Roof fails during movement (DTC Code B2536); Solution including truck latch removal
06-08-12, 07:42 AM
#32
Moderator
Hey johnnycakes....what Habious said....inquiring minds want to know all the details. BTW some believe a picture is worth a thousand words...the picture you posted is about 997 words short. We're just waiting for the rest of them. I've heard there may have been some giggling and skipping regarding the success on this DIY repair. 
Is that true?
Is that true?
06-08-12, 09:32 AM
#33
Racer
Thread Starter
Well, really it was pretty easy. First, I held the flashlight and pointed it at where Habious was working. Then, when he moved, I trained the flashlight on the new area. Sometimes he'd say, "Hold this right here" and I did. Occasionally, it would be, "Get me the 10mm wrench." Before I knew it, my top worked flawlessly.
EDITED TO ADD: Oh, and I bought the pizza.
MODERATOR ADDED: and chicken fingers
EDITED TO ADD: Oh, and I bought the pizza.
MODERATOR ADDED: and chicken fingers
Last edited by Habious; 06-08-12 at 12:47 PM. Reason: Forgot most important part
06-08-12, 10:15 AM
#34
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^, funny, I need a Habious. Where were y'all three months ago when I had a similar problem? Lexus dealer diagnosed it as a faulty top ECU and I talked them down to just under $2000! Ouch. Now, after reading this thread, makes me wonder if it was just a switch afterall? Ouch!
06-08-12, 11:59 AM
#35
OK...here we go. A little write-up with some pics.
I'm going to give a general how-it-should-be-done. As this was our first time taking this part of the car apart, I'm not going to give a step-by-step of what we DID...but, how we would do it the second time (knowing now how stuff comes apart and goes back together).
Remove the tool tray on the floor of the trunk, the little carpet-covered plastic side trays (that have to come out to get the tool tray out), the edge piece that is on the top of the inside of the trunk lip, and the back inside carpeted piece on the back wall of the inside of the trunk. If you really need a step-by-step on how to get these pieces off, this probably isn't a do-it-yourself job you should tackle.
Once you have access to the truck latch assembly, there are two nuts (12mm) that are inside the latch assembly (see picture below - red arrows point to the location of the nuts, yellow arrow points to the location of said 12mm wrench)
Next picture (below) shows a top-down view of the latch assembly. Here you can better see the location of the 2 nuts to remove (left one has already been removed in this pic).
There's a big, cable-driven piston that moves the latch assembly when the truck is going up (backwards) when the convertible top is going up or down. You need to remove the cable assembly from the bracket. We tried to just remove the bracket (keeping the cable adjustment in place), but you can't get enough clearance doing this. You need to remove the cable from the bracket. Loosen the TOP nut only (17mm, I think), making sure the bottom nut doesn't move (to retain the adjustment location). Once you have the cable assembly out of the bracket, tighten the top nut back down onto the bottom nut...again, MAKE SURE the bottom nut doesn't move.
There's a plastic cover over the latch assembly...yank it off (below)
There are two zip-ties holding the cable out of the way of the moving parts inside the latch assembly. Note where they are (so you can put new ones in when you're done) and cut them. You're cutting TWO zip-ties, total...but there are THREE (find the third, note it's location, and don't cut it)
Here's a different view, showing the other zip-tie that needs to be cut (below)
Now, at this point, I'm going to veer off the pictures for a moment...this is the learning-curve portion of our program. I'm going to tell you what you SHOULD do...not what we did (at least, at first).
If you look at the picture above, and the picture below, you'll notice a big honkin' cotter pin that's holding the piston end of the cable assembly onto the trunk latch.
Take out the cotter pin and slide the piston sideways off the pin. Also, reach inside with a pair of needle-nose pliers and pop the cable for the emergency trunk release (you'll see it, it's obvious - left side of the assembly on the inside). I found that it was easier to remove the cable housing from the bracket...which gives you slack in the cable...then, using the pliers, get the end of the cable out of the little hooky-thingy.
Once you've done this...the whole bracket assembly can come out of the car, and you can work on it at any angle, and not breaking your back, bending over the trunk lid for 40 minutes.
There's one additional connector that's unrelated to the switch (and our problem), but it's part of the harness that we replaced (see below). Connector just pops out.
OK, now, looking at the next two pictures (below), we see the switch (it's turquoise- isn't it cute!?!) (blue arrow in picture). It's held in place by a screw and a nut. Screw is on the back side of the assembly, nut is on the front side. Screw and nut come out, switch comes loose.
It took a little finagling to get the switch out of the assembly but, it comes out (and the new one goes in)..just takes a little work.
After that, we pretty much just reversed the steps and put it all back together.
There's some play in the switch mounting location (you can see on the last pic that the mounting holes for the switch are slots, not round holes). If you flick the latch back and forth, you can see it engage (or not engage) the switch. Just make sure that the switch is fully closed in one position, and fully open in the other. The part of the latch that actuates the switch swings a pretty good distance so, you won't need your micrometer to make this adjustment. There's a ton of wiggle room. Just make sure it's fully on one way, and fully off the other.
I'm going to give a general how-it-should-be-done. As this was our first time taking this part of the car apart, I'm not going to give a step-by-step of what we DID...but, how we would do it the second time (knowing now how stuff comes apart and goes back together).
Remove the tool tray on the floor of the trunk, the little carpet-covered plastic side trays (that have to come out to get the tool tray out), the edge piece that is on the top of the inside of the trunk lip, and the back inside carpeted piece on the back wall of the inside of the trunk. If you really need a step-by-step on how to get these pieces off, this probably isn't a do-it-yourself job you should tackle.
Once you have access to the truck latch assembly, there are two nuts (12mm) that are inside the latch assembly (see picture below - red arrows point to the location of the nuts, yellow arrow points to the location of said 12mm wrench)
Next picture (below) shows a top-down view of the latch assembly. Here you can better see the location of the 2 nuts to remove (left one has already been removed in this pic).
There's a big, cable-driven piston that moves the latch assembly when the truck is going up (backwards) when the convertible top is going up or down. You need to remove the cable assembly from the bracket. We tried to just remove the bracket (keeping the cable adjustment in place), but you can't get enough clearance doing this. You need to remove the cable from the bracket. Loosen the TOP nut only (17mm, I think), making sure the bottom nut doesn't move (to retain the adjustment location). Once you have the cable assembly out of the bracket, tighten the top nut back down onto the bottom nut...again, MAKE SURE the bottom nut doesn't move.
There's a plastic cover over the latch assembly...yank it off (below)
There are two zip-ties holding the cable out of the way of the moving parts inside the latch assembly. Note where they are (so you can put new ones in when you're done) and cut them. You're cutting TWO zip-ties, total...but there are THREE (find the third, note it's location, and don't cut it)
Here's a different view, showing the other zip-tie that needs to be cut (below)
Now, at this point, I'm going to veer off the pictures for a moment...this is the learning-curve portion of our program. I'm going to tell you what you SHOULD do...not what we did (at least, at first).
If you look at the picture above, and the picture below, you'll notice a big honkin' cotter pin that's holding the piston end of the cable assembly onto the trunk latch.
Take out the cotter pin and slide the piston sideways off the pin. Also, reach inside with a pair of needle-nose pliers and pop the cable for the emergency trunk release (you'll see it, it's obvious - left side of the assembly on the inside). I found that it was easier to remove the cable housing from the bracket...which gives you slack in the cable...then, using the pliers, get the end of the cable out of the little hooky-thingy.
Once you've done this...the whole bracket assembly can come out of the car, and you can work on it at any angle, and not breaking your back, bending over the trunk lid for 40 minutes.
There's one additional connector that's unrelated to the switch (and our problem), but it's part of the harness that we replaced (see below). Connector just pops out.
OK, now, looking at the next two pictures (below), we see the switch (it's turquoise- isn't it cute!?!) (blue arrow in picture). It's held in place by a screw and a nut. Screw is on the back side of the assembly, nut is on the front side. Screw and nut come out, switch comes loose.
It took a little finagling to get the switch out of the assembly but, it comes out (and the new one goes in)..just takes a little work.
After that, we pretty much just reversed the steps and put it all back together.
There's some play in the switch mounting location (you can see on the last pic that the mounting holes for the switch are slots, not round holes). If you flick the latch back and forth, you can see it engage (or not engage) the switch. Just make sure that the switch is fully closed in one position, and fully open in the other. The part of the latch that actuates the switch swings a pretty good distance so, you won't need your micrometer to make this adjustment. There's a ton of wiggle room. Just make sure it's fully on one way, and fully off the other.
06-08-12, 12:10 PM
#36
Well, really it was pretty easy. First, I held the flashlight and pointed it at where Habious was working. Then, when he moved, I trained the flashlight on the new area. Sometimes he'd say, "Hold this right here" and I did. Occasionally, it would be, "Get me the 10mm wrench." Before I knew it, my top worked flawlessly.
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coolcar (11-23-20)
06-08-12, 12:50 PM
#37
Moderator
Excellent work, and a wonderfully detailed/documented DIY. Oh...Johnny you done good too! Getting and keeping that light in just the right position, avoiding shadows which could obscure the view during a delicate surgery are important skills too. And, more importantly, bringing the right sustenance so the surgeon is not distracted by pangs of hunger, showed great consideration for the member of your team.
! Getting and keeping that light in just the right position, avoiding shadows which could obscure the view during a delicate surgery are important skills too. And, more importantly, bringing the right sustenance so the surgeon is not distracted by pangs of hunger, showed great consideration for the member of your team.
08-02-12, 11:55 PM
#39
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I've got a roof issue but it seems to me more like an alignment problem. Simply put, the roof catches or snags - right at the position where the roof meets the top of the windshield. Sequence below:
1. I want to drop the top. I hold down the button (or double click with luxlink), trunk does its part fine and then the roof attempts to lift off and fold itself in to the trunk.
2. Roof unlatches maybe 2 inches and tries to pull itself loose and catches/snags. At this point, a good hard shove will unlatch the roof from the windshield and it will drop in to the trunk fine. When I close the roof back up, again works fine. I don't like the "hard shove" method, especially because immediately following the hard shove is an awful pop from the point of snagging (i'm guessing the power is fine, its really trying to unhook itself, hence the pop at release)
3. An alternative method to make it uncatch/unhook itself is to hold the button down to drop the top, wait for it to snag, then press the button to close the top so the roof goes back down (the two inches it went before it snags) to the windshield, then press open again, and it unsnags itself on the second attempt and works fine. This is the current method I'm using. Problem showed up maybe a few months ago.
I dont see any obstructions on the hooks or on the roof - any suggestions? Gracias in advance Bob!
1. I want to drop the top. I hold down the button (or double click with luxlink), trunk does its part fine and then the roof attempts to lift off and fold itself in to the trunk.
2. Roof unlatches maybe 2 inches and tries to pull itself loose and catches/snags. At this point, a good hard shove will unlatch the roof from the windshield and it will drop in to the trunk fine. When I close the roof back up, again works fine. I don't like the "hard shove" method, especially because immediately following the hard shove is an awful pop from the point of snagging (i'm guessing the power is fine, its really trying to unhook itself, hence the pop at release)
3. An alternative method to make it uncatch/unhook itself is to hold the button down to drop the top, wait for it to snag, then press the button to close the top so the roof goes back down (the two inches it went before it snags) to the windshield, then press open again, and it unsnags itself on the second attempt and works fine. This is the current method I'm using. Problem showed up maybe a few months ago.
I dont see any obstructions on the hooks or on the roof - any suggestions? Gracias in advance Bob!
08-03-12, 12:24 AM
#40
Moderator
Hmmm....sounds like the roof latching mechanism is in need of some lubrication....or the motor is short on a revolution to fully retract the latches when opening. I am away from my FSM materials ... but this is going to take some exploratory diagnostics and removal of some of the interior roof garnish.
There is a manual release/lock port, and the tool to operate it is in the trunk. The test once the interior is exposed would be to see if the latches are fully retracting on the open command. You'd also want to inspect for lubrication and oxidation or foreign matter in all moving parts associated with the roof latches and motor.
There is a manual release/lock port, and the tool to operate it is in the trunk. The test once the interior is exposed would be to see if the latches are fully retracting on the open command. You'd also want to inspect for lubrication and oxidation or foreign matter in all moving parts associated with the roof latches and motor.
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