GS with Supra brake upgrade pics
08-07-01, 05:57 AM
#16
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Originally posted by NVRENUFHP
Why on earth would fitting larger wheels and wider (presumably) tires, but leaving the brakes alone have a negative impact on braking? I don't see how larger wheels and wider tires could in some fashion cause your brakes to be less effective. If anything, the wider tires should give you more stopping power because there is more rubber on the road. Further, if the tires on your larger wheels are the same width as stock, then the stopping power should be the same regardless of wheel size. Please explain that one to me.
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Why on earth would fitting larger wheels and wider (presumably) tires, but leaving the brakes alone have a negative impact on braking? I don't see how larger wheels and wider tires could in some fashion cause your brakes to be less effective. If anything, the wider tires should give you more stopping power because there is more rubber on the road. Further, if the tires on your larger wheels are the same width as stock, then the stopping power should be the same regardless of wheel size. Please explain that one to me.
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Other than getting bigger wheels may make your stock brakes look smaller, what OTHER reason could their be for upgrading your brakes when you go to 20's?
PLEASE explain to me this one.
Last edited by D-MAN63; 08-07-01 at 06:03 AM.
08-07-01, 06:49 AM
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In theory, extra weight will translate to longer stopping distances. But, I have a hard time believing that the few extra pounds the bigger wheels add lengthens stopping distance by an amount that is measurable with expensive testing equipment, let alone the seat of your pants. Slight variations in weather conditions or pavement would be a bigger factor than a few extra pounds.
If a few extra pounds makes so much difference on something that starts at 3700 lbs to begin with, why would pretty serious racers fit larger wheels without doing anything to their brakes. Viper boys who spend a lot of time on the track do it all the time when they swap their stock 17s for 18s, although now 18s are stock and 19s will be stock on the new one. And Vipers are a somewhat lighter than the GS, so a little weight should affect them more.
If a few pounds makes that much difference, and you want to regain the lost distance, put a little less gas in the tank. Or find wheels that, although they are bigger, are made of lighter weight alloy and therefore weigh less than stock.
The weight, in theory, adds to stopping distance. But, their is so little weight involved with bigger wheels that it can't make a noticable difference. If it did, then we could all fit 16s with tires that are as wide as the 17s and we'd stop faster than you boys with the 17s? Not likely.
And how does the wheel diameter make any difference, as suggested by someone.
If a few extra pounds makes so much difference on something that starts at 3700 lbs to begin with, why would pretty serious racers fit larger wheels without doing anything to their brakes. Viper boys who spend a lot of time on the track do it all the time when they swap their stock 17s for 18s, although now 18s are stock and 19s will be stock on the new one. And Vipers are a somewhat lighter than the GS, so a little weight should affect them more.
If a few pounds makes that much difference, and you want to regain the lost distance, put a little less gas in the tank. Or find wheels that, although they are bigger, are made of lighter weight alloy and therefore weigh less than stock.
The weight, in theory, adds to stopping distance. But, their is so little weight involved with bigger wheels that it can't make a noticable difference. If it did, then we could all fit 16s with tires that are as wide as the 17s and we'd stop faster than you boys with the 17s? Not likely.
And how does the wheel diameter make any difference, as suggested by someone.
08-07-01, 08:49 AM
#19
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First off, have you ever driven a stock GS, then drove a GS with 20's on? If you don't have first hand experience of what I am talking about, its pretty hard to make your claim stick. Second, it does have something, actually ALOT to do with the wheels. The heavier the wheels, the more braking power you need to slow down the car. Its physics 101. Now you said race cars have big wheels but they use stocked brakes. Have you ever seen how BIG their "stocked" brakes are ?? Much bigger than the GS for sure. How big are the Viper's stocked brakes? 13"? maybe bigger?
Race cars stocked brakes were made BIG enough so you don't need to upgrade them. As for a GS sedan, the brakes were never made to handle 20" wheels, it was made for 16, 17, and 18 MAX. But can you still use your stocked brakes? Sure you can with no problem but it will be less effiecient.
Why do many members on here like "light" 19, 20" wheels? Because it won't hold down the car when accelerating AND you will still have acceptable braking power.
Race cars stocked brakes were made BIG enough so you don't need to upgrade them. As for a GS sedan, the brakes were never made to handle 20" wheels, it was made for 16, 17, and 18 MAX. But can you still use your stocked brakes? Sure you can with no problem but it will be less effiecient.
Why do many members on here like "light" 19, 20" wheels? Because it won't hold down the car when accelerating AND you will still have acceptable braking power.
Last edited by D-MAN63; 08-07-01 at 08:57 AM.
08-07-01, 10:01 AM
#20
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to me, my interpretation would be on the similar line w/d-man. most japanese wheels co do not make greater than 18s in their racing wheel model line also worry about the weight that would add on to the car. even w/smaller rim sizes, they try to use forging method to reduce the weight of the wheel.
however, with the exception of expensive forged rims such as fikse and hre, many 19, 20s...wheels here in the US that people like(lowenarts) are way too heavy for performance. this is kind of odd to me as replacing stock wheels were meant to reduce weight. but as 20s become popular the weight issue come back again. so if i were to go for 19s /20s, i would def. choose something in a forged construction.
where is gs4power(miguel)?
he is our resident weight reduction guru. he even has the lightest tyre on his car.
will
however, with the exception of expensive forged rims such as fikse and hre, many 19, 20s...wheels here in the US that people like(lowenarts) are way too heavy for performance. this is kind of odd to me as replacing stock wheels were meant to reduce weight. but as 20s become popular the weight issue come back again. so if i were to go for 19s /20s, i would def. choose something in a forged construction.
where is gs4power(miguel)?
he is our resident weight reduction guru. he even has the lightest tyre on his car.will
08-07-01, 10:29 AM
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Originally posted by tinygs
HI98GS??? Vey Important, please reply asap....Are the rotors your getting from Steve going to be cross drilled or cross drilled and slotted??? The ones I recieved are just cross drilled....But, just today, under the thread called "caliper paint", JacobT posted pics of his SupraTT calipers with a cross drilled and slotted rotor...He mentioned he was getting his rotors from Steve but Steve and I searched for the combo(cr drilled/slotted) and Steve said it did not exist...just the cross drilled...Please let me know, thanks, Tiny
HI98GS??? Vey Important, please reply asap....Are the rotors your getting from Steve going to be cross drilled or cross drilled and slotted??? The ones I recieved are just cross drilled....But, just today, under the thread called "caliper paint", JacobT posted pics of his SupraTT calipers with a cross drilled and slotted rotor...He mentioned he was getting his rotors from Steve but Steve and I searched for the combo(cr drilled/slotted) and Steve said it did not exist...just the cross drilled...Please let me know, thanks, Tiny
I might be able to answer this one. The cross-drilled PLUS slotted rotors that JacobT has are from RMM kit which is basically the same kit as the Supra kit with the RMM stamp on the product...RMM might know where they get their rotors from since I am sure they did not manufacture is themselves...Hope this helps...
BRent
08-07-01, 12:38 PM
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tinygs:
The rotors that I recieved are only cross drilled. I also asked steve if there was a cross drilled slotted rotor but he couldn't locate one through TRD. I think if you go to a supra site, you might get more information. I think the cross drilled/slotted rotors look really crazy. but it may be a little overkill for me.
The rotors that I recieved are only cross drilled. I also asked steve if there was a cross drilled slotted rotor but he couldn't locate one through TRD. I think if you go to a supra site, you might get more information. I think the cross drilled/slotted rotors look really crazy. but it may be a little overkill for me.
08-07-01, 01:48 PM
#23
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Originally posted by NVRENUFHP
In theory, extra weight will translate to longer stopping distances. But, I have a hard time believing that the few extra pounds the bigger wheels add lengthens stopping distance by an amount that is measurable with expensive testing equipment, let alone the seat of your pants
In theory, extra weight will translate to longer stopping distances. But, I have a hard time believing that the few extra pounds the bigger wheels add lengthens stopping distance by an amount that is measurable with expensive testing equipment, let alone the seat of your pants
08-07-01, 01:55 PM
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Originally posted by NVRENUFHP
Why on earth would fitting larger wheels and wider (presumably) tires, but leaving the brakes alone have a negative impact on braking? I don't see how larger wheels and wider tires could in some fashion cause your brakes to be less effective. If anything, the wider tires should give you more stopping power because there is more rubber on the road. Further, if the tires on your larger wheels are the same width as stock, then the stopping power should be the same regardless of wheel size. Please explain that one to me.
Why on earth would fitting larger wheels and wider (presumably) tires, but leaving the brakes alone have a negative impact on braking? I don't see how larger wheels and wider tires could in some fashion cause your brakes to be less effective. If anything, the wider tires should give you more stopping power because there is more rubber on the road. Further, if the tires on your larger wheels are the same width as stock, then the stopping power should be the same regardless of wheel size. Please explain that one to me.
And the brake dust issue is more a factor of what pads are used with the Supra brakes, rather than the brakes themselves. If you get more dust than you had before, look into changing the type of pad. There are pads out there that, though they may provide equal stopping power, will create more/less dust.
08-07-01, 08:00 PM
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Originally posted by HI98GS
tinygs:
The rotors that I recieved are only cross drilled. I also asked steve if there was a cross drilled slotted rotor but he couldn't locate one through TRD. I think if you go to a supra site, you might get more information. I think the cross drilled/slotted rotors look really crazy. but it may be a little overkill for me.
tinygs:
The rotors that I recieved are only cross drilled. I also asked steve if there was a cross drilled slotted rotor but he couldn't locate one through TRD. I think if you go to a supra site, you might get more information. I think the cross drilled/slotted rotors look really crazy. but it may be a little overkill for me.
I actually checked with both RMM and Stillen before buying my rotors from Steve...They told me that at one time, they could get the combo(cr drilled/slotted) but that it is no longer available...They said the pics on their site were old....The ones Jacob had in the pic were the originals that came with his RMM supra brake upgrade....
He ordered the ones from Steve as well because his are warped...Thanks again, Tiny
08-08-01, 07:32 AM
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Originally posted by NVRENUFHP
In theory, extra weight will translate to longer stopping distances. But, I have a hard time believing that the few extra pounds the bigger wheels add lengthens stopping distance by an amount that is measurable with expensive testing equipment, let alone the seat of your pants. Slight variations in weather conditions or pavement would be a bigger factor than a few extra pounds.
If a few extra pounds makes so much difference on something that starts at 3700 lbs to begin with, why would pretty serious racers fit larger wheels without doing anything to their brakes. Viper boys who spend a lot of time on the track do it all the time when they swap their stock 17s for 18s, although now 18s are stock and 19s will be stock on the new one. And Vipers are a somewhat lighter than the GS, so a little weight should affect them more.
If a few pounds makes that much difference, and you want to regain the lost distance, put a little less gas in the tank. Or find wheels that, although they are bigger, are made of lighter weight alloy and therefore weigh less than stock.
The weight, in theory, adds to stopping distance. But, their is so little weight involved with bigger wheels that it can't make a noticable difference. If it did, then we could all fit 16s with tires that are as wide as the 17s and we'd stop faster than you boys with the 17s? Not likely.
And how does the wheel diameter make any difference, as suggested by someone.
In theory, extra weight will translate to longer stopping distances. But, I have a hard time believing that the few extra pounds the bigger wheels add lengthens stopping distance by an amount that is measurable with expensive testing equipment, let alone the seat of your pants. Slight variations in weather conditions or pavement would be a bigger factor than a few extra pounds.
If a few extra pounds makes so much difference on something that starts at 3700 lbs to begin with, why would pretty serious racers fit larger wheels without doing anything to their brakes. Viper boys who spend a lot of time on the track do it all the time when they swap their stock 17s for 18s, although now 18s are stock and 19s will be stock on the new one. And Vipers are a somewhat lighter than the GS, so a little weight should affect them more.
If a few pounds makes that much difference, and you want to regain the lost distance, put a little less gas in the tank. Or find wheels that, although they are bigger, are made of lighter weight alloy and therefore weigh less than stock.
The weight, in theory, adds to stopping distance. But, their is so little weight involved with bigger wheels that it can't make a noticable difference. If it did, then we could all fit 16s with tires that are as wide as the 17s and we'd stop faster than you boys with the 17s? Not likely.
And how does the wheel diameter make any difference, as suggested by someone.
Any added weight on the wheels/tires/rotors translates into about three times the same weight added elsewhere in the car. Reason being you need to accelerate/deccelerate the mass linearly as well as rotationally. For intance, if you go from the stock 17" to some Lowenharts 20", you're adding about 20-25 pounds per corner. This equals to at least 20 x 4 x 3 = 240 lbs of unsprung weight which is significant in a 3700 lbs car.
Wheel diameter by itself and within reason does not affect braking preformance.
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