2JZGE Na-T TT Ecu Mod
02-17-14, 03:14 PM
#1411
try wiring up the new one to the right spot, if you aren't seeing around 14.8 at idle in closed loop then something is wrong with the o2 sensor and could be throwing off the ecu as the ecu relies heavily on the sensor in closed loop. also I think the wires are shielded on the original o2's so don't let the signal wire inside touch the shielding wrapped on the outside or else the readings will be all wrong as the shielding from the ecu side is grounded.
I made that mistake because one time I wasn't using the extra o2 sensor connector with the AEM so I just cut the single wire off with a wire cutter, and I didn't realize when I did that where it was cut the shielding was touching the inside wire, so it was actually messing with the o2 readings on that line and also other sensor's like the map sensor were a bit erratic also.
4 wire is easy. 1 signal wire is already there.
For the heater, one wire gets +12v switched black/red wire in engine bay or at ecu, the other wire goes to the ecu for the heater pin B71, so the ecu can decide when to turn on and off the heater.
4th wire is just a regular ground If I remember right.
the single wire will get the job done though cause the ecu sort of remembers the trims and the turbo heats up the sensor pretty quick I have used both and both will work. I would say get the new one you have working for now, and then worry about the 4 wire heated type. You can also get a M18x1.5 plug at the hardware or auto store its a metal exhaust plug and that will fit right into the extra o2 sensor bungs on the downpipe.
I made that mistake because one time I wasn't using the extra o2 sensor connector with the AEM so I just cut the single wire off with a wire cutter, and I didn't realize when I did that where it was cut the shielding was touching the inside wire, so it was actually messing with the o2 readings on that line and also other sensor's like the map sensor were a bit erratic also.
4 wire is easy. 1 signal wire is already there.
For the heater, one wire gets +12v switched black/red wire in engine bay or at ecu, the other wire goes to the ecu for the heater pin B71, so the ecu can decide when to turn on and off the heater.
4th wire is just a regular ground If I remember right.
the single wire will get the job done though cause the ecu sort of remembers the trims and the turbo heats up the sensor pretty quick I have used both and both will work. I would say get the new one you have working for now, and then worry about the 4 wire heated type. You can also get a M18x1.5 plug at the hardware or auto store its a metal exhaust plug and that will fit right into the extra o2 sensor bungs on the downpipe.
Try checking the plug gap. And all the coil boots and wires for cracks. I had a similar issue. This fixed it. If there are cracks in the boots just put some electrical tape on them to test it. I wouldn't leave it on for long though just for testing purposes. Then order some new boots
What NGK plugs are you guys using and whats the ideal gap?
Ali mentioned that if I had a bad coil pack, I will have a mis-fire on 2 cylinders. this makes sense, but I had the same misfire/surge on my 1.5 build at higher rpms. And, it turned out to be a bad coil pack. I am going to give this a try
Last edited by 6SOARER; 02-17-14 at 03:24 PM.
02-17-14, 11:03 PM
#1413
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I tried swapping out the plug harness from the O2s, front to back, back to front. It didn't help much, but I do see my wideband reacting more.
I got new coil pack wires, I was going to order new spark plugs but forgot which plugs to run.
What NGK plugs are you guys using and whats the ideal gap?
Ali mentioned that if I had a bad coil pack, I will have a mis-fire on 2 cylinders. this makes sense, but I had the same misfire/surge on my 1.5 build at higher rpms. And, it turned out to be a bad coil pack. I am going to give this a try
I got new coil pack wires, I was going to order new spark plugs but forgot which plugs to run.
What NGK plugs are you guys using and whats the ideal gap?
Ali mentioned that if I had a bad coil pack, I will have a mis-fire on 2 cylinders. this makes sense, but I had the same misfire/surge on my 1.5 build at higher rpms. And, it turned out to be a bad coil pack. I am going to give this a try
Also i know it will sound domb but make sure your injectors plugs are all pushed in. found one of mine disconnected while searching for a vacuum leak one day. not sure how long it was out. it was during a stretch where the car wasn't running great anyway and i hadnt been driving it much so i couldnt tell.
Last edited by briggs33; 02-17-14 at 11:06 PM.
02-18-14, 07:25 AM
#1414
with vvti coils I use a bkr6eix or bkr7eix depending on amount of boost being run and I leave them at .032 gap and just drop them in. the ones with the -11 come at a .042 gap and you have to remember to gap those down although you can get away with a .042 gap under 10 psi if your coils are fresh.
02-23-14, 04:30 PM
#1416
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I noticed too on the obd2 ft ecu the rear o2 wiring is in a different spot compaired to my 96 wiring at the ecu don't know what year your car is but maybe that's something to look into def sounds like an o2 issue
02-23-14, 07:31 PM
#1417
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Hello everyone. Big thanks to AliSc3 for taking the time to create this thread. Thanks To Everyone Else Who Contributed. Been gathering parts since I bought my car a year ago. So far, holset turbo, ebay header, hks wastegate, 4 inch ebay intercooler, ffim. So far I have purchased a jdm non vvti ecu, new vvti coils, ds62 igniter, tt map sensor. Looks like all I need is 440cc injectors and a few ecu pins. Waiting on my new coil clips to arrive along with plug for my map. Hoping that I can get it all put together and contribute to this thread. Seems like most of the problems people are having are because they are trying to stray from what's been tried and tested. Hope to get this done soon and report back. Still have 50 more pages to read. I believe all the problems have been found and solved already so if I run into problems I should be able to diagnose them thru this thread.
02-24-14, 08:49 AM
#1418
Hello everyone. Big thanks to AliSc3 for taking the time to create this thread. Thanks To Everyone Else Who Contributed. Been gathering parts since I bought my car a year ago. So far, holset turbo, ebay header, hks wastegate, 4 inch ebay intercooler, ffim. So far I have purchased a jdm non vvti ecu, new vvti coils, ds62 igniter, tt map sensor. Looks like all I need is 440cc injectors and a few ecu pins. Waiting on my new coil clips to arrive along with plug for my map. Hoping that I can get it all put together and contribute to this thread. Seems like most of the problems people are having are because they are trying to stray from what's been tried and tested. Hope to get this done soon and report back. Still have 50 more pages to read. I believe all the problems have been found and solved already so if I run into problems I should be able to diagnose them thru this thread.
I did all that jazz while the first few pages of this were being developed and I can say that once I realized to just keep it simple my car ran great and has beein running great for a year or more by now.
02-24-14, 10:30 AM
#1420
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Lol I do get it! Been there done that. I've experimented with all sorts of engine combos and after so much time and money ask myself why.. I do plan however to convert to ls2 coils. After I get it all dialed in down the road of course.. sj408 and spoolexo. Thank you both also for all your input and trials on this thread. I'm confident that u can set this up pretty easily.
02-25-14, 10:55 AM
#1422
When you guys mention staying with 440cc injectors, are you talking about the top feed 440cc from the MK3 supra and wiring in the low impedance resistor pack? From what I understand the injectors are plug and play, but the resistor pack is not and requires wiring inline. Are there high impedance oem style 440cc injectors available that would simply this process?
02-25-14, 11:29 AM
#1423
Thanks for the praise on the mod guys.
Open dump tube has no affect on the tt ecu, or at least none that I have experienced at all.
For o2 sensors depending on the ecu you use they will be a little different but surely if you completed the mod you have enough wiring experience now to look up the o2 pins on whatever ecu you are using, if you can't figure it out post it up that what we are all here to help each other get it done.
I will second sticking with as close to the original setup as possible, it just works much more flawlessly if you stick with the right injectors size etc. etc.. when you go larger and stuff you are into a new territory which may require a piggyback tune, and I am not an expert in that maybe there is more info on SF about that but I was just interested in getting the thing working, not figuring out how to make a stock ecu work with 1000cc injectors you gotta be realistic here above 660-770 you should either be on a USDM GTE ecu with a vpc or specific larger injector tune or on a standalone, but short of that there are a lot of ways to have a good driving car on the stock gte ecu.
so I always recommend starting out as close to 440 (jdm) or 550(usdm) as possible when starting the mod, trust me after you have it working you will have extra time on your hands to have fun and experiment with larger injectors after that, then you can gauge how much crappier it drives with larger injectors (its like exponential really).
1zz coils are great and can be qired in sequential or wasted spark but Like vrank said I would totally run the 5 extra wires instead of the 2 we run for vvti coils, and since they don't have an external ignitor, you just run the IGT wires straight to the coils, wire up a power, ground, tie all 6 IGF outputs together and run it back to the ecu IGF wire. easy stuff. remember you need a FFIM for these coils.
440cc you can use ones from mk3 with resistor pack (has to be added), or you can find some aftermarket ones, like i found some RC440cc high impedance top feed that dropped in just had to change injector clips to the square type (EV-1 I think). same connectors on the older FC rx7 550's both primary and secondary are the same. the FD rx7 uses the newer rounder connectors that are the same ones on our sc300 stock, plug right in, but FD use 550 for primaries and larger for secondaries so you need 3 sets of FD injectors to get 6 of the right kind vs 1.5 sets of the FC injectors to make a full set of 6, but the FC dont spray as good and need the older clips. I have used the FC ones before they seemed to work fine but after researching them the spray pattern for a rotary is not as optimal on a piston engine, but it seems that it works good enough, I used to reccomend them but I don't anymore just because of that, rotary injectors pintles are designed to stream the fuel straight for a certain distance (to reach the port) and then it starts to atomize. this is a little late on a JZ where the injectors atomize the fuel basically right where they spray.
you would only notice this on idle and if you were pushing the power limits the better atomization of course leads to a better and more constent burn of the fuel, basically lots of the good stuff you want.
aftermarket 550's though are super common now you can get rebuilt ones for the same as picking up several used rx7 sets and rebuilding them blah blah blah, it used to be worth it but not anymore to reuse those injectors. The mk3 supra injectors have a much better spray pattern and will work fine on the JZ, but they are old and need that resistor pack, but wont require a rewire of the clips.
For the money you cannot beat the quality of stock mk3 injectors, but I really hate the thought of having to wire in a resistor pack into my harness, but to some its worth it, sort of a judgement call whats more important the harness or injector type/cost.
That being said I have rewired the injector clips on my 95 harness about 4 times now.
basically there are a lot of options, but less and less people use the mk3 and rx7 injectors it seems nowadays due to more aftermarket options, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't run mk3 injectors if you clean them and install resistor pack, they actually will perform great the 7m lower runners, fuel rail and head setup couldn't be any closer to looking like a 2jzge setup without them being the same. only the RX7 ones can be problematic at times especially if you are tuning them on a standalone.
and for trying LS coils with the tt ecu mod, I have seen a few people try it and supossedly with an IGF simulator it can be made to work, but so far I have seen 0 examples of it working and running. IMO it is not worth the trouble and the add ons trying to trick the IGF circuit just to use GM coils, but then again I enjoy driving it much more than I like looking at an incomplete project so your experience may vary.
Generally speaking, If you are making enough power to warrant LS coils over 1zz or vvti coils, then perhaps the tt ecu mod wont cut it and a standalone would net you that extra power you are looking to squeeze out from the spark.
Open dump tube has no affect on the tt ecu, or at least none that I have experienced at all.
For o2 sensors depending on the ecu you use they will be a little different but surely if you completed the mod you have enough wiring experience now to look up the o2 pins on whatever ecu you are using, if you can't figure it out post it up that what we are all here to help each other get it done.
I will second sticking with as close to the original setup as possible, it just works much more flawlessly if you stick with the right injectors size etc. etc.. when you go larger and stuff you are into a new territory which may require a piggyback tune, and I am not an expert in that maybe there is more info on SF about that but I was just interested in getting the thing working, not figuring out how to make a stock ecu work with 1000cc injectors you gotta be realistic here above 660-770 you should either be on a USDM GTE ecu with a vpc or specific larger injector tune or on a standalone, but short of that there are a lot of ways to have a good driving car on the stock gte ecu.
so I always recommend starting out as close to 440 (jdm) or 550(usdm) as possible when starting the mod, trust me after you have it working you will have extra time on your hands to have fun and experiment with larger injectors after that, then you can gauge how much crappier it drives with larger injectors (its like exponential really).
1zz coils are great and can be qired in sequential or wasted spark but Like vrank said I would totally run the 5 extra wires instead of the 2 we run for vvti coils, and since they don't have an external ignitor, you just run the IGT wires straight to the coils, wire up a power, ground, tie all 6 IGF outputs together and run it back to the ecu IGF wire. easy stuff. remember you need a FFIM for these coils.
440cc you can use ones from mk3 with resistor pack (has to be added), or you can find some aftermarket ones, like i found some RC440cc high impedance top feed that dropped in just had to change injector clips to the square type (EV-1 I think). same connectors on the older FC rx7 550's both primary and secondary are the same. the FD rx7 uses the newer rounder connectors that are the same ones on our sc300 stock, plug right in, but FD use 550 for primaries and larger for secondaries so you need 3 sets of FD injectors to get 6 of the right kind vs 1.5 sets of the FC injectors to make a full set of 6, but the FC dont spray as good and need the older clips. I have used the FC ones before they seemed to work fine but after researching them the spray pattern for a rotary is not as optimal on a piston engine, but it seems that it works good enough, I used to reccomend them but I don't anymore just because of that, rotary injectors pintles are designed to stream the fuel straight for a certain distance (to reach the port) and then it starts to atomize. this is a little late on a JZ where the injectors atomize the fuel basically right where they spray.
you would only notice this on idle and if you were pushing the power limits the better atomization of course leads to a better and more constent burn of the fuel, basically lots of the good stuff you want.
aftermarket 550's though are super common now you can get rebuilt ones for the same as picking up several used rx7 sets and rebuilding them blah blah blah, it used to be worth it but not anymore to reuse those injectors. The mk3 supra injectors have a much better spray pattern and will work fine on the JZ, but they are old and need that resistor pack, but wont require a rewire of the clips.
For the money you cannot beat the quality of stock mk3 injectors, but I really hate the thought of having to wire in a resistor pack into my harness, but to some its worth it, sort of a judgement call whats more important the harness or injector type/cost.
That being said I have rewired the injector clips on my 95 harness about 4 times now.
basically there are a lot of options, but less and less people use the mk3 and rx7 injectors it seems nowadays due to more aftermarket options, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't run mk3 injectors if you clean them and install resistor pack, they actually will perform great the 7m lower runners, fuel rail and head setup couldn't be any closer to looking like a 2jzge setup without them being the same. only the RX7 ones can be problematic at times especially if you are tuning them on a standalone.
and for trying LS coils with the tt ecu mod, I have seen a few people try it and supossedly with an IGF simulator it can be made to work, but so far I have seen 0 examples of it working and running. IMO it is not worth the trouble and the add ons trying to trick the IGF circuit just to use GM coils, but then again I enjoy driving it much more than I like looking at an incomplete project so your experience may vary.
Generally speaking, If you are making enough power to warrant LS coils over 1zz or vvti coils, then perhaps the tt ecu mod wont cut it and a standalone would net you that extra power you are looking to squeeze out from the spark.
Last edited by Ali SC3; 02-25-14 at 11:43 AM.
02-25-14, 12:35 PM
#1424
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For the power you will be making on the stock ecu , it's not worth the time , $$ the hassle to convert to the Lq9 coils.
The VVTI or the TT coils will do just fine on the stock ecu.
This is a budget friendly mod , so i would get some EV14 high imp injectors , since you are not spending $1k on an ECU and $800 for tuning .
The VVTI or the TT coils will do just fine on the stock ecu.
This is a budget friendly mod , so i would get some EV14 high imp injectors , since you are not spending $1k on an ECU and $800 for tuning .
02-25-14, 01:16 PM
#1425
Exactly, that's the same way I feel about the gm coils.
Have you seen anyone run ev14 with the stock ecu or gte ecu? If they work well that is a good option.
For some reason I thought they might be too new for these ecu's cause of their quick response times but ecu can probably handle it now that I think about it.
Have you seen anyone run ev14 with the stock ecu or gte ecu? If they work well that is a good option.
For some reason I thought they might be too new for these ecu's cause of their quick response times but ecu can probably handle it now that I think about it.