Tabaka

iTrader: (8)

Does anyone else have bad rust issues on their front subframe/k-frame? Mine is pretty bad and I noticed two bolts are completely missing and rattled out. I'll highlight the section below which shows the specific region of my issue. The entire front section of the K-frame has completely rusted underneath from scraping and long winters. Does the engine or transmission rest on either one of these pieces which would cause major vibration with the cracks and mising bolts?



Thanks team I have an extra one in my garage but have been postponing the job to find out if this was the cause of my engine and shifter/tranny vibration.

gerrb

iTrader: (34)

Any loose metals would surely cause rattling / noise. That probably adds up to the noise you hear.

The engine mounts are bolted on that engine support (rear part on your picture) . On our cars , that engine support comes first if you are standing in-front of the car.

The cross member (black part in your picture) keeps the front of the car together .

Both engine support and cross member are firmly bolted on each side of the car.

Ali SC3

iTrader: (10)

the motor mounts to the Circular part on the top part with the bolt hole in the middle pretty much right where the head of the red arrow is. It would def cause major vibration if it can move around also the steering rack is mounted to that if I remember right.

Tabaka

iTrader: (8)

This might explain a lot of what's going on.

In idle, no engine vibration.

Press on gas in idle or moving, the steering wheel shakes like it's possessed, the car rattles, and the shifter moves around. The car idles fine and the engine sounds smooth.

The car hasn't moved in a year as I've been too scared to drive it. Now that Spring is around the corner I might get the problem fixed. However, I didn't want to spent $500 in labor only to find out that it wasn't my issue in the first place. Most shops are averaging 4 - 5 hours to change the entire front subframe.

This all happened one day out of the blue. I think what might have happened is I downshifted hard and it was enough to rattle those K-Frame bolts right out and boom, my subframe is no longer attached together. And because of that, the steering rack is no longer secure along with the engine mounts.

What do you guys think? If I spend the $500 and it's not the problem I won't consider it a waste since it's a safety issue. However, money is tighter than ever these days.

97-SC300

iTrader: (17)

Get it fixed and enjoy your car man.

Ali SC3

iTrader: (10)

maybe post a picture of it, it depends how rusted it is, if its just surface rust there is a chance you can just rebolt it back down with some new bolts and washers then it might be ok and could stop the rattling.
On the other hand if the crossmember is bent out of shape or rusted through where it would possibly break while driving, then you might be better off with a replacement.

that part you circled is sort of a brace across the 2. they should still have a bunch of other bolts going through them on both sides so maybe its not responsible for all the issues you are experiencing.

Tabaka

iTrader: (8)

It's rusted all the way thru along the bottom and where both connect. If I push on the k-frame hard enough with my finger I could poke a hole thru it.

It's bad.

The only bolts that are missing is where I circled, both bolts.

There are no other symptoms with the car. If I push on the accelerator, the steering wheel and shifter shakes violently. I have full power, no smoke, etc. At first I thought it was a misfire, changed all the plugs, wires, etc, it changed nothing. That's when I thought that the problem might have been in front of my face the whole time with a rusted subframe, It isn't supporting the engine weight or power when the gas is pushed.

This is the only logical thing that makes sense at this point. What else could cause a steering wheel and shifter to rattle uncontrollably with acceleration? Oumar looked at the car once and changed the crank pulley and it didn't do anything.

Ali SC3

iTrader: (10)

Its probably a good place to start, but while I was down there I would be giving everything a good look over cause you don't want to pay that labor twice. if the rack or rack bushings are shot then that would be a good time to do that since they will be right there anyways. The large crossmember bolts are supposed to be re-torqued every once in a while from underneath the car, usually toyota/lexus would check these on a every whatever amount of services and hit them with the impact gun, and there is also a black bar on one side that goes between the 2 parts of the crossmember on some 5 speed years as an extra brace (you can sort of see a part of it under the red circle, hardly noticeable from this angle), which sort of makes me think if they added it then it was probably for a reason like vibrations.

Its possible those main crossmember bolts to the frame, the very large ones, could also be a little loose and tightening those back up would remove alot of the play. I have gotten under to torque mine up before but found them to be in spec, but there was a thread with pictures where people were saying it helped, can't seem to find it but it was in the suspension section.

Crank pulley goes out on all of us eventually, I have been lucky haven't had to do it so far but its def one of those 2jz things that can cause random problems and then the car just dies one day.

CatManD3W

iTrader: (18)

Did you pull the engine out of the car......It will be much easier to see how rusted it is.....

This should help to visualize how it is....you should be fine just to replace the back black piece.....the front is aluminum so you dont have to worry about it rusting




My car had 169k on it when I started working on it and i'll let the pics speak for themselves regarding the rack and pinion bushings.....

Tabaka

iTrader: (8)

The "black" brace is the main concern as this piece is completely rusted thru. It's softer than a graham cracker right now. I can literally poke a hole thru almost any section of it with my finger. The solid front piece that holds the motor mounts is fine. However, the section in my circled area in my original post shows my problem area. Where the two sections bolt together, it has missing bolts and both connection sections are cracked from rust.

I'll take detailed photos over the weekend and show you guys the current condition. I'm not in any hurry as the car hasn't moved in over a year. I'd just like to drive it at some point in 2015 instead of watching it rot in the garage.

scblackout

iTrader: (2)

I read your post last night and it got me interested, so while we had the car on the rack today we checked for rust and found none. Honestly we were surprised at the lack of rust anywhere on the car for its age, at least I got lucky there. Not sure if your problem is unusual but for mine at least, the rust is not there.

Tabaka

iTrader: (8)

A mechanic stopped by my house and gave me a quote of $300 dollar to replace the crossmember K-Frame (black piece). I thought it was a bit high, but so does every consumer when receiving an estimate. Then I started thinking that I could do this myself. However, it's a bit nerve wrecking as I have no air tools and those bolts are probably seized by rust and 20 years of loving. I'll probably just pay the piper and have him do this. He also said it would be a great time to replace the engine mounts as he noticed some excessive engine movement....there goes another $120.00 in parts ($60 each). Of course, the labor is not included with the $300 estimate and it's probably another few hundred dollars. Then the lower control arm bushings are shot and I noticed a bit of play on the driver side. So, I might as well get good condition used ones from a seller that I know who presses poly bushings. That's another $370.00 for two. I know that's going to cost a few hundred dollars as well in labor. So basically, I'm probably looking at $1,200'ish to replace the crossmember, engine mounts, and control arms. Then, I still need a new rack and pinion, power steering pump, rear calipers, and new coil overs. To get this car back on the road, I need $2,500 which I don't have.

And you guys wonder why I hate this car and modify my signature verbiage with a new disease annually lol.

#tabakalife

Ali SC3

iTrader: (10)

that def is a lot of stuff but doable, good luck just knock it out one at a time. I would just start with the crossmember and mounts, and if you can make it happen just get the supra control arms and skip the poly stuff, that way you will get a new ball joint and have quieter rubber bushings. If you really like poly then go for it but I wish I had just gotten new oem arms.

CatManD3W

iTrader: (18)

You are not daily driving this car so just do it a piece at a time.....buy one control arm at a time if you have too!

Ramblerman

Cost me $122.00 out of texas for rear brace & $100.00 to have it installed. part came with original paint & wrapped in a Mexican language newspaper. It ties the rear of the LCA's together & IS fairly easy to replace. The tab that is rusted off just holds a line basicly. hardest part is getting rear cam bolt out of control arm bushing. Might be a good time to rebush your LCA's while you at it.