DASHOCKER

iTrader: (2)

According to the chart, Mercedes electronics must be bad.

XeroK00L

^^Good point. Consistency is the key.

What makes Lexus so incredible is that they have always been CONSISTENT in doing well in BOTH initial quality studies AND long-term dependability studies. Most other nameplates, German ones in particular, only do well in the former but fall apart in the latter. Mercedes-Benz just got ranked ROCK BOTTOM in the most recent long-term dependability survey, remember?

mmarshall

ALL of the current M-B products, based on latest data from CR surveys, are well-below average in overall reliability. Some are even worse than Land Rovers.
Consumer Reports does not break down categories like Power does with things like IQS, 3-year-old models, etc.... They simply publish a new report every year with the New-Car Buying Guide Issues (December and April) and report on their newest findings....combined with their past reports usually going back 6-7 years or so. If they don't get enough surveys returned on one particular model for an adequate reliability report, they simply don't publish any figures for that vehicle or that model year. For example, the Ford Focus (the U.S. version) was VERY unreliable in 2000-2001, and the subject of a number of recalls, but reliability improved rapidly after that.....to the point where it has been average now for about 3 years or so. Ditto for the Ford Escape. The Toyota Camry, however, took a noticeable dip from 2004 to 2006, and now some versions rate only average. And, yes, ocasionally, surprises occur. The new Ford Fusion and its Mercury and Lincoln versions, in FWD versions, have been far above average in reliability, according to CR (not enough data yet for the new AWD versions). That is VERY unusual for a first-year domestic product. And traditionally reliable Subaru had teething problems with the 2004 Baja...a poor start in its first year (unusual for Subies) rapidly jumped to way above average the next year....2005.

And I base my opinions not just on my READING Consumer Reports (although I do that), but, over some 40 years of driving and owning cars (I have owned dozens), my OWN experience, reliability-wise, with most of the vehicles I've owned, has been very close to what CR has published about them, so IMO they know what they are talking about.

Gojirra99

According to this link I posted about on more detailed breakdown of this study, there's still little indication their electronics are good : http://www.jdpower.com/autos/quality-ratings

pisaykotik

Honda is 4th while Acura is 17th?

mmarshall

The hardware and trim on some of the new Acuras doesn't seem to be as well done as on some of their less-expensive Honda cousins. For instance, the steering wheel on the new MDX is so flimsy it feels like it is going to fall apart in your hands ( see my recent 2007 MDX review). Perhaps it IS falling apart in some hands.

Threxx

The RL, for example, has gotten average if not below industry average reliability ratings - at least for the first couple years of launch (not sure about this year).

I think the general consensus is that Lexus and Acura partly did so well in reliability because they never offered the really leading edge technology and gadgets that the European cars did. Now it seems they are, and it seems that at least Acura may be suffering from those same 'bleeding edge' issues.

Heck, looking at the LS460 being edged out by the A8 and S-class - it seems that my previously stated concerns about the new LS having too much stuff to go wrong, could be coming true. Not to say the new LS is going to be a junker - but it may not be as reliable as the previous LS - especially at launch.

MPLexus301

iTrader: (3)

Looks like LS460 wind noise and ES350 transmission flares and interior rattles did not go unnoticed.

While this ranking is a bit of a slap in the face for Toyota and Lexus both, I do hope that it pushes them to improve their quality issues as of lately.

jdoggg1

Initial quality is totally subjective and is a complete crock IMO. The long term findings are based on empirical data and are 100000x more useful.

MPLexus301

iTrader: (3)

Many of you are dismissing these ratings as unimportant (perhaps because they aren't favorable for Lexus), and I disagree. I think that plenty of things can go wrong in the first three months of ownership- certainly enough to put a bad taste in someone's mouth- and I find that plenty important. Whether Lexus is slipping, the competition is improving, or a combination of both, I think that these findings are significant.

The LS 460 has wind noise and a few other surfacing issues.

The IS has excessive brake dust and brake squeal. The pads to solve brake dust squeak, and the pads that don't squeak are really dusty. Lexus has no real fix here. There have also been plenty of rattles and squeaks that customers are complaining about.

The ES is having transmission issues, many of which are having to be repaired, and the car also has countless rattles and interior concerns.

The GS has also suffered from it's fair share of dash creaks and rattles.

Considering that all of these issues show up within the first few hundred or thousand miles of ownsership, I'm not really surprised that Lexus did not place at the top.

LexBob2

FWIW, here is the link to JD Power for the ES350. 5 out of 5 circles for Overall Quality - Mechanical. There's a red *, but only next to Appeal.

http://www.jdpower.com/autos/lexus/es/2007

carguy101

Is the Toyota 6 speed auto (ES350 and Camry V6) still having issues? Or has it been resolved?

XeroK00L

Thanks for the link. The detailed score card gives us a much better idea of exactly what's going on.

So Lexus is the only nameplate to get a perfect score (5/5) in everything mechanical. A slap in the German's face with their pride in mechanical engineering excellence.

Jaguar, on the other hand, is the only nameplate to get a perfect score in every design-related category. Too bad their mechanicals can't keep up.

Yang1815

iTrader: (1)

I think it's a bad time for Lexus since many models are re-designed quite recently and the little bugs here and there haven't been fixed yet. I'm sure they'll come back in a couple of years if not for 08.

GSteg

iTrader: (15)

Anyone know when the Long Term test results will be in? I'm far more interested in that than the IQR test. If I buy a new car, I will be keeping it for at least 3 years, not just 3 months!