I say dump the current egg-shaped ES and replace it with a crown!! (no offense to ES owners). I think this exterior design is a lottttttt nicer.

 

Well, as a person that lives in Japan, and just seeing these vehicles on the road. I dare say they are making plenty of money!.. I think some of you guys are getting the wrong idea here.. Lexus was only designed because Americans wont buy Toyota's.. Problem is, that by driving a Lexus, you are actually driving a Toyota.. So if I am not mistaken, then Toyota has pulled the wool over your eyes in that department.. As for them selling the Crown in a America, then I can think of plenty of reasons.. Firstly, in Japan, Toyota is by far the most popular.. Even when they do start releasing there vehicles with Lexus badging next year, I dont think there will be that much enthusiasm with the brand.. They are not silly people, and except for the odd guy that will want a Lexus for novelty reasons, I dare say that the Lexus showrooms will just be making a little extra pocket money for the already wealthy Toyota.. A little bit of pocket money is better than no pocket money...

Secondly, although the Lexus brand is an important part of their profit making, I can understand that there are some things that they want to keep to themselves?.. As my wife is Japanese, I certainly know how they think.. Why give everyone everything, when you can give them something less for the same price... We are just lucky here, that we can buy the exact same car as you, but for alot less money... And with more standard options and features... I myself want to have the new Crown, but I definately cant afford it at this period in my life.. So if I cant afford it here in the relatively less expencive Japanese market. Then believe me if they put L badges on it, and sold it in America, then I dare say that it would be alot more expensive than here, and we would all still be here sitting around dreaming about it!.. It is a beautiful car, and I dont begrudge the Japanese for giving themselves this little treasure to keep as their own... Compared to the Celsior (LS) This vehicle is definately a huge step up, and understandably the flagship for Toyota Japan....
Chris

 

This has got to be one of, if not the, most ignorant, most contemptuous things I've ever read in Car Chat. You do realize we are fellow Lexus drivers and enthusiasts?

Yup, we're all a bunch of idiots who have no idea about how and why Lexus was created and, perhaps more importantly, that our cars are closet Toyotas too embarrassed to poke their heads into the light of day.

Thank you. You're the man now.

 

It wasnt meant in the way you have understood it.. I am sorry that you feel that I was making a reference stating that Americans are idiots. That was not the case.. I was just using it as a broad statement to anyone that knocks a Toyota.. The ignorant people are the ones that think Lexus just appeared by itself , and have no knowledge that it is one of many departments of the Toyota Motor Company... But in saying this, then why would the Toyota motor company need to design a luxury label just in order to sell cars in America? So there thinking must have worked by doing this, because the Lexus brand (Toyota) has become a very popular product.. Strange that, isnt it?

I was refering to when Lexus was first introduced, not talking about todays knowledge of the brand by the owners themselves!.. And I definately know that the majority of people on these boards are not idiots at all.. Infact, quite the opposite!.. Dont jump to conclussions so quickly....

Chris

 

OK, thanks for the explanation. I don't think they designed an entirely new label (Lexus) simply in order to sell cars. I think Lexus was established as a separate brand because it was to become so much better than Toyota. The very best Toyota had to offer, and they HAD to distinguish it because it was/is truly worthy of its own entity, and I think many would agree.

You speak of branding in Japan...While with cars, the American versions of the Japanese luxury marques are sold under the parent company's name, the case is not true for other products. Take Japanese watches, example. Seiko sells expensive watch lines under different names and that doesn't seem to dissuade consumers there. I don't think Toyota would go through the trouble of selling Lexus in Japan if they didn't think it would be successful.

Beyond that, I agree with your assessment about the Japanese culture and buying habits. I do not mean to seem as if I am angry with the Japanese or resent them for not simply sending more of their cool cars here. I know it's not that simple. I just really really envy the Japanese, that's all. And you're right, if they want to keep goodies to themselves, they can.

I guess if we got all that stuff (cool JDM cars) we would become bored...I guess the fact that they're so exotic and unattainable make them even more attractive...

 

Chris

 

looks very clean...

 

I don't know why, but the interior reminds me of the G35.

 

I am sorry but I must disagree. They created "Lexus" because they need to satisfy public demand of a "different" brand. People (not just americans) can't seem to accept the fact that they are paying over $50,000 or $60,000 for a "mere Toyota". It's not so much about being more luxurious, hell, most of the better Toyotas sold in Japan are much more luxurious than top-of-the-line Lexuses.

They are in fact designing a whole new "lexus" label for the simple fact that if they want to enter the luxury segment in America, they cannot just up-sell the toyota brand. They are doing that in fact JUST to sell cars. Believe me, if the Toyota folks had thought for a second that there was no real need to create a separate and distinguished brand than Toyota, they wouldn't have gone through the hassle.

In Japan, they don't have this kind of problem. They are proud to be driving a local made top-of-the-line brand. And believe me, a Crown Majesta would kill the LS430 in luxury, quality, options and finish any day and it's still a "mere Toyota".

 

My point exactly!.. I drive a mere Toyota.. Its a Windom.. I also drive a Lexus ES300.. Yes its the same car!... But its a Toyota, and I am proud of it!!.. Every time I meet someone, they say "Cool you drive a Lexus", and then I say no, its a Windom, I put the L badges on it to be different.(Although the trend is definately picking up here)... I tell them that they just have to look at the badge on my steering wheel to see what it is...

Chris

 

Guys, don't get me wrong here. I know there are plenty of Lexus buyers who wouldn't even consider one if it were branded a Toyota.

I am not one of them.

I wouldn't have a problem with Lexus being sold as a Toyota in the US. The badge doesn't bother me at all. In fact, I wish they would sell them as Toyotas. But that would be business suicide for them. I agree that marketing perceptions of many American consumers are ridiculous.

 

If it were branded a Toyota?? It is a Toyota!!.....

Chris

I am Australian by birth, and spent a great deal of my life in the United States.. I have now lived in Japan for 4 years, and believe me, that the Japanese make everyone look like amatures when it comes to love for a brand name.. If it hasnt got a brand name, and doesnt cost alot, then they think it is suspicious and wont buy it.. So then, even though Toyota is a home grown and reliable product, why do they buy these cars if they are in the minds of most Americans, inferior?... I know that the Lexus brand will always be with us, but remember that when you buy one, you are buying something that is so called less respected.. I for one dont believe that putting L badges on something warrants a double in price for the exact same product that I can get for far less because it is a poor Toyota... Something to think about...

 

When I first got my Celsior (LS) here in Japan I thought it was great to be driving a car thats a Lexus in the states w/ more options. But once I started Modding it / attending VIPcar meets and talking the the Japanese about the Crown Majesta............. I had to get the Majesta NOT just any of the other Crowns the Majesta.

Engine - Chassis - Interior alot of it is the same as the LS.

I get alot of folks (Military Air Force Service Members) that ask me what my car is and if they get one can they take it back to the U.S. Once I tell them its a Toyota they freak out. I think its so funny cause they think Lexus is the BEST. They ask cause my car is Debadged.

 

New Lexus cars do NOT cost alot more then the New Toyota's....... Look at the 2004 LS. Priced both in Japan and the U.S. its not that much of a diffrence. I lived here 10 years I get paid in U.S. $$$ exchanged to Yen im not saving much on buying a NEW Majesta or the LS.

 

That car is amazing. BRING IT HERE!!!!!!