The future of the HS 250h?
07-07-10, 11:59 AM
#16
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
hmm... oh look - an elephant in the room... 
the HS is one of the UGLIEST cars i've ever seen. that's why it sells like ugly pills, plus its fuel economy isn't that great.
i think the CT has a better shot - it's more functional and not ugly.
the HS is one of the UGLIEST cars i've ever seen. that's why it sells like ugly pills, plus its fuel economy isn't that great.
i think the CT has a better shot - it's more functional and not ugly.
07-07-10, 12:04 PM
#17
I see very very few of these cars in Nor. Cal. and I have to say the car doesn't make sense to me. It didn't when it was initially announced and sure as heck doesn't now. I get that is the first "luxury hybrid" and all of that but really, for that car starting at $35k, it's just strange. It's nice to be "first" but at the same time if no one is going to remember it, who cares?
If gas were up to $4/gal and the economy the way it is currently, I still don't think it would sell because purchasing a new car may not be on a lot of peoples' mind anyway. I agree with the person who said if you're want to save money you're not likely going to buy a $40k hybrid and if you want (and can afford) luxury MPG isn't the first thing you're looking at. I'd rather see a hybrid IS or ES as a starting point with maybe a $5k premium over the standard gas versions.
If gas were up to $4/gal and the economy the way it is currently, I still don't think it would sell because purchasing a new car may not be on a lot of peoples' mind anyway. I agree with the person who said if you're want to save money you're not likely going to buy a $40k hybrid and if you want (and can afford) luxury MPG isn't the first thing you're looking at. I'd rather see a hybrid IS or ES as a starting point with maybe a $5k premium over the standard gas versions.
07-07-10, 12:29 PM
#19
Speaks French in Russian
I'm not sure I buy this yet. I need stats and proof of this otherwise. 
Reason I say this is because I do not recall Camry Hybrid sales increasing by much due to high gas prices. RX hybrid sales were pretty consistent, and Ford Escape hybrid were pretty level as well. The exception being the Prius because it is such a strong brand name and when people think hybrid, its the Prius. Yes, people did downgrade into more fuel efficient vehicles with a lot of people(who knows what the percentages were) moving out of luxury brands (remember those ridiculously high subcompact and compact sales?). Now I do recall sales of just about all hybrids going up because of C4C. But, with all that said above I could be wrong.
Basically what I am saying, the problem isnt the lower gas prices, the problem is the HS. IMO, it would still be a flop even if gas prices rose to $4 bucks a gallon for regular. The future of the HS for the current generation will not improve. Competition is coming sooner rather than later. The CT is coming, Lincoln hybrid, and I am sure the next 3-series will have a hybrid, A3 diesel, maybe a C-class hybrid next gen, Infiniti without a doubt will have a version of the Leaf as well as a G hybrid depending on the success of the M hybrid come spring, even Acura has talked hybrids :unicorn:. Thats A LOT happening within 2-3 years.
Reason I say this is because I do not recall Camry Hybrid sales increasing by much due to high gas prices. RX hybrid sales were pretty consistent, and Ford Escape hybrid were pretty level as well. The exception being the Prius because it is such a strong brand name and when people think hybrid, its the Prius. Yes, people did downgrade into more fuel efficient vehicles with a lot of people(who knows what the percentages were) moving out of luxury brands (remember those ridiculously high subcompact and compact sales?). Now I do recall sales of just about all hybrids going up because of C4C. But, with all that said above I could be wrong.
Basically what I am saying, the problem isnt the lower gas prices, the problem is the HS. IMO, it would still be a flop even if gas prices rose to $4 bucks a gallon for regular. The future of the HS for the current generation will not improve. Competition is coming sooner rather than later. The CT is coming, Lincoln hybrid, and I am sure the next 3-series will have a hybrid, A3 diesel, maybe a C-class hybrid next gen, Infiniti without a doubt will have a version of the Leaf as well as a G hybrid depending on the success of the M hybrid come spring, even Acura has talked hybrids :unicorn:. Thats A LOT happening within 2-3 years.
07-07-10, 12:41 PM
#20
Guest
Posts: n/a
I'm not sure I buy this yet. I need stats and proof of this otherwise.
Reason I say this is because I do not recall Camry Hybrid sales increasing by much due to high gas prices. RX hybrid sales were pretty consistent, and Ford Escape hybrid were pretty level as well. The exception being the Prius because it is such a strong brand name and when people think hybrid, its the Prius. Yes, people did downgrade into more fuel efficient vehicles with a lot of people(who knows what the percentages were) moving out of luxury brands (remember those ridiculously high subcompact and compact sales?). Now I do recall sales of just about all hybrids going up because of C4C. But, with all that said above I could be wrong.
Basically what I am saying, the problem isnt the lower gas prices, the problem is the HS. IMO, it would still be a flop even if gas prices rose to $4 bucks a gallon for regular. The future of the HS for the current generation will not improve. Competition is coming sooner rather than later. The CT is coming, Lincoln hybrid, and I am sure the next 3-series will have a hybrid, A3 diesel, maybe a C-class hybrid next gen, Infiniti without a doubt will have a version of the Leaf as well as a G hybrid depending on the success of the M hybrid come spring, even Acura has talked hybrids :unicorn:. Thats A LOT happening within 2-3 years.
Reason I say this is because I do not recall Camry Hybrid sales increasing by much due to high gas prices. RX hybrid sales were pretty consistent, and Ford Escape hybrid were pretty level as well. The exception being the Prius because it is such a strong brand name and when people think hybrid, its the Prius. Yes, people did downgrade into more fuel efficient vehicles with a lot of people(who knows what the percentages were) moving out of luxury brands (remember those ridiculously high subcompact and compact sales?). Now I do recall sales of just about all hybrids going up because of C4C. But, with all that said above I could be wrong.
Basically what I am saying, the problem isnt the lower gas prices, the problem is the HS. IMO, it would still be a flop even if gas prices rose to $4 bucks a gallon for regular. The future of the HS for the current generation will not improve. Competition is coming sooner rather than later. The CT is coming, Lincoln hybrid, and I am sure the next 3-series will have a hybrid, A3 diesel, maybe a C-class hybrid next gen, Infiniti without a doubt will have a version of the Leaf as well as a G hybrid depending on the success of the M hybrid come spring, even Acura has talked hybrids :unicorn:. Thats A LOT happening within 2-3 years.
Did you mention unicorns
07-07-10, 01:26 PM
#21
The problem is price, simple as that. Decent car with some nice kit, but nothing special to deserve the price Lexus charge for it. Start it out $3-5000 cheaper and have it top out at $40,000 or so and it would do a lot better IMO.
07-07-10, 03:11 PM
#22
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the thing starts at $35. I dont think that is very unreasonable. Its an expensive car, but is it expensive for a Lexus or a luxury car? Besides the 1 series and the Audi A3, most luxury cars start in the low to mid 30s. Plus, Im sure you can find great incentives on the car now, that is when it goes on sale again. lol
Granted we are talking about different drivetrains and desirability, for an example, you can load up the MB C class up to the mid 40s, and you still wouldnt have the pre collision/facial monitoring, lane keep assist, HUD, and all the other tech goodies.
In sum, I dont think its the price. If the car looks good and had attrative qualities, the thing would sell at this price. People give a lot of leeway for the brand name on the car. Value has never been essential for a true luxury brand
Granted we are talking about different drivetrains and desirability, for an example, you can load up the MB C class up to the mid 40s, and you still wouldnt have the pre collision/facial monitoring, lane keep assist, HUD, and all the other tech goodies.
In sum, I dont think its the price. If the car looks good and had attrative qualities, the thing would sell at this price. People give a lot of leeway for the brand name on the car. Value has never been essential for a true luxury brand
Last edited by RXSF; 07-07-10 at 03:25 PM.
07-07-10, 03:26 PM
#23
Mediocre styling. Mediocre fuel efficiency. Mediocre performance.
Hybrid living (cushions are made of beans; plastics made of bamboo; etc...) cannot sell this car alone.
Technology is great, but not groundbreaking. And iPad has more bells and whistles.
And for about $40k with options?!? It should have been priced nearer $30k to compete with similar cars like the Audi A4 and Acura TSX (both of which are FWD cars with about 200hp).
07-08-10, 08:36 AM
#25
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
07-08-10, 09:21 AM
#26
funny how they rejoiced this vehicle and how it was claimed to be so much better than the other hybrids on the market, and how it would out sell other cars like it. WRONG!.
The car slots into the market very poorly. Its a little of this and a little of that. Hard to place it. I have still not had a chance to drive one, but I am sure its 100% Lexus quality. I just cant imagine dropping that much money on a hybrid car that is about the same size as the prius. Its got nicer paint, interior, better performance, better image, and better customer service that its Prius cousin, but is it worth another 15k???
The car slots into the market very poorly. Its a little of this and a little of that. Hard to place it. I have still not had a chance to drive one, but I am sure its 100% Lexus quality. I just cant imagine dropping that much money on a hybrid car that is about the same size as the prius. Its got nicer paint, interior, better performance, better image, and better customer service that its Prius cousin, but is it worth another 15k???
I'd go loaded Camry Hybrid for less than the base HS cost and have a smoother and quieter ride but if you really need that Lexus badge,you'll pay dearly for it with this model fully equipped.
Last edited by Joeb427; 07-08-10 at 10:49 AM.
07-08-10, 12:05 PM
#29
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From what we have seen in the forum Prius and TSX shoppers have looked at the HS, not many Camry hybrid shoppers.