37 mpg Audi A8 Hybrid in the works
08-26-11, 05:40 AM
#20
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I used the wrong words. I apologize.
I meant to say that the figures have been adjusted for the American mpg specifications with "dumbed down". Wrong choice of words. My bad.
I meant to say that the figures have been adjusted for the American mpg specifications with "dumbed down". Wrong choice of words. My bad.
07-09-12, 09:10 AM
#21
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When it comes to the hybrid market, we assume – as most of you probably do as well – that the United States is at the top of the list to get whatever hybrid models an automaker builds. That vision is apparently altering for the Germans, though, as Audi is not bringing this A8 Hybrid to the States, instead favoring Western Europe and particularly Asia.
The start of deliveries in Europe already commenced in May, and Asian deliveries will start by 2013 as Audi mulls bringing the long-wheelbase version there, as well as a right-hand-drive model. The choice to not invite North American consumers to the party might not be a forever sort of thing, but at least for the next few years, the plan appears to be set in stone.
To be honest, Audi's full parallel hybrid strategy, along with that of parent Volkswagen Group's larger cars and SUVs in general, isn't terribly amazing – there's no thinking going on outside of the box here. Across the entire VW corporate family, the better choice for these bigger cruisers is always the range of outstanding diesels that generally weigh less and can cost less than their hybrid brethren. Nonetheless, Audi's high-tech image demands that the brand show it can play in every alternative propulsion sector. With China being Audi's best market by far, this A8 Hybrid has that nation writ all over its business plan.
What is, however, a nice upgrade to Audi's hybrid efficiency message is that the engine in this gas-electric A8 is the widely praised 208-horsepower 2.0-liter TFSI 4-cylinder, not just a modified V6 or V8 that would lower development costs but hike the price beyond credibility. This 4-cylinder choice helps contain both the weight and the price of the project. In Germany, the A8 Hybrid sells for €70,700 after all initial taxes. A more generously equipped long-wheelbase A8 Hybrid sells for upwards of €85,400 – around $105,000 U.S. Given general pricing trends on both sides of the ocean and keeping in mind the higher equipment levels that Americans prefer (and generally get for cheap), the short-wheelbase model would translate to around $70,000 U.S.
If that sounds oddly inexpensive, that's because the hybrid's price point in Germany is intended to sit right around that of a front-wheel-drive 201-hp A8 3.0 TDI V6, a markedly less powerful, less luxurious A8 than what is sold in North America. Coincidentally, though, the A8 Hybrid and A8 V6 TDI weigh the same at 4,125 pounds. Of course, here in the States, our base specification is nearly $80k for a 4.2-liter V8 Quattro model – at least until the promised 3.0-liter TFSI V6 arrives.
While the A8 Hybrid cannot beat the base diesel's fuel efficiency, it does average slightly lower CO2 emissions – an important distinction in Europe for insurance purposes. Acceleration to 62 mph for both cars is between 7.7 and 7.9 seconds. Where the A8 Hybrid significantly falls behind, though, is cargo room. The high placement of the 84-pound lithium-ion battery pack cuts significantly into trunk space. From the usual EPA-rated 13.2 cubic feet of space, chop things down to roughly 10.0 cubes using the EPA scale. This sort of lowbrow mounting strategy for the battery pack leaves us perplexed: Is the plan to have 4 adults aboard a large luxury 4-door but leave them without enough luggage space? It's too compromising.
The way the A8 Hybrid drives is understandably very numb and tranquil when done correctly and most efficiently. Push the car hard over dynamic stretches of road and you are quickly out of the car's element. This is not aided much by the front-wheel-drive platform and extremely frugal and detached-feeling electronic steering. To be fair, though, this clearly isn't a model intended for more passionate driving forays – just point it down the road and quietly go forth in the lap of luxury with little or no exterior air noise due to the 0.26 coefficient of drag.
Moments when the 2.0-liter 4-cylinder switches off or on happen seamlessly, and the eight-speed Tiptronic with its integrated 52-hp electric motor is likewise creamy smooth, constantly seeking to slip into 8th gear for maximum fuel savings. Going strictly by the European cycle of efficiency ratings, the A8 Hybrid could claim 37.3-mpg average city/highway per U.S. gallon. Going by the same fudged scale, I realized an indicated 33.0-mpg average.
Helping the standard air suspension is a set of 255/45 19-inch Goodyear Eagle F1 tires, which, while good pieces, are probably not the most efficient rubber for what is otherwise a predominantly green-focused luxury car. On the other hand, the aerodynamic Turbine wheelset specific to the A8 Hybrid is good looking while aiding to lower wind resistance.
Between the 208-hp 2.0-liter TFSI 4-cylinder and 52-hp electric motor, the cumulative result when they are both hammering together in boost mode under high throttle is 241 hp. The torque figure in this full-bore scenario is 354 pound-feet, much of that available from a standstill thanks to the push of the electric motor. All ancillaries that are normally run via mechanical belt drive from the 2.0-liter engine are now run electrically via various sensors that tell when things need to be actuated or not. These actuators via the high-voltage lithium-ion battery can also keep the climate control on while the engine is off in start-stop mode at traffic lights.
Electric-only propulsion can happen up to 37 mph under the right (and frankly almost nonexistent) conditions, though this can only be sustained for about 2 miles before the conventional engine ignites. In the meantime, the 2 power units can do their boost thing together at up to 100 mph, at which point the electric motor cuts out of the equation. Top speed is 146 mph, legal only in Germany.
Admittedly, we are pushovers for all of the big German 4-door sedans because they deliver so much authority and power-of-stance. As a passenger or driving the A8 Hybrid as parsimoniously as intended (read: as luxurious transportation and not a soul-stirring sport sedan), we can still find something to appreciate in this A8 Hybrid. But if we look at the details and packaging, we'd still have to go for the base diesel – this is one hybrid that the U.S. can live without. Now, about that 4.2-liter TDI, please...
Last edited by GS69; 07-09-12 at 10:43 AM.
07-09-12, 10:06 AM
#23
Lexus Test Driver
I would not want to own an Audi Hybrid, imagine the repair costs on that.
A non-hybrid Audi is already unreliable and costly to fix/maintain, why would anyone want a Hybrid version of that? lol (rhetorical question)
A non-hybrid Audi is already unreliable and costly to fix/maintain, why would anyone want a Hybrid version of that? lol (rhetorical question)
07-09-12, 10:09 AM
#24
there was an review in AMS between A6, 5 series and M35h and germans really didnt like germans. Apperantly, while Infiniti is jerky and weird at times, it gets A LOT better consumption in real life, and A6 and 5 series cant match anything close to their ratings, even in their testing loops. Autobild also got 40% to 50% consumption for A6 and 5 series than official numbers.
http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/v...t-5035840.html
No wonder BMW made a deal to get Lexus powertrains :-). If we remember from US tests, GS was at least 10% more efficient than Infiniti.
Conclusion:
4 stars - Infiniti M35h: Even if it's from the drive train and sometimes jerky, the Infiniti M35h shows what a good hybrid should do: take significantly more economical, faster and stronger cost hardly more than a comparable gasoline engine.
2 - Star Audi A6 Hybrid: Although the Audi A6 hybrid uses only a four-cylinder glow as he consumes more than the Infiniti with its powerful V6. Since his charge steep turns, as a plus point remains only to preserve the folding rear bench.
2 star BMW ActiveHybrid 5: The BMW ActiveHybrid represents 5 to his name and enthusiastic manners with turbo oomph and polished. The savings effect is however so low that it is not the hefty price for the 535i is worth more.
4 stars - Infiniti M35h: Even if it's from the drive train and sometimes jerky, the Infiniti M35h shows what a good hybrid should do: take significantly more economical, faster and stronger cost hardly more than a comparable gasoline engine.
2 - Star Audi A6 Hybrid: Although the Audi A6 hybrid uses only a four-cylinder glow as he consumes more than the Infiniti with its powerful V6. Since his charge steep turns, as a plus point remains only to preserve the folding rear bench.
2 star BMW ActiveHybrid 5: The BMW ActiveHybrid represents 5 to his name and enthusiastic manners with turbo oomph and polished. The savings effect is however so low that it is not the hefty price for the 535i is worth more.
No wonder BMW made a deal to get Lexus powertrains :-). If we remember from US tests, GS was at least 10% more efficient than Infiniti.
07-09-12, 10:26 AM
#26
Lexus Fanatic
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and this is why i think hybrid sedans in general are pretty lame...
While the A8 Hybrid cannot beat the base diesel's fuel efficiency, it does average slightly lower CO2 emissions – an important distinction in Europe for insurance purposes. Acceleration to 62 mph for both cars is between 7.7 and 7.9 seconds. Where the A8 Hybrid significantly falls behind, though, is cargo room. The high placement of the 84-pound lithium-ion battery pack cuts significantly into trunk space. From the usual EPA-rated 13.2 cubic feet of space, chop things down to roughly 10.0 cubes using the EPA scale. This sort of lowbrow mounting strategy for the battery pack leaves us perplexed: Is the plan to have four adults aboard a large luxury 4-door but leave them without enough luggage space? It's too compromising.
07-09-12, 10:27 AM
#27
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plus, to think audi put a 4 banger in their 'flagship' hybrid, 
while lexus puts in a big ol' v8 
while lexus puts in a big ol' v8
07-09-12, 03:30 PM
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