tex2670

I think it's totally fair for people to be skeptical of Chrysler; not only have we heard this story before, but we've heard it from Chrysler, and we've heard it since the Fiat merger.

The 200 may be a home run--and fantastic if it is. But if Chrysler dealers are going to try and sell the car for as much as a competitive car with a proven track record, they are going to struggle.

Hyundai realized they needed something to convince customers to take a chance on a car with a bad reputation--and they started loading the car with features you couldn't get from competitors, at or below the price point of the class leaders. And now, Hyundai is a class leader in certain classes. BUT it took a lot of time to get there. Look at the new Santa Fe 7 passenger version--it replaces the Veracruz, which was decent, but by no means a bench mark. But Consumer Reports now considers the Santa Fe to be one of the class leaders. Keep in mind that it debuted a full 10 model years after the Pilot first came out (which, at the time, was, IMO, the class leader).

Henry2024

I remember all the excitement and the hoopla over the Dodge/Plymouth Neon too. There were lots of praises for the Intrepid too in the beginning.

mmarshall

Not from Consumer Reports, there wasn't. They knew Chrysler's history. But even CR is giving Chrysler products generally good marks now....though they acknowledge that the Jeep Grand Cherokee still has some reliability problems.

mmarshall

Good post. I agree with most of it.....but, even beyond that, I see most Chrysler products, today, as having shed the old mantra of crapiness. Among those products, perhaps only the Jeep Compass, even with its noticeably-improved interior, retains a noticeable link to the old Chrysler that we loved to pan. That vehicle simply needs to be dropped, period, like its sister Dodge Caliber was. IMO, the Compass was a marketing error from Jeep to start with...a FWD compact car-based hatchback with a Jeep grille on it, which many people found laughable. The Jeep Grand Cherokee has been completely transformed into a very impressive vehicle, but still, according to Consumer Reports, has a worse-than-average reliability rating....which is not necessarily the case for other Chrysler products.

FrankReynoldsCPA

Pretty sure they are dropping the Compass and the Patriot in favor of a single newer vehicle.

And my former roommate has a Caliber. That thing is definitely a monument to old Chrysler. He's driven the wheels off of it several times, literally. They keep coming off.

Tantrix

there's like 8 of them here with an average 5000 off msrp. if they couldn't keep em off the lot they wouldn't be going for that deep of a discount.

http://www.hbchryslerdodgejeepram.co...ler&model=200&

Tantrix

chrysler brand or whatevers, this design will not be able to compete against it's competitors such as the ford fusion, altima, optima, sonata, mazda6.

this design is very lacking

Tantrix

I'm curious how a car company that approves this design can continue business.

the car's value drops below the cost of production once the car is purchased. How is this even a viable business model. I'd be dead broke if I ran my businesses like that.

TangoRed

Just as I suspected. Tantrix, do you realize that the ones with $5k off are previous generation models? You know, the ones that were notorious for having $5k on the hood all day and night.

Did you also notice that the 2015 models they have on the lot are all the high-priced V6 models? Did you know that V6, highly optioned models of family cars typically carry higher incentives than their I4 counterparts?

When I said the new 2015 models aren't hitting the dealers yet in full numbers, this is what I mean. The more moderately optioned, volume I4 models are only sparsely delivered at this very moment. Clearly you refuse to assign this new 2015 model any credit whatsoever, despite its merit.

mmarshall

It shouldn't affect the factory, though, if the car is sold. When the car is first sold brand-new, Chrysler itself will probably get whatever the car's base price is....minus any rebates. The dealer pays the factory what the official invoice is (not necessarily what the dealer SAYS is the invoice in commercials). Then, if the residual value drops sharply after that from strong depreciation, the factory won't take a hit...it will be whoever bought the car new, or the dealership, if it has sit on the lot for too long and not sold.

Now, with a lease, it may be a different matter. The factory is more at risk because lease payments are set by ESTIMATED depreciation over the lease-period. If the car depreciates more then that, and the factory or dealership loses money on that, then it's not on the customer...he or she won't take a bath. Nissan had some well-publicized trouble from that several years ago.

mmarshall

BTW...the new 2015 200 is at local dealerships now. While we had some debate earlier here in this thread about the new 200's size/price class and just which cars it competes against, the base price is surprisingly low...lower then even the physically smaller Buick Verano. I conceded, earlier in this thread, that the new 200, size-wise, would compete with cars one size up from my Verano rather than with the Verano/ILX/Dart group. But, in actuality, the new 200's base price is so low ($21,700 to start) that I think I'll go take a look at it...not necessarily as a potential purchase, but just to check it out. If Chrysler can deliver a well-done mid-size sedan at this price, it will really be an accomplishment.

Don't be surprised if I do a write-up or partial/full review myself.

FrankReynoldsCPA

Do you have figures for the cost of production that we're not privy to?

I imagine Chrysler is still making profit. I think all of the automakers mark the cars up enough in order to have incentives available as a marketing tool.

Just be honest, you've got a chip in your shoulder for whatever reason and you don't like the idea of Chrysler building a nice car.

AJL0365

I work for a Chrysler dealership and we have had the 200s on the lot for at lease a month now and not one has been sold

mmarshall

Did anyone even bother to test-drive them? (or don't you know)? I looked at one today, and had a generally favorable impression (in fact, I'm starting to write it up now).

I suspect that, like many people were with Hyundai and Kia 10 years ago, the customers at your shop still have their mind in the past, on the old-rental-car 200 (which admittedly was unimpressive), and didn't even bother to check the new one out. That's a problem....when many people, based on the past, THINK they know it all...but actually DON'T.

AJL0365

They all just sit in the same place. We have a employee that is looking to purchase one but I have seen one customer drive it for like a test drive but didn't but it. I know they didn't buy it once because it was the one on display and it was back in the same place like thirty minutes later.

They have gotten expensive compared to the previous version. The most expensive one I have been in was 33k without sunroof.