Props to (shock) Hillary Clinton

[Och]

Originally Posted by montgb

Nice list. Last time I checked, Obama was democratically elected and can be removed from office in 3 years - that doesn't quite qualify him as a dictator. And last time I checked, Obama hasn't waged genocide against his own people - I say that clears him of being a murderer (The Taliban may beg to differ). Instead, Obama is taking steps to bring the US out of the worst recession in decades and trying to bring Healthcare to those that don't have it. Go ahead and argue with his methods, but don't try to compare him to the worst criminals in history.

Of course he hasn't committed the crimes that these dictators have. It would be kind of difficult to do something like that in the modern USA.

But the fact is that him and his "czars" openly admit to favor Mao, Chavez, redistribution of wealth, the fact that he is trying to get the government to control the media, the bailouts, the NEA, are all clear proof that his is a straight up communist.

And the fact that he is calling to form a "civil militia" that is as strong and as well funded as the Army, might be a sign that he is indeed planning to commit the same crimes as his

Originally Posted by montgb

A more appropriate example would be George W trying to buy votes by issuing $500 checks to everyone. What do you think the outcry would be if Obama did something like that?

If you were a member of this board for a little longer, you would've seen the outcry about these $500 checks. And guess what, most of those outcrying were on the right, while those on the left seemed to be in favor it these checks.

Personally, I would support these stimulus checks, after all its our tax money coming back to us, but only if everyone was eligible to receive them, not just people in the low income bracket. After all, the rich pay the most and the poor pay the least.

[mmarshall]

Originally Posted by Och

But the fact is that him and his "czars" openly admit to favor Mao, Chavez, redistribution of wealth, the fact that he is trying to get the government to control the media, the bailouts, the NEA, are all clear proof that his is a straight up communist.

This is not totally true, but Och does have a point here. Obama does cozy up to Chavez far more than Bush ever did. What really riles me, however, is his support for that douche bag Zalaya in Honduras. Obama is trying to portray the whole incident as the illegal ousting of a duly-elected President, which is complete nonsense. Zalaya tried to usurp the Honduran Constitution to illegally extend his term. The Honduran Supreme Court, the country's top Judiciary, ruled that, under Honduran law, he was no longer allowed to remain in office, and called for his resignation. When Zelaya refused to step down willingly, the military, UNDER THE DIRECTION OF THE SUPREME COURT, physically removed him from power. The rest is history. Obama, by his continued (and stubborn) support for Zelaya, is actually showing contempt for Honduran democracy.

[montgb]

Originally Posted by Och

But the fact is that him and his "czars" openly admit to favor Mao, Chavez, redistribution of wealth, the fact that he is trying to get the government to control the media, the bailouts, the NEA, are all clear proof that his is a straight up communist.

And the fact that he is calling to form a "civil militia" that is as strong and as well funded as the Army, might be a sign that he is indeed planning to commit the same crimes as his

If you were a member of this board for a little longer, you would've seen the outcry about these $500 checks. And guess what, most of those outcrying were on the right, while those on the left seemed to be in favor it these checks.

Less mud-slinging, more facts please. It's very easy to twist a statement and bend it to an existing perception. As others have noted on this board, "selective" hearing and reasoning runs rampant. I've read some of Mao's quotes and writings, and some make a lot of sense. Others, not so much. Does that make me a Communist?

Also, I'm not sure where the "civil militia" quote came from - please share! Otherwise, I'm chalking this up as another by-product of selective hearing.

Y'know, there was another group that recommended the establishment of an organized militia - the Founding Fathers.

[montgb]

Originally Posted by mmarshall

What really riles me, however, is his support for that douche bag Zalaya in Honduras. Obama is trying to portray the whole incident as the illegal ousting of a duly-elected President, which is complete nonsense. Zalaya tried to usurp the Honduran Constitution to illegally extend his term. The Honduran Supreme Court, the country's top Judiciary, ruled that, under Honduran law, he was no longer allowed to remain in office, and called for his resignation. When Zelaya refused to step down willingly, the military, UNDER THE DIRECTION OF THE SUPREME COURT, physically removed him from power. The rest is history. Obama, by his continued (and stubborn) support for Zelaya, is actually showing contempt for Honduran democracy.

Yep, I agree with most of this. It's funny that different branches of the US Gov't actually are at odds with each other regarding Zelaya's ouster. The congressional lawyers say that Honduras is following correct protocol, while the State Dept withheld $30M in aid until his reinstatement.

In some ways I can see the logic - the US might not want to set a precedent by supporting every country that uses a military coup to depose a democratically elected leader. The actual answer is usually several shades of gray.

Unfortunately, I think if Obama supported the military coup instead of Zelaya, members of the opposition would jump all over him for not supporting Democracy. And being a Communist.

[Och]

Originally Posted by montgb

Less mud-slinging, more facts please. It's very easy to twist a statement and bend it to an existing perception. As others have noted on this board, "selective" hearing and reasoning runs rampant. I've read some of Mao's quotes and writings, and some make a lot of sense. Others, not so much. Does that make me a Communist?

Is that the best you can come up with? Less slinging, more facts?

Unless you've been living on the moon I'm sure you have heard Obama's redistribution of wealth quites, you seen him appoint czars like Van Jones, Mark Lloyd, Ron Bloon, Anita Dunn, Cas Sunstein and you've heard their statements. If you haven't, then go on youtube and watch.

You "selective hearing" excuse just doesn't cut it. If you're accusing me of twisting statements and bending them, please try explain and justify them.

Originally Posted by montgb

Also, I'm not sure where the "civil militia" quote came from - please share! Otherwise, I'm chalking this up as another by-product of selective hearing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwaAVJITx1Y

And at the same time his waging war on guns and the 2nd amendment. I wonder why? Care to explain?

Originally Posted by montgb

Y'know, there was another group that recommended the establishment of an organized militia - the Founding Fathers.

Perhaps you need to read a little history and quotes of the Founding Fathers, then you'll understand what their purpose of militia was. They advised gun rights for everybody so that citizen could protect themselves from the government. What Obama is doing is completely different.

[jamiec]

Has everyone forgotten that it took 8 years to get us into this mess??? Why is everyone expecting dramatic change in a president that has only been in office less than a year? Bush is nowhere to be seen, and IMO he realizes that by speaking up at this point we'll remember who caused these problems in the first place. For instance, 9/11 was caused by Bin Laden so why did we immediately go into Iraq for war? Bush used the anger of the American people to support a war that did not need to take place. Had we not been fighting there, we may have been able to find Bin Laden. This was a war fought for the benefit of Bush and Cheney's bank accounts. Can you say Halliburton?

[EmeraldLexuSC3]

You are a little late to the party, the points you bring up have discussed and beaten to death in past nine years on this forum, you may want to stick to the topic at play.

[montgb]

Originally Posted by Och

You "selective hearing" excuse just doesn't cut it. If you're accusing me of twisting statements and bending them, please try explain and justify them


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwaAVJITx1Y

And at the same time his waging war on guns and the 2nd amendment. I wonder why? Care to explain?

Thanks for providing me with a perfect example. I don't know what's more hilarious, your McCarthy-esque search for Communists in the US government or YouTube clips like this. So you think that when Obama talks about a "Civilian National Security Force", then he must be talking about an equivalent of the Iranian Republican Guard, right? Even though there's no proof to support this?

Here's something funny - take a moment and try to imagine liberals (who hate guns, apparently) taking up arms in favor of Czar Obama.

In reality, he was using a metaphor to discuss the expansion of community service opportunities. Not that you'll believe me, because your 5 second YouTube clip supports your pre-existing notions about the President.

I'm sure this has been discussed to death already, and I'm late to the game (as you say, I haven't been on the board for long enough). Therefore, I won't bother to drag out the discussion further, since neither of us is going to bend. Have a good one.

[Och]

Originally Posted by montgb

Thanks for providing me with a perfect example. I don't know what's more hilarious, your McCarthy-esque search for Communists in the US government or YouTube clips like this. So you think that when Obama talks about a "Civilian National Security Force", then he must be talking about an equivalent of the Iranian Republican Guard, right? Even though there's no proof to support this?

Here's something funny - take a moment and try to imagine liberals (who hate guns, apparently) taking up arms in favor of Czar Obama.

In reality, he was using a metaphor to discuss the expansion of community service opportunities. Not that you'll believe me, because your 5 second YouTube clip supports your pre-existing notions about the President.

I'm sure this has been discussed to death already, and I'm late to the game (as you say, I haven't been on the board for long enough). Therefore, I won't bother to drag out the discussion further, since neither of us is going to bend. Have a good one.

A whole lot of nothing. Still waiting for an explanation.

[montgb]

Originally Posted by Och

A whole lot of nothing. Still waiting for an explanation.

An explanation of what? You want me to refute why Obama's appointees aren't Communists? No thanks - it would be like trying to explain to a "Birther" that Obama was born in the US.

It was pretty simple to shoot holes in the "Civil Militia" nonsense (again, Obama was talking about community service). You're trying to convince people of fantasies using YouTube clips taken out of context. Heck, common sense alone shoots holes in the "Civil Militia" nonsense.

If you want to continue spreading FUD, do what makes you happy.