engin_ear

iTrader: (1)

Let's be nice - remain objective. Don't drag this into the mud.

HarrierAWD

The Fortera 3tred has a wear rating of 460 according to the Goodyear mailing that I received. I was checking it out because the Goodyear Assurance 3tred (passenger car tire) was rated very well in CR.... until I saw the price ..... about $200 each. It has a 60K mile warranty.

Note that tire manufacturers sometimes change a tire without changing its name. Michelin had changed the CT a while ago, which made it a poorly rated tire in CR last year. So the current CT may not perform as well as the CT you have now.

Michelin had also changed the LTX M/S recently. Also Goodyear had just changed the Integrity's tread pattern. Toyo changed the compound in its excellent M410, which made it a so-so tire that last longer. I considered all these before deciding on the Bridgestone Dueler H/T D687, which remains unchanged since its introduction.

HarrierAWD

Someone just proved my point.

The Consumer Reports magazine has the largest paid subscription circulation (about 4 million) among all magazines. This does not even count those sold through newsstand and its website subscription. Hardly a noob publication for noob consumers.

It evaluates tires against 10 benchmarks in scientifically-controlled tests. Here are the 10 benchmarks: Dry braking, Wet braking, Handling, Hydroplaning, Rolling resistance, Snow traction, Ice braking, Ride, Noise, and Tread life (actual test.) Each tire is given a 1-5 scale in each benchmark and an overall score with emphasis in safety-related benchmarks. Its November issue is the one to read for those who care about tires and safety.

mikey00

I guess my replacement choices are down to CTs or Alenzas now. I won't consider a tire with a wear rating as low as 460.
What makes you think Michelin changed CT a while ago? The reason it tested poorly in CR was not due to any change. They tested the 235 size not the 225 size. The 235s were a cheaper Cross Terrain 3 years ago when I first looked at them and remain the same today. The reason for the different specs for the 235 size is Ford is using them as an OEM tire so Michelin had to get the price down for that size. The 235 size is listed as an OEM tire on the Michelin website.

HarrierAWD

I know this might sound too convenient, but a friend of mine is a Michelin wholesale/corporate sales rep in Colorado. (They only have 3 in CO.) He knows about production changes, etc.

CR has an interesting find on wear index in its Nov 2005 issue. Take a look. My Goodyear Integrity has an index of 440, yet it lasted 53K miles with 4/32"-5/32" left. My driving style is average.

mikey00

While the UTQG treadwear rating is not perfect between different manufactures, as Consumer Reports has pointed out, it is still the best indicator out there. I have always found it to be quite accurate when comparing wear on my many tire purchases on multiple vehicles over the years.
I would be interseted in hearing what your Michelin rep thinks the production change might be in the 225 CT. The specs haven't changed and I rolled a new one next to my existing one on the car and everything down to the smallest detail looks the same. And again CR did not test the 225. They tested the 235 which evem Michelin admits has different specs because it is used as an OEM tire.

HarrierAWD

The difference is in the compound, so that Michelin can give you a long 65K warranty vs. the Ford Exploder OEM version. If you are comfortable with it, buy it by all means. I have a set of Michelin X-One on my old car. It's still going strong after 90K miles. That doesn't mean all Michelin tires are good.

If you have both the CR Nov 2004 & Nov 2005 issues, you can see that Michelin scored top ranks in car tires, yet low scores in SUV tires. That says something about Michelin's competency. Unfortunately CR didn't test SUV tires this year and there was no clear winner for me in the 2004 issue, so I had to go for the OEM Bridgestone, which was tested decent with the CR RX300 review.

Also note that CR tested some SUVs back in Sept 2001 issue (I think.) Both the Ford Exploder and Chevy TrailBlocker had the Michelin CT and handled poorly. The Michelin CT was the worst handling tire among the 22 tested in Nov 2004. The harder 700 compound in retail version won't improve handling (might make it worse.) I believe that it's very important for SUV to have good handling tires for safety.

mikey00

I guess we just have to agree to disagree on this one. The 225 size was always a 65K tire so there was no need to change the compound to become a 65K tire as you state. And yes I have a subscription to CR for many years now along with an online subscription and it is very clear that the CT they are testing is a 235 size which is a cheaper tire and most likely a different compound than the 225.

cephraim

OK, I just put the Cross Terrains on my '00 RX.
Loving them so far.

What tire pressure do you guys recommend for winter/snow driving with these puppies?

Thanks,
Eph

mikey00

I believe the sticker on the drivers door jamb of the RX says to run them at 30# cold. I keep mine at 32#. The ride starts to suffer if I go above 34#.

engin_ear

iTrader: (1)

I keep mine at 32 - seems to work well.

HarrierAWD

I put 33 front and 30 rear. I put more in the front now because my old GY Integrity was wearing out at both edges - clear sign of under-inflation. I had my tire gauge checked and it was correct.

So far so good with my new Bridgestone Dueler H/T D687. It is extremely quiet. Most tires howl on concrete, this tire does not even make a whisper. It is so quiet, I can hear the slight wind noise from my roof rack, which I had never heard of before. It only makes some noise on coarse pavement, not as loud as GY Integrity. Handling is much better, which was a weak point for GY Integrity from the start. Braking seems to be very good in dry and wet.

The soft 300 compound would probably mean that this tire will wear out sooner than my old GY Integrity (440.) The softer compound may do better on ice, and its aggressive tread pattern may do well in snow, but I won't know until we get dumped on in Colorado. (70F sunny yesterday, and this is November.)

So unless CR's Nov 04 test result shows a tire that fits your need, I'd recommend this OEM tire for RX300 with reservations - pending its winter performance and tread wear. (I drive 2K miles a month.) GY Integrity isn't bad if you can put up with noise on rough pavement and so-so handling.

HarrierAWD

According to my friend, the CT's compound was changed two years ago to make it even harder to reduce warranty claims, though Michelin didn't change the treadwear index. If longevity is important to you, buy it by all means.

The LTX M/S also received a make-over. Michelin may be reading CR and making improvements to its SUV tires. Of course my friend also said that CR's testing may be "skewed." He'll never say anything bad about Michelin.... never bite the hand that feeds you.