emas

Am looking at the new ES 350 to replace my 10 year old Acura TL-S. One of the issues I am struggling with is that they use (nuluxe) Vinal in a $45k car? Curious what experience other owners are having with their Vinal vs traditional Leather? The dealer told me that it "was a type of leather", so now I don't trust anything they tell me.
Thanks,

lesz

The NuLuxe is definitely not leather. That said, it is a very nice fake leather. When Lexus first started to use the NuLuxe, one of my concerns had to do with its durability, but the reports from people who have it in cars that have been in use for several years are very positive with regard to how well it holds up. Also, I think it has a nice feel to it compared to that of other fake leathers.

To me, the biggest downside of the NuLuxe would be that, if you want to have a very well-equipped ES, you cannot buy one with a good number of the options unless you move up to the Luxury package with real leather or the Ultra Luxury package with the semi-aniline leather.

emas

Thanks. I didn't think that the Luxury package had real leather?

lesz

Yes, the Luxury Package definitely has real leather, and the Ultra Luxury Package has semi-aniline leather.

It is only the base ES or Premium Package ES that has the NuLuxe.

In general, a base or Premium Package 2017 ES will likely have a MSRP in the $40,000 to $43,000 range. A Luxury Package ES is likely to have a MSRP in the $45,000 to $46,000 range, and an Ultra Luxury Package ES is likely to have a MSRP in the range of $49,000 to a little over $50,000.

TechNut

We have an ES-300h with the NuLuxe. Since the hybrid equipment also adds several thousand dollars to the price of the car, they are probably configured often with the Premium package rather than Luxury or Ultra Luxury to keep the price down in the mid 40s.

As to the answer to your question, I don't mind the NuLuxe material as much as I thought I would. We have now traded in our RX with leather for an NX with NuLuxe so both of our present cars are NuLuxe. Frankly, many guests in our cars cannot even tell the difference and just assume leather until we correct them. It is certainly a good quality facsimile, with all the basic attributes except for the leather smell. I will say that our most recent RX didn't have the same quality leather as our previous RX. If I were to guess, I would say they are using thinner animal hides. As a result, the leather seats developed some light lines along the stretch marks of the animal hide. Using good conditioners and cleaners will help mitigate this, but there is no getting around nature and all animal hides are going to have stretch marks that will eventually show. As of the two year point, our oldest NuLuxe equipped vehicle shows no such lines but our previous leather RX was already showing flaws by this point.

Bottom line, I wouldn't worry about the NuLuxe as in my experience it holds up better than leather. I still like the leather smell but it wears off after a year or so anyway. And as lesz has already stated, if you want to move up the option list you will end up with leather anyway.

chuckNX

I have NuLuxe in both my Lexus (NX and CT) and leather in my BMW.

To be honest, I think the NuLuxe is much more easier to keep clean and looks just as good. I park my NX outside all the time and I don't need to worry about leather conditioner, drying out, stretching, or cracking, etc.

First time I ever had vinyl seats and I don't really have an issue with it. Most people don't even know the difference as the material quality has greatly improved over the years.

ut2sua

There were lots of discussions that can be found in ClubLexus by searching for "leather vs nuluxe". The general agreement was: Nuluxe was pretty good versus real leather. It definitely is not a cheap vinyl. In the 2017 model, if you don't see white stitching at the bottom of the seat, it is nuluxe. If it will make you feel better, Mercedes and BMW have used synthetic leather for many years on most of their cars. I ended up getting leather in my car for not much extra because the dealers where I live put in so many extra options that blur the line between the packages. So if you want real leather, just ask for either a luxury or ultra luxury package, and you will get it. In my estimation I feel like I paid roughly $500 extra for leather (of course, I had to pay for other options that comes with the car that has leather).

chromedome

Nuluxe is loads better than faux-leather materials like MBTex and whatever vinyl thing BMW uses. It looks classy in dark colors and doesn't get hot in summer like leather. I love the stuff because it's so easy to clean and care for, just wipe down stains with a damp microfiber towel. If you have young kids in the car, Nuluxe makes it easy to deal with nasty stuff like spilled milk, vomit and busted diapers

LS430inDE.

I would never settle (knowingly) for fake leather seats when paying $40k+ in any vehicle, let alone a Lexus. Never. I'm going to go out on a limb and say some Lexus owners of vehicles upholstered with the NuLux didn't even KNOW it was fake leather.

All the 'advantages' you guys talk about with ease of cleanup, etc, are identical to that of the leather on cars now. The car's seating surfaces aren't suede! Genuine leather used in modern car seats (GM, Toyota, BMW, Hyundai, take your pick) all have great cleanup capabilities and all are comfortable in moderately severe temperatures. Say what you want, but on a blazing hot summer day given the same circumstances, the fake leather will be just as scorching as the genuine leather.

For all those who are happy with the fake leather I ask, would you have similar feelings when buying a ring from Tiffany? Would you settle for a 1ct cubic zirconia (fake diamond) and a white or yellow gold band and dish out $10k? Hold the comments like, "I'd never buy a ring from Tiffany", etc

Regardless all the claims of how durable, ease of cleanup, quality in appearance, etc, I find it absurd Lexus cheapens the car with fake leather.

Do you think this would have been acceptable to compete in the luxury car market in 1993? In 2001? Lexus has shown, repeatedly, they have simply turned into another auto manufacturer without anything exclusive as they once used to be.

To pay $40k+ for a Lexus with fake leather is identical to happily paying $10k for a diamond looking ring, fitted with a cubic zirconia, from Tiffany. Personally, I find it unacceptable and those who do accept it and are satisfied with fulfilling low expectations. I guess that's why God created chocolate, vanilla, and strawberry.

But gee wiz does Tiffany make a great looking cubic zirconia that's easy to clean and won't chip or break!

JDR76

I had NuLuxe on my IS and am back to leather on my GS. If my GS had been available with NuLuxe, I would have gotten it. I prefer NuLuxe over the leather.

The reason why I liked the NuLuxe in my IS was that I found it to be softer than the leather in my GS, and after 2+ years there wasn't so much as a wrinkle or crease. All I ever did to clean it was vacuum and wipe it with a wet cloth.

I'm not sure how to compare this with the Tiffany's ring question. If I'm setting out to buy a diamond ring, then yes, I would only purchase a real diamond, not a fake one.

If selecting NuLuxe makes it a "fake car" then I can't equate. My experience with NuLuxe was great and I'd highly recommend it. I found it to be a luxuriously soft and durable seat covering, much more so than what is offered by Mercedes and BMW.

lesz

After many years of leather seating being standard on the ES, I suspect that a major reason why Lexus decided to offer NuLuxe on the ES is that they wanted to still be able to advertise the ES as a car with a base MSRP of under $40,000, and they thought that making the leather optional was the best way to do so.

I find it amusing, though, that, when Lexus announced the NuLuxe, they were touting it as being an option for those whose views about the environment and animal rights made them oppose the use of leather.

As I said in my earlier post, the NuLuxe is an excellent fake leather, and, when I was buying my 2017 ES, I would not have minded if it had the NuLuxe if you could have had things like the nicer stitching, the wood trim on the console, the driver's seat thigh extension, etc. without either the standard leather of the semi-aniline leather, but that it isn't the case. A good number of nice features and options are only available with the leather seating that comes with either the Luxury or UL package.

It may be the case that the NuLuxe has a softer feel than does the standard leather, but I wouldn't say that the same thing is true for the semi-aniline leather that comes with the UL package. With my 2017 UL ES, I'd have a hard time telling by feel/softness where the leather seating surfaces end and where the fake leather on the sides of the seats starts. I'd describe the level of softness of the NuLuxe and of the semi-aniline leather as being very similar.

JDR76

Yes, I agree. The semi-aniline leather is very nice/soft. My GS is an F Sport so it does not have the semi-aniline leather.

dchar

You make it seem Lexus is the only luxury carmaker offering vinyl as standard and leather as optional, and those cars cost considerably more than the ES (starts at $38900). Mercedes offers vinyl as standard in the C (starts at $39500), E class (starts at $52150), GLA (starts at $32800), GLC (starts at $39150), GLE (starts at $52000), and GLS (starts at $67000). BMW offers vinyl as standard in the 2 (starts at $33150), 3 (starts at $33450), 4 (starts at $41950), 5-series (starts at $50200), X1 (starts at $32800), X3 (starts at $33100), X4 (starts at $45550), and X5 (starts at $55500). Making vinyl the standard trim is becoming a trend in the luxury market. Most people can't even tell the difference, so why not allow those people to save a bit of money. Cars are getting more expensive due to better tech and more features, so to sell at $40K car makers need to cut cost somewhere. Using Nuluxe isn't that bad of an option.

Eventually, I wouldn't be surprised if the market moves towards man-made leathers. Upholstering cars with real cowhide just isn't sustainable or very environmentally friendly. Nuluxe isn't too far off from matching the quality of real leather.

LS430inDE.

I hear you. I might do a little research to see if your post is 100% accurate, because I'd be very surprised if the E-Class and 5-series offer leather as an option and at an added cost.

Also, regarding what all the "other" brands do?...is meaningless. At least, it used to be meaningless what the 'other' luxury brands were doing.

In the 1980's is when Lexus observed what all the "other" luxury brands were doing, and Lexus came to market NOT doing with the others did. Lexus did it BETTER. Hence, as many of you have seen my posts, I believe Lexus indeed lost it's luster from what created them as stand out and highly desirable luxury brand in the 90's and 2000's.

I appreciate your perspective!

LS430inDE.

Amen!! Disappointing to say the least, as you're dishing out $45k for vinyl seats, isn't it? I have the same disposition.

At least you have some honesty in your feelings. Like me, you aren't an ES owner yet. Careful, you might become a fanboy and lose all credibility after you drop over 40LARGE on a Lexus with leatherette seats, lol.