
Tesla CEO Elon Musk on VW Scandal
Tesla CEO Elon Musk on VW Scandal during his visit to Belgium. At 1.11 in the video: "What Volkswagen is really showing is that we've reached the limit of what's possible with diesel and gasoline. And so the time has come to move to a new generation of technology."
09-25-15, 05:34 PM
#156
Browning could be held accountable by the legal authorities in the USA but any attempts by VW would be just finger-pointing (and hoping that the legal authorities look where the finger is pointed). Unless there is a smoking gun, I doubt that Browning would serve any time or pay any fine. He may have to spend time testifying in any investigations that are conducted but any number of those investigations may be non-criminal investigations that have the purpose of getting to the truth rather than trying to find someone to hang.
EDIT: As for the comments from TESLA, did we really expect the marketer of electric cars to say anything else? The only thing he might have added is "and we're having huge sale prices on 2015 Teslas, so rush right out to your dealer tonight".
Last edited by roadbike56; 09-25-15 at 05:44 PM.
09-25-15, 06:19 PM
#157
You have wisdom beyond your years. That's exactly how it will work. My point was, some think that once he leaves, he can not be held liable, and that's not correct. He is accountable for his actions while at VW. However, if he cooperates with the investigation, which he almost certainly will, they'll interview him, probably more than once and that will be the end of it for him. His punishment will be viewed as his losing a nice position at VW.
EDIT: As for the comments from TESLA, did we really expect the marketer of electric cars to say anything else? The only thing he might have added is "and we're having huge sale prices on 2015 Teslas, so rush right out to your dealer tonight".
EDIT: As for the comments from TESLA, did we really expect the marketer of electric cars to say anything else? The only thing he might have added is "and we're having huge sale prices on 2015 Teslas, so rush right out to your dealer tonight".
not so sure about that... US has been jailing cartel/monopoly/price fixing auto execs for past few years, all of them foreign. This seems like a bigger offense.
09-25-15, 07:08 PM
#158
Lexus Test Driver
Your dismissal from a company just means VW does not have any obligations to pay for your legal fees. Browning is still open to class action from people. Around the world possibly. Ouch. That will take an army of lawyers he has to pay for out of his own pocket.
09-25-15, 08:59 PM
#159
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
BMW AG fell as much as 9.3 percent in Frankfurt after a German magazine reported that the X3 xDrive 20d sport utility vehicle emitted as much as 11 times the European limit for air pollution in a road test, adding to concern that the investigation weighing on Volkswagen AG may spread to other manufacturers.
09-25-15, 10:01 PM
#160
Lexus Test Driver
09-26-15, 06:45 AM
#161
They basically have much lower speeds, temps are between 20 and 30c, they can tape out any holes in the car (around doors, etc) for better aero, they run on slick tires and slick test track, etc, etc.
In any case, 11x is during real life conditions that the lab test in the EU replicates poorly. Hence, smaller diesels in Europe do not have to adblue/SCR device at all to pass Euro VI.
And also - 11x is basically Euro III levels which is supposed to be awful, lol
09-26-15, 11:36 AM
#162
Pole Position
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09-26-15, 12:18 PM
#163
this all has been swept under the rug until this happened... let hope something positive comes out of it.
My best buddy got 520d that i recommended to him and he sincerily believed he will be getting fuel consumption around 50 MPG (52 MPG official for his car)... he is getting 30 MPG and thats very good result for such large car but of course he is dissapointed since he didnt expect 22 MPG difference.... thats how horrible EU NEDC test cycle is.
Under EPA, it would likely get low 30's mpg and thats not far off from 30.
09-26-15, 02:15 PM
#164
See I thought the reason the European fuel economy numbers are so much higher is they use the much larger imperial gallon(4.5 liters) vs the US gallon(3.7 and some change liters)
09-26-15, 04:32 PM
#165
So for instance, 520d 8AT is supposed to get 52 MPG US. 328d with same engine is rated 37 MPG vy EPA, so likely "528d" would be rated 34-36 MPG by EPA. Thats a lot closer to realistic consumption than 52 MPG.
Diesels are not only ones, biggest hit is by new 3cly turbos that get worst consumption than 4cly turbos in real life (at least according to every comparo I have read so far) but they are better rated by EU cycle.
For instance, Auto Bild had a test for small petrols few months back, 1 series, A3, Golf and Mazda 3 with 2.0l engine.... 1 series with new 3cly turbo had worst fuel economy and Mazda 3 with 2.0l engine had the best. Mind boggling.
Up until last week nobody cared about discrepancies in test results, German university has published test results about NOx values in real life being up to 11x worse (which is then worse than standards that were in place 15 years ago), and nobody cared. This might shake things up, hopefully.
It seems like right now, emissions testing is done seprately than fuel consumption testing... thats just ridicilous. They should test it together at the same time, that way this particular issue would never happen.
However, auto lobbying is very present in Europe, and everything that can even slightly touch manufacturers get delayed... ever since 2008, manufacturers have been losing billions in Europe so it is very fragile market there and politicians are aware of possibilities for factories to be closed.