We like the cars, why don't we love Hyundai?
10-27-11, 08:03 PM
#1
executive matchup
Thread Starter
We like the cars, why don't we love Hyundai?
Its cars are already major league, now Hyundai wants its brand image to reflect that. In Canada, it already has a head start
Seoul, South Korea — For a pair of such newbies on the world scene, Canada and Hyundai go back a long ways together. The Korean company only came into existence as an automaker in 1967 — coincidentally, exactly one century after a collection of frontier colonies coalesced into the freshly minted dominion of Canada.
It took another nine years before Hyundai first exported its own proprietary car, the Pony, to Ecuador. But Canada really put Hyundai exports on the map: in 1985, in only its second year here, the Pony became the top-selling car in Canada. Hyundai Canada sold 51,000 Ponys and 79,000 cars altogether.
It was too much, too soon. Other automakers accused the Koreans of dumping the Pony at below cost. Buyers soon discovered that when it comes to quality, you get what you pay for. By decade's end, Hyundai's sales were in freefall.
No matter. Hyundai had its eyes on a prize bigger than just Canada's puny market. In 1986 it entered the U.S., and to serve that market Hyundai soon opened its first overseas transplant — in Bromont, Quebec. The plant's inaugural product was the first-generation Sonata sedan.
That didn't end well, either. Between persistent quality issues, the early-'90s recession, and Chrysler's withdrawal from a joint-venture deal, Bromont was mothballed after four years. In 1996, Hyundai's Canadian sales bottomed out at just over 17,000.
But the Koreans are nothing if not persistent, and Hyundai's rebound has been breathtaking. Two decades ago, its powertrains were all built under licence from Mitsubishi. Today the company not only has a rich portfolio of in-house advanced engines and transmissions, it even licenses some of its engine technology back to Mitsubishi.
There is a contract to supply automatic transmissions to Chrysler. While some automakers are adopting bought-in eight-speed transmissions, Hyundai has an eight-speed of its own design — and is working on a 10-speed.
In 2009 Hyundai not only cornered both the Canadian AJAC and North American Car of the Year awards, it did so with the Genesis, Hyundai's first crack at the luxury segment in North America. The latest 5.0-litre version of the Genesis Tau V8 has been named to the 2011 Ward's 10 Best Engines List. Sales in Canada are on track to top 120,000 in 2011.
While all these product transformations were underway, Hyundai production was going global. Beyond claiming the world's single largest auto-assembly facility at home in Ulsan, Hyundai is now building cars in Turkey, Russia, the Czech Republic, the U.S.A., India (two plants), China (two, with a third on the way) and soon in Brazil. That's in addition to design and technical centres in most of the same regions.
In 2010, for the first time, Hyundai built more cars abroad than in Korea (3.62 million in total).
Quantity is one thing, quality is something else. In 2000 Hyundai publicly acknowledged it had focused too much on production, and not enough on quality. The resulting Quality Management Initiative launched in 2000 was described by one insider as a "long hard slog." But it hardly looked that way from the outside. Already by 2004 Hyundai was scoring better than industry average in the benchmark J.D. Power Initial Quality Study; by 2008, it was also outperforming the industry in J.D. Power's Dependability study of vehicles after three years of ownership.
Quality aside, Hyundai's products have made huge strides in their intrinsic desirability. Knock-'em-dead design, cutting-edge powertrains and immaculate interior decor have propelled the Elantra compact and Sonata midsizer from also-rans to sales leadership contenders in their segments.
So much achieved in so little time, yet still Hyundai wants more. Could the cars be better still? Sure. They're still not quite there yet on chassis development. Discerning drivers would like better steering feel; passengers would appreciate better isolation from rough pavement. But that'll come. And besides, those nuts-and-bolts product attributes are not what's leaving Hyundai feeling unfulfilled.
What Hyundai really wants is to be loved. This isn't about engineering and design, this is about the smoke-and-mirrors intangibles of brand image. For all that the public may acknowledge and admire individual Hyundai vehicles, the company feels there is still a disconnect between the goodness of its products, and the perceived desirability of its brand.
In an independent study of brand value, Hyundai is edging up slowly and is now 61st among all brands — between Adidas and KFC — up from 69th two years ago. But it remains stalled at eighth among automakers (Toyota, in 11th overall, was the top auto brand).
Of course Hyundai will never usurp the patriarchal prestige of automotive pioneer like Mercedes-Benz, or the ultimate-driving-machine street cred of BMW. And even if you add in the numbers from its sister company Kia, you won't hear Hyundai setting sales goals in terms of market share or world ranking.
Cars like the new i40 which put design and technology first are helping transform the brand's image
Maybe, however, those things will follow, if Hyundai can realise its dream — of becoming the most loved automotive brand. (It may have to elbow aside Honda and Volkswagen, though, to get there.)
"We're in no hurry to expand, and we worked so hard to get quality up that we will jealously guard it," says Frank Ahrens, a jovial American who directs Hyundai's global PR in Seoul. "We want to be the best loved brand." Hyundai wants people to be drawn to the brand, not just to a particular car; to win sales by competing "brand to brand, not just on price."
Elevating its brand would allow Hyundai "to price appropriately for the premium value we offer," Ahrens continues.
Premium? Hyundai? Well yes, but not in the way you think. Call it modern premium — "the democratisation of technology — bringing premium features downmarket and raising the brand up while maintaining quality," explains Ahrens. Examples: rear seat heaters available on the Elantra compact; a rear-view camera standard on the base-model (sub-$20k) Veloster.
The way Hyundai sees it, 60 per cent of brand image is based on the product itself. That is always No.1. The other 40 per cent is from non-product areas like communications, personal interaction with customers in the dealerships, and so on. With the product now on track, Hyundai is launching a new global strategy to elevate the non-product areas. For the first time in its history, the automaker is doing brand advertising "without a car attached."
One aspect of the strategy — "no more shabby showrooms" — won't be happening in Canada ... but only because it has already been done. The Canadian arm has already overhauled the physical infrastructure of its dealer network.
Other aspects of the strategy are still being worked out. There is a concept for stores that are not necessarily product stores, but pure "brand experience" stores.
If that all sounds a bit fuzzy, in Canada at least it may not matter. Another definition of "modern premium," says Hyundai Canada spokesman Chad Heard, is consumers moving away from conspicuous consumption and moving towards the prestige of making an intelligent purchase. How very Canadian. With Hyundai's market share in Canada already higher than in any other mature market outside Korea, it looks like Canada is once again a lead player in the evolution of Hyundai.
link: http://autos.ca.msn.com/editors-pick...e-love-hyundai
Seoul, South Korea — For a pair of such newbies on the world scene, Canada and Hyundai go back a long ways together. The Korean company only came into existence as an automaker in 1967 — coincidentally, exactly one century after a collection of frontier colonies coalesced into the freshly minted dominion of Canada.
It took another nine years before Hyundai first exported its own proprietary car, the Pony, to Ecuador. But Canada really put Hyundai exports on the map: in 1985, in only its second year here, the Pony became the top-selling car in Canada. Hyundai Canada sold 51,000 Ponys and 79,000 cars altogether.
It was too much, too soon. Other automakers accused the Koreans of dumping the Pony at below cost. Buyers soon discovered that when it comes to quality, you get what you pay for. By decade's end, Hyundai's sales were in freefall.
No matter. Hyundai had its eyes on a prize bigger than just Canada's puny market. In 1986 it entered the U.S., and to serve that market Hyundai soon opened its first overseas transplant — in Bromont, Quebec. The plant's inaugural product was the first-generation Sonata sedan.
That didn't end well, either. Between persistent quality issues, the early-'90s recession, and Chrysler's withdrawal from a joint-venture deal, Bromont was mothballed after four years. In 1996, Hyundai's Canadian sales bottomed out at just over 17,000.
But the Koreans are nothing if not persistent, and Hyundai's rebound has been breathtaking. Two decades ago, its powertrains were all built under licence from Mitsubishi. Today the company not only has a rich portfolio of in-house advanced engines and transmissions, it even licenses some of its engine technology back to Mitsubishi.
There is a contract to supply automatic transmissions to Chrysler. While some automakers are adopting bought-in eight-speed transmissions, Hyundai has an eight-speed of its own design — and is working on a 10-speed.
In 2009 Hyundai not only cornered both the Canadian AJAC and North American Car of the Year awards, it did so with the Genesis, Hyundai's first crack at the luxury segment in North America. The latest 5.0-litre version of the Genesis Tau V8 has been named to the 2011 Ward's 10 Best Engines List. Sales in Canada are on track to top 120,000 in 2011.
While all these product transformations were underway, Hyundai production was going global. Beyond claiming the world's single largest auto-assembly facility at home in Ulsan, Hyundai is now building cars in Turkey, Russia, the Czech Republic, the U.S.A., India (two plants), China (two, with a third on the way) and soon in Brazil. That's in addition to design and technical centres in most of the same regions.
In 2010, for the first time, Hyundai built more cars abroad than in Korea (3.62 million in total).
Quantity is one thing, quality is something else. In 2000 Hyundai publicly acknowledged it had focused too much on production, and not enough on quality. The resulting Quality Management Initiative launched in 2000 was described by one insider as a "long hard slog." But it hardly looked that way from the outside. Already by 2004 Hyundai was scoring better than industry average in the benchmark J.D. Power Initial Quality Study; by 2008, it was also outperforming the industry in J.D. Power's Dependability study of vehicles after three years of ownership.
Quality aside, Hyundai's products have made huge strides in their intrinsic desirability. Knock-'em-dead design, cutting-edge powertrains and immaculate interior decor have propelled the Elantra compact and Sonata midsizer from also-rans to sales leadership contenders in their segments.
So much achieved in so little time, yet still Hyundai wants more. Could the cars be better still? Sure. They're still not quite there yet on chassis development. Discerning drivers would like better steering feel; passengers would appreciate better isolation from rough pavement. But that'll come. And besides, those nuts-and-bolts product attributes are not what's leaving Hyundai feeling unfulfilled.
What Hyundai really wants is to be loved. This isn't about engineering and design, this is about the smoke-and-mirrors intangibles of brand image. For all that the public may acknowledge and admire individual Hyundai vehicles, the company feels there is still a disconnect between the goodness of its products, and the perceived desirability of its brand.
In an independent study of brand value, Hyundai is edging up slowly and is now 61st among all brands — between Adidas and KFC — up from 69th two years ago. But it remains stalled at eighth among automakers (Toyota, in 11th overall, was the top auto brand).
Of course Hyundai will never usurp the patriarchal prestige of automotive pioneer like Mercedes-Benz, or the ultimate-driving-machine street cred of BMW. And even if you add in the numbers from its sister company Kia, you won't hear Hyundai setting sales goals in terms of market share or world ranking.
Cars like the new i40 which put design and technology first are helping transform the brand's image
Maybe, however, those things will follow, if Hyundai can realise its dream — of becoming the most loved automotive brand. (It may have to elbow aside Honda and Volkswagen, though, to get there.)
"We're in no hurry to expand, and we worked so hard to get quality up that we will jealously guard it," says Frank Ahrens, a jovial American who directs Hyundai's global PR in Seoul. "We want to be the best loved brand." Hyundai wants people to be drawn to the brand, not just to a particular car; to win sales by competing "brand to brand, not just on price."
Elevating its brand would allow Hyundai "to price appropriately for the premium value we offer," Ahrens continues.
Premium? Hyundai? Well yes, but not in the way you think. Call it modern premium — "the democratisation of technology — bringing premium features downmarket and raising the brand up while maintaining quality," explains Ahrens. Examples: rear seat heaters available on the Elantra compact; a rear-view camera standard on the base-model (sub-$20k) Veloster.
The way Hyundai sees it, 60 per cent of brand image is based on the product itself. That is always No.1. The other 40 per cent is from non-product areas like communications, personal interaction with customers in the dealerships, and so on. With the product now on track, Hyundai is launching a new global strategy to elevate the non-product areas. For the first time in its history, the automaker is doing brand advertising "without a car attached."
One aspect of the strategy — "no more shabby showrooms" — won't be happening in Canada ... but only because it has already been done. The Canadian arm has already overhauled the physical infrastructure of its dealer network.
Other aspects of the strategy are still being worked out. There is a concept for stores that are not necessarily product stores, but pure "brand experience" stores.
If that all sounds a bit fuzzy, in Canada at least it may not matter. Another definition of "modern premium," says Hyundai Canada spokesman Chad Heard, is consumers moving away from conspicuous consumption and moving towards the prestige of making an intelligent purchase. How very Canadian. With Hyundai's market share in Canada already higher than in any other mature market outside Korea, it looks like Canada is once again a lead player in the evolution of Hyundai.
link: http://autos.ca.msn.com/editors-pick...e-love-hyundai
10-27-11, 08:33 PM
#2
Guest
Posts: n/a
Fluff...thats what its called.
Its hard to love a copy of a copy of a copy. That is the first issue.
Second while Honda/Toyota built reputations for building THE BEST products arguably, for the money, along with a cheaper price, Hyundai while competitive, is rarely the best at anything but wins by being cheaper, offering gimmicks & now flavor of the month styling.
Third for all the Toyota/Honda bashing, all they have managed to do is make their version of Honda/Toyota with some more styling in some cases as of late. They don't drive any better and quality is no better. They have no more enthusiast vehicles than those two. Hyundai is simply another vanilla brand for non enthusiasts who like fluff. Nothing wrong with that.
They don't have any pickups. Toyota pickups are loved by owners and creates loyality, same as GM/Ford etc. They don't have any work horse SUVs, just cute car based ones. If you want a Hyundai/Kia truck, you can't love the brand, you leave it.
Hyundai/Kia were known for no credit/terrible credit brands for people to buy a new car. Its hard to shake that image. To this day people joke about owning one. I don't know anyone with a new one even with all their success.
Hyundai knows since they have such a terrible image to overcome offers things like a 100k warranty and things like "guaranteed trade in value" b/c for decades, their trade in and repeat buyer percentages were horrendous. Its a form of bribery. It gets buyers but doesn't build loyalty and love. It logical, not lustful.
The Veloster seems nice but outside the Genesis Coupe, they don't make any enthusiast vehicles. Toyota/Honda in the 80s/90s when they surged made SEVERAL.
People online was giving Hyundai/Kia tons of kudos and then their marketing dept sends trolls and drones to inundate internet forums shoving the product down peoples throats. That made people start to dislike the product.
As they stated, if your product is good enough, it can speak for itself. They have made great strides. They need to realize they have to build THE BEST product arguably to get people to love it and not rely on gimmicks and fluff.
As stated, their 15 minutes of fame is up.
Oh and while Hyundai/Kia is bought up by Americans, at home, they actually dislike the new styling. In Japan, Toyota/Honda/NIssan/Lexus etc are embraced and then they are sold and succeed overseas. Seems Koreans at home don't like the new products as much as exported countries do.
http://www.autonews.com/article/2011...111009964/1499
The one Hyundai I really like is the Genesis coupe. I think it looks aggressive, interesting and has some nice hardware and kits (R-spec, brembos, etc). It seems to be by far the most interesting product they have and to me it draws lust and love. The R-spec Genesis sedan seems nice on paper. The rest of the lineup to me is as interesting as fapping to Barbara Bush.
Its hard to love a copy of a copy of a copy. That is the first issue.
Second while Honda/Toyota built reputations for building THE BEST products arguably, for the money, along with a cheaper price, Hyundai while competitive, is rarely the best at anything but wins by being cheaper, offering gimmicks & now flavor of the month styling.
Third for all the Toyota/Honda bashing, all they have managed to do is make their version of Honda/Toyota with some more styling in some cases as of late. They don't drive any better and quality is no better. They have no more enthusiast vehicles than those two. Hyundai is simply another vanilla brand for non enthusiasts who like fluff. Nothing wrong with that.
They don't have any pickups. Toyota pickups are loved by owners and creates loyality, same as GM/Ford etc. They don't have any work horse SUVs, just cute car based ones. If you want a Hyundai/Kia truck, you can't love the brand, you leave it.
Hyundai/Kia were known for no credit/terrible credit brands for people to buy a new car. Its hard to shake that image. To this day people joke about owning one. I don't know anyone with a new one even with all their success.
Hyundai knows since they have such a terrible image to overcome offers things like a 100k warranty and things like "guaranteed trade in value" b/c for decades, their trade in and repeat buyer percentages were horrendous. Its a form of bribery. It gets buyers but doesn't build loyalty and love. It logical, not lustful.
The Veloster seems nice but outside the Genesis Coupe, they don't make any enthusiast vehicles. Toyota/Honda in the 80s/90s when they surged made SEVERAL.
People online was giving Hyundai/Kia tons of kudos and then their marketing dept sends trolls and drones to inundate internet forums shoving the product down peoples throats. That made people start to dislike the product.
As they stated, if your product is good enough, it can speak for itself. They have made great strides. They need to realize they have to build THE BEST product arguably to get people to love it and not rely on gimmicks and fluff.
As stated, their 15 minutes of fame is up.
Oh and while Hyundai/Kia is bought up by Americans, at home, they actually dislike the new styling. In Japan, Toyota/Honda/NIssan/Lexus etc are embraced and then they are sold and succeed overseas. Seems Koreans at home don't like the new products as much as exported countries do.
Here, it's head-turning design; at home, Hyundai's Sonata has a problem
Read more: http://www.autonews.com/article/2011...#ixzz1c2j7lkuo
Read more: http://www.autonews.com/article/2011...#ixzz1c2j7lkuo
The one Hyundai I really like is the Genesis coupe. I think it looks aggressive, interesting and has some nice hardware and kits (R-spec, brembos, etc). It seems to be by far the most interesting product they have and to me it draws lust and love. The R-spec Genesis sedan seems nice on paper. The rest of the lineup to me is as interesting as fapping to Barbara Bush.
10-27-11, 10:04 PM
#3
Lexus Champion
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: ca
Posts: 1,979
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Have you even driven the Sonata Limited Turbo? I've owned Lexus, Honda, Toyota, and a Yamaha sport bike, its a good, no GREAT car. I'm not looking for another sports car, I'm lookng for something to tote around my kid, safe, reliable, and looks good inside and out. I would have bought a Camry but I hadone as a rental and the interior was crap and plastically, very American looking and drove like crap compared to a Honda Accord I owned 10 years earlier.
Seriously if you want a sedan I don't know why anyone cross shopping an Accord or Camry would even consider anything but a Sonata.
I think for its target market, value oriented reliable people hauling appliances they have a winner. Win in that department and then as an automaker you can spend money on a sports car, in 10 years I wouldn't be surprised if Hyundai builds the next NSX, at least before Honda does!
Seriously if you want a sedan I don't know why anyone cross shopping an Accord or Camry would even consider anything but a Sonata.
I think for its target market, value oriented reliable people hauling appliances they have a winner. Win in that department and then as an automaker you can spend money on a sports car, in 10 years I wouldn't be surprised if Hyundai builds the next NSX, at least before Honda does!
Last edited by toy4two; 10-27-11 at 10:08 PM.
10-27-11, 10:22 PM
#5
Personally, I think most of the cars they produce are WAY over the top. The proportions of their cars are very disturbing, not attractive or appealing in any way. The only normal looking car they have is the Genesis sedan and coupe.
Less is more... I hope Hyundai understands that at one point. It reminds me of Pontiac in the 90's who thought putting on 15 hood scoops makes the car look better.
Less is more... I hope Hyundai understands that at one point. It reminds me of Pontiac in the 90's who thought putting on 15 hood scoops makes the car look better.
10-27-11, 11:15 PM
#7
Lead Lap
Join Date: May 2011
Location: CA
Posts: 622
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Have you even driven the Sonata Limited Turbo? I've owned Lexus, Honda, Toyota, and a Yamaha sport bike, its a good, no GREAT car. I'm not looking for another sports car, I'm lookng for something to tote around my kid, safe, reliable, and looks good inside and out. I would have bought a Camry but I hadone as a rental and the interior was crap and plastically, very American looking and drove like crap compared to a Honda Accord I owned 10 years earlier.
Seriously if you want a sedan I don't know why anyone cross shopping an Accord or Camry would even consider anything but a Sonata.
I think for its target market, value oriented reliable people hauling appliances they have a winner. Win in that department and then as an automaker you can spend money on a sports car, in 10 years I wouldn't be surprised if Hyundai builds the next NSX, at least before Honda does!
Seriously if you want a sedan I don't know why anyone cross shopping an Accord or Camry would even consider anything but a Sonata.
I think for its target market, value oriented reliable people hauling appliances they have a winner. Win in that department and then as an automaker you can spend money on a sports car, in 10 years I wouldn't be surprised if Hyundai builds the next NSX, at least before Honda does!
Trending Topics
10-27-11, 11:24 PM
#8
Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 12,041
Likes: 0
Received 69 Likes
on
42 Posts
Is the "we" referring to the general public, or is it referring to CL members...?
Because I think we hate Hyundai because they compare themselves to Lexus and how dare they do that
Because I think we hate Hyundai because they compare themselves to Lexus and how dare they do that
10-28-11, 12:49 AM
#10
Lexus Test Driver
I drove one two weeks ago, and was far from impressed. It was buzzy, noisy, and far less refined than a Toyota I4, let alone a V6. Since the Sonata is so heavy, the acceleration was nothing to write home about either. I'll stick to Toyota. The interior and steering were nothing to write home about either, and further reinforced my belief that this car gets a pass based on its looks, but actually driving it tells another story. The '12 XLE V6 Camry I drove before it was a far better car, and could accelerate out of its own way. And the jury is still out on the reliability of Hyundai.
Also 269lb/ft of torque available fairly low in the range would definately give you an "oomph" when you flat-foot.
And before anyone asks, no I'm not a Hyundai fanboy just because i own one. I respect Toyota/Lexus for what they've accomplished.
10-28-11, 05:40 AM
#13
10-28-11, 07:51 AM
#14
Pole Position
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 270
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
To put it simply, some people will never like Hyundai.
As Lexus fans we know the same is true of our beloved brand.
Just as the LFA is poo-pooed by the Euro-only-fanboy set, Hyundai's products will never appeal to those who don't look at them with an open mind.
There are still people who can look at a LS hybrid inside and out and dismissively say: "it's just a fancy Toyota."
I think Hyundai would do well to take the mindset of prior Lexus America VP Denny Clements when he said "There are some people who won't ever desire to buy a Lexus. That's fine." That kind of understanding is needed to avoid unsuccesful attempts at trying to please everyone all the time.
As Lexus fans we know the same is true of our beloved brand.
Just as the LFA is poo-pooed by the Euro-only-fanboy set, Hyundai's products will never appeal to those who don't look at them with an open mind.
There are still people who can look at a LS hybrid inside and out and dismissively say: "it's just a fancy Toyota."
I think Hyundai would do well to take the mindset of prior Lexus America VP Denny Clements when he said "There are some people who won't ever desire to buy a Lexus. That's fine." That kind of understanding is needed to avoid unsuccesful attempts at trying to please everyone all the time.
10-28-11, 08:33 AM
#15
Lexus Fanatic
With one possible exception (the Equus vs. the LS460), the latest-generation of Hyundais are anything BUT parrot-clone styling. In fact, their awkward looks, in many cases, are way out too much for my tastes.