Production Efficiency and Flexibility - A Story About Why Lexus Needs A Camry
06-16-11, 01:41 PM
#17
Lexus Test Driver
I think Lexus is doing fine. They just need to focus on the sport and luxury end of it. The HS was a weak effort, but all other models have found successful niches and made a good reputation for themselves.
If the company has faltered in one area, it's extending the model years of their bread and butter sedans. If there had been a new ES, IS, and GS by now, we'd all be focusing on those and not thinking about what Lexus could/should be doing.
If the company has faltered in one area, it's extending the model years of their bread and butter sedans. If there had been a new ES, IS, and GS by now, we'd all be focusing on those and not thinking about what Lexus could/should be doing.
06-16-11, 01:58 PM
#18
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Well, the Touareg is a luxury SUV on par with the RX, etc and STARTS at $40k and goes all the way to $65k. A Q7 borrows from it and starts at $45k and goes up to 75k-80k. The Camry is a boring midsize sedan that can be had for under $20k. Not befitting for a luxury car.
MkIV Supra and GS/Aristo respectively.
06-16-11, 06:55 PM
#20
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But should they go as far as the 3 German lineups, where the CUV/SUV models are starting to outnumber the car models -- Q1, Q2, Q3, Q4, Q5, Q6, Q7; X1, X2, X3, X4, X5, X6; GLK, ML, GL, R, G? (OK, I exaggerate somewhat.)
06-16-11, 07:03 PM
#21
Well, the Touareg is a luxury SUV on par with the RX, etc and STARTS at $40k and goes all the way to $65k. A Q7 borrows from it and starts at $45k and goes up to 75k-80k. The Camry is a boring midsize sedan that can be had for under $20k. Not befitting for a luxury car.
This is what you have troubles understanding and this is why regardless RX is the best selling vehicle in the class for a decade.
also - new 1 series will use PSA turbo engines. Imagine Lexus using Chrysler engine?
06-16-11, 07:43 PM
#22
I don't think it will hurt if Lexus shares some of its engines through out the line up, but it wouldn't make sense to have a single platform shared among all of the models. Like what was said earlier, Nissan/Infiniti does it, but it really only works on the G35 and the FX50/35.
06-18-11, 03:46 AM
#23
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Well, the Touareg is a luxury SUV on par with the RX, etc and STARTS at $40k and goes all the way to $65k. A Q7 borrows from it and starts at $45k and goes up to 75k-80k. The Camry is a boring midsize sedan that can be had for under $20k. Not befitting for a luxury car.
06-18-11, 03:52 AM
#24
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If you look at the Camry, it has arguably the best powertrain in its class, the V6 is smooth, fast and reliable. On the flip side, the interior is among the worst. Therefore it seems Toyota spent more of the development costs on the powertrain, which makes sense since they have to use that V6 in Lexus products as well.
Frankly I'd say the powertrain in the ES and RX are among the top in their respective segments, regardless of if they're sourced from the Camry. As a whole I also think the RX is better than both the GLK and the X3, again despite being based on the Camry (price wise it does not compete against the more expensive X5 and ML, the GX does).
With the next generation of the Camry rumours have it that Toyota will be discontinuing the V6 model for trim levels below the XLE, which means a Camry V6 is essentially a luxury car (since you have to get the higher price low volume XLE model for the V6).
Having said all that though I would prefer Lexus move away from Toyota architecture, I'd like the next ES and RX to share their own platform. Lexus should do platform sharing within the Lexus brand, like Merc and BMW do, but not a lot with Toyota.
Frankly I'd say the powertrain in the ES and RX are among the top in their respective segments, regardless of if they're sourced from the Camry. As a whole I also think the RX is better than both the GLK and the X3, again despite being based on the Camry (price wise it does not compete against the more expensive X5 and ML, the GX does).
With the next generation of the Camry rumours have it that Toyota will be discontinuing the V6 model for trim levels below the XLE, which means a Camry V6 is essentially a luxury car (since you have to get the higher price low volume XLE model for the V6).
Having said all that though I would prefer Lexus move away from Toyota architecture, I'd like the next ES and RX to share their own platform. Lexus should do platform sharing within the Lexus brand, like Merc and BMW do, but not a lot with Toyota.
As for the Camry V6, it's rumored the LE V6 model will be canned, which I think is a bad idea and I hope it doesn't come to pass, but regardless the XLE won't be the only V6 model as the SE will still be around and it will have the V6.
I agree that it would be nice for the ES and RX to share a unique platform. These cars sell in enough volume to justify the cost, though the current models are well-differentiated compared to the Camry/Highlander. I also think Lexus should have their own unique V6 (or I6 ala JZ series).
06-18-11, 09:37 AM
#25
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The Camry's interior is a downgrade from past Camrys, but to say it's among the worst in this class is wrong. It trumps the Malibu and Fusion easily and is competitive with the Accord. Certain parts that used to be padded surfaces were downgraded to hard plastics in the Gen 6, but there is no more than in a comparable Accord. I also think that leather quality in the Camry is among the best in class. The Gen 7, however, has promised to address the cheapening that happend in the current model.
As for the Camry V6, it's rumored the LE V6 model will be canned, which I think is a bad idea and I hope it doesn't come to pass, but regardless the XLE won't be the only V6 model as the SE will still be around and it will have the V6.
I agree that it would be nice for the ES and RX to share a unique platform. These cars sell in enough volume to justify the cost, though the current models are well-differentiated compared to the Camry/Highlander. I also think Lexus should have their own unique V6 (or I6 ala JZ series).
As for the Camry V6, it's rumored the LE V6 model will be canned, which I think is a bad idea and I hope it doesn't come to pass, but regardless the XLE won't be the only V6 model as the SE will still be around and it will have the V6.
I agree that it would be nice for the ES and RX to share a unique platform. These cars sell in enough volume to justify the cost, though the current models are well-differentiated compared to the Camry/Highlander. I also think Lexus should have their own unique V6 (or I6 ala JZ series).
06-18-11, 01:27 PM
#26
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Not sure about your experience but when I first sat in a brand new current gen Camry what struck me instantly was how cheap the interior was. Yes there are soft touch plastics, but there is less of them than the last version. The fit and finish was just deplorable, a lot of seams and gaps that didn't line up properly. I'd put the Accord's interior way ahead, and both the Malibu and Fusion had better quality interiors. The closest interior would be the Altima's, which I'll grant you is worse.
In areas such as the door panels, the Accord's is made of the same materials, while the Malibu and Fusion have lots of cheap, hollow plastics on the door panels and other areas, much more so than the Camry and Accord. The leather quality in basically everything GM sells is laughable and pretty much vinyl and every Malibu I've driven has an annoying squak at just the slightest bump in the road.
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