Turbo'd_Wxman

Guys, many of the IS300 enthusiasts like parts of clublexus, but most will say that the reason IS300 guys don't post here is because you cannot have an opinion. Is this forum for lexus owners or is it run by it's sponsors? I have asked probably 10 different times for OLT to post pics of their climate area on the IS300 and they REFUSE. Then they send an email to one of the clublexus.com moderators like crying babies and my posts get DELETED and the thread gets locked. He has called me names over and over again with no response on my part. Look, if OLT has done it, then all they need to do is post the pictures and I will NEVER say another word. NEVER. These forums are created so people can get information, and if that ends the users will find another source.

If this site was truly created for the benefit of Lexus owners, then please let people post information. When one of your sponsors flies off the handle and cries like a little girl, then please warn them and don't lock posts. If not, then you may want to remove the IS300 section, because some of the other forums let us post as long as it remains civil. Nothing I have ever done here could be considered abrasive. I am friends with Ethan and I think he is an awesome guy. I have clublexus.com stickers on my car and I would love to continue to send people here, but I just hope clublexus can get things back on track.

If I need to post pm's from OLT and clublexus moderators to help, then just tell me who to pm.

lexispoold

iTrader: (1)

I agree, this is why I normally dont post here and stay on IS300.net, its like some mods think they have to lay down the law when nobody is doing anything to begin with.
Been on the site long enough to know things aint gonna change anytime soon and one of the reasons why there are like 3 threads a day! Ethan is a good guy and I dont think he wants HIS site run like this.

DaveGS4

iTrader: (2)

Guys as I've posted before IS300.net and CL have different rules. We enforce them more strictly here and cater to a different audience. Ethan IS a good guy, but make no mistake this is the way he wants his site run. If it's not the way you like it run (as it sounds), IS300.net may be the place for you to stay.

DaveGS4

iTrader: (2)

Wxman I agree with you on the thread being closed incorrectly and I'm going to open it back up (done). However, your 'called me names with no response' totally flies out the window when you turn around and make the 'cries like a little girl' comment. Let's keep the personal attacks and abrasive commentary (like that) OFF this forum please. IMO you're talking out of both sides of your mouth saying you don't do anything abrasive when you did just two sentences earlier!

Do you mean the locked IS cluster lighting thread on IS300.net? Yeah, I read that. If that's what you're talking about, I'd expect you to have a similar complaint in their 'site suggestions' forum and not bring that up here on CL as part of your issue with our forum.

Private messages are just that - private. Posting them is IMO a breach of a personal trust between the two parties trying to communicate outside of the forums. I for one would never want to have anything to do with you again if you posted one of mine, for example.

---------

Let's make what I feel is the root of this ongoing issue very clear. Lextech Lighting is an approved ClubLexus Sponsor. In addition to being a member, YOU are also a vendor (or are planning to be one) and offer a competing product and are not an approved ClubLexus Sponsor. Any posts you make on this topic can very easily be intepreted as simply throwing stones, disrupting LLS's business, etc at a competitor. You can certainly claim to be an expert in this field from all the work you've done and you just have a couple of questions, but many of your posts on this topic come across as confrontational and/or self-promoting of your own cluster lighting business. For example the latest post in the formerly locked thread is promotional:

I'm totally with you on what this forum should be about and putting members first. However, you see this issue quickly gets far more complex than the simple "I can't speak my mind or have an opinion" problem you stated. I could not agree more that this forum should be for the benefit of our members in all cases, but you have personal and business benefit to be gained by these posts by disparaging a competitor that goes beyond simple sharing of information with others. That is not fair to either our forum sponsor or (especially) our members.

I don't know whether you have a bias due to your competing business venture VS personally just wanting to know the answers. Since the AC & clock lights are already done in your IS by you, I'd guess it isn't for your personal use / information. If you really want to just share information with everyone and benefit all the members, why not post up a detailed DIY on how to do the AC controls and the clock and where to get the parts? You could (and probably do) have the best intentions in the world of just sharing information with everyone else, but the approach you've taken has ended up in locked threads on both IS300.net and ClubLexus.

Marc, you're been a valued member on our forum for a long time and I hope you will continue to be one in the future. I hope you can understand the complexity of the problem you've posted about and the potential conflict of interest your involvement in the Lextech IS dash lighting posts creates.

Turbo'd_Wxman

Dave, can you show me even one place that I have tried to sell my dashlight kit? Can you find even a single person who has bought a kit from me? Can you find somewhere I listed prices or anything?

I have probably 10 emails, pms, and old threads saved on my computer. I saved screen shots on my computer showing that you, OLT, and Ethan deleted pm's from my account. Now, like you said, I will keep this private, but please do not make this look like I am the agressor here. You have seen the rude and completely inappropriate things OLT has said to me. You have deleted parts of threads because he completely flew off the handle and starting calling me names. You very well know, that you and I had a conversation about his inappropriate behavior. He has told me time and time again that he changed the color of the lighting on the climate area of the IS300. I have asked him nearly 10 times for pictures! HE REFUSES and then calls me a liar. He says that many clublexus.com members have seen it. THEN WHY WON'T HE POST PICS? If I said I had a turbo on my car and someone said they didn't believe me, then I would post pics to prove it!!!!! Why won't OLT? Why doesn't he have them on his website? Why does he start calling me names when I ask for pics?

I will be honest and say that clublexus.com is much worse off because of OLT. I am sorry if that offends anyone, but it is honest. He has started more flame wars in the last month than I have ever seen in the almost 3 years I have been on clublexus.com. All I ever asked is if he had pictures of the climate area to post them for us to see. When he starts flaming me and calling me names, then I post pics that I have done it and it can be done. That is it. I never post a pic saying don't buy from OLT, but buy from me. I know the difficulties in the IS300 lighting and I am trying to make sure that if OLT says they can do it that no one will get ripped off. That is it! If he showed pictures a month ago when I first asked, I would have never said another word. But OLT has called me names for it, called me a backyard installer, insulted me and many IS300 guys like UnVme, etc. He has told me that if I want to see pictures of it, then "I have pay to play". It goes on and on, and I have the threads all saved on my computer if OLT denies it.

I have been on this website for nearly 3 years now. I have even helped organize big meets for clublexus.com in Texas and I have had dinner with my friend Ethan. I am VERY disappointed with the way that I have been treated and the way the moderators have allowed OLT to treat me with no warning. If you guys think this is my fault, then it is just sad that it has to end this way. To say anything other than crying like a baby is really to use weaker words to describe the truth of his behavior. Instead of showing pictures, he has gone to clublexus.com and IS300.net to try to get my posts deleted. Isn't that what kids do? When they don't get their way, they pitch a fit. If you think my choice of words is off, then I appologize... but I don't really know a better way to describe the situation.

DaveGS4

iTrader: (2)

Marc,

I haven't gone through your entire reply yet, but I'd like you to know that none of us (administrators or moderators) have any access whatsoever to your private messages to either read or delete them. I find your accusation that I (or Ethan or OLT) deleted anything from your PM box terribly insulting and downright paranoid. I am angry beyond words that you would insult our integrity like that so I'll stop typing about that for right now and let LS400 handle it (thanks).

I for one have seen the pictures OLT mentions with a white LCD clock on an IS and they weren't hard to find. I think his ignorning you may be the best thing at this point. If you recall, I asked you to do the same to try to diffuse what seems to be a recurring situation. By your own admission, you ARE the aggressor in the situation. 1) OLT posts about something he's doing for the IS and then you 2) 'ask him nearly 10 times for pictures'. That sounds like harassment to me and if he doesn't want to respond to you he won't. He knows you are a competing vendor and doesn't want to hand you his pictures, despite what you describe as your self-appointed role as IS300 dash lighting consumer fraud protection advocate. He and you have some stressed history and you obviously like pushing his buttons over and over again.

I totally agree that the name calling needs to stop on all accounts.

LS400

That's interesting...you're making accusations that administrators have accessed and tampered with your account (according to my knowledge, there hasn't been case where that has happened). vBulletin does not allow even administrators to access members' private messages nor does it show you a members' password (much of the members' personal information is still kept confidential even to administrators). Please email the administrators (Dave, Ethan, Lord of the Celsiors and myself) the "saved screen shots on [your] computer showing that [Dave], OLT, and Ethan deleted pm's from [your] account". Or, you can post the pictures in public if you would like (non-tampered images).

I have not seen the discussion(s) between you and O.L.T. so I cannot comment there.

Now, the administration team will be investigating this matter between you and O.L.T. If you would like us to obtain a better view of your standpoint, then please send us the threads/links to where you think O.L.T. is at fault.

Turbo'd_Wxman

You can say what you will about me being an aggressor. I simply and politely asked if he had done the climate. He called me names. I told him I didn't want this to turn into a flame match and asked again if he would show pictures. MANY .net members came in and asked the same thing. He refused to show pictures. Look, if you think this is me, then this is the end of the conversation. I did nothing wrong. You still say I am a competing vendor. WHERE HAVE I SOLD THIS? DO YOU KNOW ONE PERSON THAT I HAVE SOLD IT TO? Just one? Then I am not a vendor!

What is your email because I will send you some of the screen caps showing static911 and O.L.T. deleted emails.

LS400

Please send them to: LS400@clublexus.com.

Turbo'd_Wxman

You have an email.

LS400

Turbo_Wxman, I recieved your email and the pictures. I will address those images here, but I will not post them up (posting them publically is your decision).

A private message that is cancelled by its sender is not equivalent to being deleted. A sender has the option of cancelling his own private message (as a result of various reasons the member may have). In this case, I'm not sure what the reasons are but if Static911 and O.L.T. desire to cancel their own messages because of their own reasons, then they have the right to do so (any member can cancel a message that they have just sent).

From my interpretation and understanding so far, your account has not been tampered with and personal messages and emails have not been deleted by anyone.

But...the issue still exists between you and O.L.T. That issue is still being looked into.

Static911

Marc,

Let me chime in as I was alerted about this thread. Yes, I have met you and took you out to dinner in the PHR/MVP TX meet back in 2002. I classified you as a guy who is a very successful entrepreneur since you are able to see needs and address them and you are very focused.

There are many things for me to address; however, in this one post, I want to address specifically about me deleting Marc's PMs, as he referred twice in this therad.

You can email the screenshots to me at ekay@clublexus.com of me deleting your email and put a return receipt on your email to confirm I did recieve and read your email. I recommend you post the pictures in public, specifically in this thread, about me, Ethan Kay, wanting to actual waste my time to log into your account on ClubLexus.com to delete PMs. For the record, I have never done it nor want to do it since owning ClubLexus.com because there are things called "privacy" unless someone's life is in danger, which I highly doubt that will ever happen. The funny thing is I never had any interaction with you except for the Featured Car (which you are only one of the few to give your pictures and write-up in a timely fashion) and a few other things.

In my humble opinion, if someone is lying, making false accusations, or maliciously screwed around with Marc's account on ClubLexus.com, it will get ugly for them on ClubLexus.

I will post later about addressing some of the other concerns posted in this thread after I read it further; I only briefly glanced at the other posts. Frankly, I like to address everything in this thread since I would have to address it in the future. Also, the information posted in this thread will be used/posted in our next major upgrade to ClubLexus v5.0.

Anyhow, let us keep interacting and come to the bottom of this/these situation(s).

Turbo'd_Wxman

Ok, I understand the email's being canceled now. I didn't completely understand the meaning behind that. I know that the OLT message was blasting me and now I cannot see it. I have sent you two other emails asking Dave to help stop OLT from his attacks and to OLT asking him to please stop the attacks on the board.

Turbo'd_Wxman

Ethan, LS400 has cleared up how the pm's got deleted. They were canceled from the sender. I was unaware what this meant and I thought it meant someone had deleted pms from my account. I obviously owe you an appology for that.

DaveGS4

iTrader: (2)

OK, so I guess I get no apology for your maligning my integrity too That's OK, I'm over it now that you've come clean over the issue . Now onto the next one...

I was very clear in my inital post that I didn't know if you had sold anything yet, but you were obviously preparing to become one. Whether you've sold one or not yet, you still have the same vested business interest because of your plans to become one.

Want some proof? OK, here you go.

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...threadid=62300 Introduction on CL. No, you don't go into details on selling here, but you and I traded some PMs over that very topic about becoming a vendor and not trying to sell this item on CL.

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...hreadid=100813 When people refer others to you it's pretty widely known... here's why:

http://www.is300.net/modules.php?nam...pic&t=13314113
http://www.is300.net/modules.php?nam...905&highlight=
Note that I'm posting the IS300 quotes and links not because you broke our forum rules about selling here (it's obviously a different forum and they don't apply), but to point out how ludicrious it is that you continue to deny having any business-related motivation in this issue. I say you're a vendor when you start gathering interest for the stuff you're selling and making obvious promotional posts about it.

I'm going to hand this over to Ethan to resolve with you since we can't seem to agree on some pretty basic points of contention here. If you want to foward Ethan any of the PMs I sent you a while back on this topic, feel free to.