Personal Review: Ford Escape vs. Honda CR-V vs. Mazda CX-5 vs. Toyota Rav4
06-05-13, 10:03 AM
#31
Thanks, Paul! This is the first new car I've ever purchased and even going into it, I was dreading the sales process based on familiar stereotypes of sleazy salespeople. Every single person that I worked with at Ford, Honda, Mazda and Toyota was truly awesome. No pressure, easy going and laid back, and also very helpful. Once my Toyota guy realized that I was not buying anything on the lot or currently in their inventory, he was happy to help me build the car exactly as I wanted. They also gave me a price that was competitive with the CX-5 and treated me professionally through the whole transaction. Overall, I have nothing but good things to say about each of the dealers I visited.
Gas is a big part of it, but as I mentioned above, I'd like to worry less about curbing wheels, damaging front lips and side skirts...and the new technology that's in cars is worlds beyond what is available in my GS.
Congrats!! When you guys get it, put up some pics. I'd love to see the car!
Prius would not even remotely fit my needs lol. None of these CUVs are fast, but the Toyota and the Mazda are a lot of fun to drive, in addition to being pretty fuel efficient. I also want the AWD and ground clearance for trips to our mountain home.
Bingo! It was time
Agree. The Rav and CX both have their pros and cons, but IMO, both are also head and shoulders above the CR-V. For another buyer, who is just looking for a nice interior and a smooth ride, the CR-V is a fine choice, but even then, IMO, at least the others have a little character. Honda resale and reliability are selling points for some people I guess.
Also, it's worth noting that it was immediately obvious that the CR-V was the only one I tested with a 5AT. The others were quick to up and downshift with 6ATs, but the CR-V was holding gears and droning a bit in certain situations.
It really was a big part of the decision. Right now my GS is burning through about 1/4 tank a day. Highway speeds here average ~80mph...not kind to a high revving I6 with a 5AT.
Gas is a big part of it, but as I mentioned above, I'd like to worry less about curbing wheels, damaging front lips and side skirts...and the new technology that's in cars is worlds beyond what is available in my GS.
Congrats!! When you guys get it, put up some pics. I'd love to see the car!
Prius would not even remotely fit my needs lol. None of these CUVs are fast, but the Toyota and the Mazda are a lot of fun to drive, in addition to being pretty fuel efficient. I also want the AWD and ground clearance for trips to our mountain home.
Bingo! It was time
Agree. The Rav and CX both have their pros and cons, but IMO, both are also head and shoulders above the CR-V. For another buyer, who is just looking for a nice interior and a smooth ride, the CR-V is a fine choice, but even then, IMO, at least the others have a little character. Honda resale and reliability are selling points for some people I guess.
Also, it's worth noting that it was immediately obvious that the CR-V was the only one I tested with a 5AT. The others were quick to up and downshift with 6ATs, but the CR-V was holding gears and droning a bit in certain situations.
It really was a big part of the decision. Right now my GS is burning through about 1/4 tank a day. Highway speeds here average ~80mph...not kind to a high revving I6 with a 5AT.
But a friendly advice, if MPG is really a big concern to you, you should really look into what kind of MPG that RAV4 get in "your" driving condition at 80 mph. Real world owner's reporting their MPG is not reliable, those guys who are bragging about their MPG are all hypermiling at 60 mph. MPG dramatically decreases at 80 mph for a high profile CUV, your GS is more aerodynamically efficient at high speed.
Enjoy your new car
Last edited by BNR34; 06-05-13 at 10:11 AM.
06-05-13, 10:33 AM
#32
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
06-05-13, 11:54 AM
#33
it's all good MP, was just playing (about starbucks), and you already said it was just time to get something newer and not primarily about mpg or math!
yeah, car tech marches on, few vehicles age well. and welcome the 'boring car' team. like you said, no worries about rims and curbs etc... a 'utility' vehicle is liberating in many ways! when i had the ute AND a miata, it was kinda the best of both worlds, one for work, one for play. had to bag the miata (divorce fall-out), but i'll be back with a fun car soon... meanwhile, the exploder keeps on tickin'... got a few dings, etc., but i don't care. 
wish it was an lx570 or cayenne - that would be sweet... but maybe my ute replacement will be a rav4 or cx-5 or something, who knows...
look forward to your updates! when you take delivery?
yeah, car tech marches on, few vehicles age well. and welcome the 'boring car' team.
like you said, no worries about rims and curbs etc... a 'utility' vehicle is liberating in many ways! when i had the ute AND a miata, it was kinda the best of both worlds, one for work, one for play. had to bag the miata (divorce fall-out), but i'll be back with a fun car soon... meanwhile, the exploder keeps on tickin'... got a few dings, etc., but i don't care. wish it was an lx570 or cayenne - that would be sweet... but maybe my ute replacement will be a rav4 or cx-5 or something, who knows...look forward to your updates! when you take delivery?
Delivery should be mid July, so I have a few weeks to count down. I'll put up some pics when it's delivered!
I wanted an fully loaded Outback but the wife loved her last generation CR-V and really wanted another one even after looking at the '13 RAV.Her car,her choice..
I will say the new generation CR-V is much better in everything over the last generation CR-V.Except for the lockout Nav.
Good luck with the RAV.
I will say the new generation CR-V is much better in everything over the last generation CR-V.Except for the lockout Nav.
Good luck with the RAV.
. CR-V is great, and I am glad you guys are enjoying it!Excellent review/comparison, and well-thought out. A number of your conclusions agree with what I myself noticed about these vehicles. And congratulations on the RAV-4 purchase.
I got one or two brief questions, though. You've already explained why you didn't include the Forester (I'm not terribly wild about its new design myself), but did you look at the Mitsubishi Outlander?....... (assuming there is a dealer near you...a sparse dealer network is one of Mitsubishi's problems). The Outlander woud probably go out the door for a good price, given the generally low demand for it....the question is if it would have been acceptable to you. And the Chevy Equinox might also have been worth checking out....GM is doing some nice stuff nowadays, though the recently-introduced Buick Encore did not terribly impress me (see my recent review of it).
BTW......given the specific vehiclesyou posted, I myself probably would have chosen the CR-V, based on ride-comfort, vehicle assembly/build quality, and potential long-term reliability.....with the other four potentially all tied for second place.
One thing you apparantly didn't mention about the Escape (though, being a single guy, it might not make much difference if you don't often carry people in back) is the simply awful rear seat, which is little more than a super-thinly-padded park-bench. I'd have the inmates down at Guantanamo sit on it if we were trying to get some intelligence out of them.
A number of your conclusions agree with what I myself noticed about these vehicles. And congratulations on the RAV-4 purchase. I got one or two brief questions, though. You've already explained why you didn't include the Forester (I'm not terribly wild about its new design myself), but did you look at the Mitsubishi Outlander?....... (assuming there is a dealer near you...a sparse dealer network is one of Mitsubishi's problems). The Outlander woud probably go out the door for a good price, given the generally low demand for it....the question is if it would have been acceptable to you. And the Chevy Equinox might also have been worth checking out....GM is doing some nice stuff nowadays, though the recently-introduced Buick Encore did not terribly impress me (see my recent review of it).
BTW......given the specific vehiclesyou posted, I myself probably would have chosen the CR-V, based on ride-comfort, vehicle assembly/build quality, and potential long-term reliability.....with the other four potentially all tied for second place.
One thing you apparantly didn't mention about the Escape (though, being a single guy, it might not make much difference if you don't often carry people in back) is the simply awful rear seat, which is little more than a super-thinly-padded park-bench. I'd have the inmates down at Guantanamo sit on it if we were trying to get some intelligence out of them.
I did not consider the Outlander, as I am just generally disinterested in Mitsubishi. I would be surprised if they were even still in the U.S. in the next year or so, so I don't want to buy a car and then have the brand disappear from the market.I think the Equinox was more competitive a few years ago, but in my experience, these four have really eclipsed GM's efforts in the small/entry level CUV category. Same goes for the Terrain and Encore.
I would not blame you for going with the CR-V...it's a great option, and I know that you prioritize comfort and convenience. The good news is that there is something for everyone in this class
I actually did not check out the Escape's rear seat. I ventured to the Ford dealership alone and after my general dislike for the dashboard and front layout, did not take the time to sit in the passenger and rear seats. I am not horribly surprised to read that though...I found the Escape to be generally lacking in interior quality vs. the other three. Hopefully Ford addresses some of these issues...not that they need to - it's selling like crazy!
06-05-13, 12:16 PM
#35
You guys are really fixed on this MPG thing...
MPG is one consideration on a new car, albeit an important one. If I can get 27-28 MPG in the Rav4, I will be happy with that. That's a solid ~10+ MPG more than I get in the GS. Looking at the numbers that owners are getting, the results seem to be as follows:
65 - 70 mph: 31 - 33 MPG
70 - 75 mph: 29 - 31 MPG
75 - 80 mph: 27 - 30 MPG
I'm also getting more space, completely new technology, lower maintenance and operating costs, more safety, more peace of mind with city driving (curbs and such), some minor offroad ability (nice for our mountain home in the winter) etc.
MPG is one consideration on a new car, albeit an important one. If I can get 27-28 MPG in the Rav4, I will be happy with that. That's a solid ~10+ MPG more than I get in the GS. Looking at the numbers that owners are getting, the results seem to be as follows:
65 - 70 mph: 31 - 33 MPG
70 - 75 mph: 29 - 31 MPG
75 - 80 mph: 27 - 30 MPG
I'm also getting more space, completely new technology, lower maintenance and operating costs, more safety, more peace of mind with city driving (curbs and such), some minor offroad ability (nice for our mountain home in the winter) etc.
Last edited by MPLexus301; 06-05-13 at 12:22 PM.
06-05-13, 12:24 PM
#36
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On the highway at ~80mph, the Rav4 is revving at about 2,100 RPMs. The GS is revving at about 3,100 RPMs. As much as I love the 2JZ, with a 5AT, it absolutely inhales gas anything above about 65 mph. If they had put a 6AT in there, it would make a huge difference, but that is a high revving engine that is in bad need of an extra gear for modern highway driving. Another plus is that the Rav4 takes regular and the GS has a thirst for premium.
Right now I am going from a full tank to the fuel light being on (fill ups are about 16.5 gallons usually) every 4-5 days. For a 70 mile commute, 4-5 days a week, that means the car is returning around 20 mpg. If the Rav4 cannot considerably improve on that number, I will be shocked. From what I have seen, most owners are reporting 27-32mpg for the AWD models, often a bit above what the sticker predicts.
Right now I am going from a full tank to the fuel light being on (fill ups are about 16.5 gallons usually) every 4-5 days. For a 70 mile commute, 4-5 days a week, that means the car is returning around 20 mpg. If the Rav4 cannot considerably improve on that number, I will be shocked. From what I have seen, most owners are reporting 27-32mpg for the AWD models, often a bit above what the sticker predicts.
Your GS, like my old 1999 Maxima, were built in a different era long before the insane fuel prices we have today. My Maxima was a 5MT and turned 2500 rpm at just 60. So at highway speeds it was turning in the mid-3000 rpm range, for hours. It still returned pretty reasonable fuel economy for its day, upper-20's highway, but yes required premium fuel. There's certainly no sense in pissing money down the drain on too much gas, especially if you had more than a few secondary considerations for buying a car. Loved the instant repsonsiveness and power of a 3000 rpm top highway gear when upper-20 MPG was good enough, but those days are long gone.
06-05-13, 12:26 PM
#38
Toyota called today to tell me that I'll be getting the Blind Spot Monitor with Rear Cross Traffic Alert, if I want the JBL audio package. This is one annoyance with packages, but they build the Entune, Nav and JBL package together with the BSM option, so I get both or none.
I really want the JBL sound system and was going back and forth on the BSM, so I am not horribly annoyed by this news. I told them this was not in my plans and that I wanted the BSM at invoice price...and they agreed. Still staying under $30k...barely, and the car now has every option available. I feel a tad spoiled, but hey - it's my money, I guess.
I really want the JBL sound system and was going back and forth on the BSM, so I am not horribly annoyed by this news. I told them this was not in my plans and that I wanted the BSM at invoice price...and they agreed
. Still staying under $30k...barely, and the car now has every option available. I feel a tad spoiled, but hey - it's my money, I guess.
06-05-13, 12:32 PM
#39
Congrats on thew new car and very nice review. Yeah the lesser trim models look terrible to me, but I saw one fully loaded and in a good color and it looked pretty nice.
Your GS, like my old 1999 Maxima, were built in a different era long before the insane fuel prices we have today. My Maxima was a 5MT and turned 2500 rpm at just 60. So at highway speeds it was turning in the mid-3000 rpm range, for hours. It still returned pretty reasonable fuel economy for its day, upper-20's highway, but yes required premium fuel. There's certainly no sense in pissing money down the drain on too much gas, especially if you had more than a few secondary considerations for buying a car. Loved the instant repsonsiveness and power of a 3000 rpm top highway gear when upper-20 MPG was good enough, but those days are long gone.
Your GS, like my old 1999 Maxima, were built in a different era long before the insane fuel prices we have today. My Maxima was a 5MT and turned 2500 rpm at just 60. So at highway speeds it was turning in the mid-3000 rpm range, for hours. It still returned pretty reasonable fuel economy for its day, upper-20's highway, but yes required premium fuel. There's certainly no sense in pissing money down the drain on too much gas, especially if you had more than a few secondary considerations for buying a car. Loved the instant repsonsiveness and power of a 3000 rpm top highway gear when upper-20 MPG was good enough, but those days are long gone.
Thanks very much! Appreciate the kind words.
06-05-13, 05:21 PM
#41
You guys are really fixed on this MPG thing...
MPG is one consideration on a new car, albeit an important one. If I can get 27-28 MPG in the Rav4, I will be happy with that. That's a solid ~10+ MPG more than I get in the GS. Looking at the numbers that owners are getting, the results seem to be as follows:
65 - 70 mph: 31 - 33 MPG
70 - 75 mph: 29 - 31 MPG
75 - 80 mph: 27 - 30 MPG
I'm also getting more space, completely new technology, lower maintenance and operating costs, more safety, more peace of mind with city driving (curbs and such), some minor offroad ability (nice for our mountain home in the winter) etc.
MPG is one consideration on a new car, albeit an important one. If I can get 27-28 MPG in the Rav4, I will be happy with that. That's a solid ~10+ MPG more than I get in the GS. Looking at the numbers that owners are getting, the results seem to be as follows:
65 - 70 mph: 31 - 33 MPG
70 - 75 mph: 29 - 31 MPG
75 - 80 mph: 27 - 30 MPG
I'm also getting more space, completely new technology, lower maintenance and operating costs, more safety, more peace of mind with city driving (curbs and such), some minor offroad ability (nice for our mountain home in the winter) etc.
If you said you feel your GS is old school, you want a new car for all the new stuff, then no one will mention the MPG thing
06-05-13, 08:26 PM
#42
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
ok, i think we know MP's wants are a combination of new-car-itis and wanting better fuel economy. nothing wrong with that.
and wanting better fuel economy. nothing wrong with that.
08-25-13, 04:42 PM
#44
Just a quick update:
Got the car on 7/28 and have been loving it ever since. Everyone told me I didn't need the AWD living in GA, but it's never rained as much as it has this summer and the extra stability and security of AWD in pouring, torrential rain is like a black and white difference. The car does not skid, swerve, twitch...nothing. I now see why AWD is one of the most popular options in the marketplace, and I'm not sure I'd ever want another DD without it. Whether standing water, pouring rain, mud or gravel and sand, the Rav4 has handled everything in stride so far.
And for those naysaying on MPG...
Hwy average: 28.7 MPG, so about 10-11 MPG better than the GS
Combined average: 25.5 MPG, so about 9-10 MPG better than the GS
The car has 2,400 miles on it now, so I expect that MPG will improve a bit as I get closer to 5k miles.
Other brief notes:
- The car looks tiny on the outside, but there is a misleading amount of interior room. 4 people and their gear/luggage fit very comfortably.
- In terms of power, I would say that the car feels relatively similar to an IS 250 - adequate, peppy and spritely around town, but a little lacking on the highway. I'd like another 40-50 horsepower, but wouldn't we all?
- Power lift gate is an amazing feature. Never thought it would be a huge deal, but now I rely on it all the time.
- Blind Spot Monitor is another feature that I thought, "meh" about, but it was bundled with the JBL so I had to get it. Now, I love it and would never get another car without it. Great feature.
- "SPORT" mode makes a pretty noticeable difference - the steering is noticeably tighter, the car holds gears longer and is quick to downshift for better acceleration. Fun when the pavement starts to twist, but it does eat into MPG a bit.
- The JBL system is rather weak and I wish it was stronger for what it costs. Pitchy, and the bass leaves so much to be desired.
- SofTex/Pleather interior is awesome. I legitimately like it more than leather, because it doesn't wear or wrinkle like traditional leather.
- Toyota has set the audio to default to bluetooth streaming audio, so every time I get in the car, it overrides iPod, FM, XM, etc. and opens BTSA. VERY annoying. I am asking the dealership to check it out at my next service.
- Car is extremely quiet and comfortable on the road. All in all, it drives very comparably to the 2RX350 with 18" wheels, but a tad firmer and sportier.
- Favorite feature: AWD
Got the car on 7/28 and have been loving it ever since. Everyone told me I didn't need the AWD living in GA, but it's never rained as much as it has this summer and the extra stability and security of AWD in pouring, torrential rain is like a black and white difference. The car does not skid, swerve, twitch...nothing. I now see why AWD is one of the most popular options in the marketplace, and I'm not sure I'd ever want another DD without it. Whether standing water, pouring rain, mud or gravel and sand, the Rav4 has handled everything in stride so far.
And for those naysaying on MPG...
Hwy average: 28.7 MPG, so about 10-11 MPG better than the GS
Combined average: 25.5 MPG, so about 9-10 MPG better than the GS
The car has 2,400 miles on it now, so I expect that MPG will improve a bit as I get closer to 5k miles.
Other brief notes:
- The car looks tiny on the outside, but there is a misleading amount of interior room. 4 people and their gear/luggage fit very comfortably.
- In terms of power, I would say that the car feels relatively similar to an IS 250 - adequate, peppy and spritely around town, but a little lacking on the highway. I'd like another 40-50 horsepower, but wouldn't we all?
- Power lift gate is an amazing feature. Never thought it would be a huge deal, but now I rely on it all the time.
- Blind Spot Monitor is another feature that I thought, "meh" about, but it was bundled with the JBL so I had to get it. Now, I love it and would never get another car without it. Great feature.
- "SPORT" mode makes a pretty noticeable difference - the steering is noticeably tighter, the car holds gears longer and is quick to downshift for better acceleration. Fun when the pavement starts to twist, but it does eat into MPG a bit.
- The JBL system is rather weak and I wish it was stronger for what it costs. Pitchy, and the bass leaves so much to be desired.
- SofTex/Pleather interior is awesome. I legitimately like it more than leather, because it doesn't wear or wrinkle like traditional leather.
- Toyota has set the audio to default to bluetooth streaming audio, so every time I get in the car, it overrides iPod, FM, XM, etc. and opens BTSA. VERY annoying. I am asking the dealership to check it out at my next service.
- Car is extremely quiet and comfortable on the road. All in all, it drives very comparably to the 2RX350 with 18" wheels, but a tad firmer and sportier.
- Favorite feature: AWD
Last edited by MPLexus301; 08-25-13 at 08:08 PM.