Acura Legend vs SC400
10-02-06, 11:37 PM
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Acura Legend vs SC400
Hey guys-- i was looking to buy a legend for my wife and stumbled on this.
I would like to know what your opinions and say about this.
OMG
Reading all the crap makes me think many of you have never owned a Rear wheel drive car
"RWD = ThE UlTrA SuPeR HotNIz"
RWD is by far overrated in the minds of you RWD=GOD guys. I'm drving a turbocharged RWD car WITH Limited Slip Differential now, and seriously, I don't see any thing GLARINGLY better.
the ONLY thing it did better than my legend was a donut in a medical clinics parking lot at 12am.
My legend handled VERY well, The cornering was neutral with power on, and with power off it liked to step the rear out. with this RWD buzzard, i've got a good set of tires on it (like the Legend), and it SOMETIMES goes to neutral handling. Most RWD cars are designed to understeer. the Legend was one FWD car designed to "oversteer" so that in practice it was a very neutral handling car.
Legend wrecks normally involve the person spinning the Legend out versus plowing through stuff...if you've plowed your legend over a curb, you suck at life.
Im sick of all the RWD v. FWD stuff
As for the cars themselves...
After driving an SC400 (it DID have 20" wheels on it so take that for what it's worth) It's not necessarily a SUPER DOOPER GREAT car. the interior was claustrophobic, the shift pattern was lethargic, the power was all in the first 3000rpm, and the had all types of interior noises...Let alone, the materials faded over time, so some parts of the lower dash were different colors than the ones adjacent to them. I was not impressed, and RWD doesn't do anything for a car's performance on the road...
Kill all that RWD noise -_-
EDIT:
and the more i look at the Legend's competition, the more i'm impressed with just how advanced this car was...the only cars that really competed with it performance were the V8 and turbo charged versions of different manufacturers. As far as aesthetics, the Legend was the inspiration for design for the following 12 years. It was truely a ground breaking car. The interior is still one of the most comfortable i've ever been in, even if the car is a little too low for its own good. The car is, was, and will always be a classic. and comparing it with stuff in its era you'll easily see the Legend was on a whole other level.
You wont find a better car all around than the Legend in that era. or for the price you can get one now. but hurry and get your Legend before the prices really start spiking...they're slowly going up right now.
as for my opinion on the SC400 and LEGEND...
If you're getting an automatic Legend, go for the Type II if you're comparing to the SC400. Type I if you're not a racer guy. they're both pretty quick.
As far as coupes, i can't really say, I never liked the Legend Coupes styling. It's just not very proportionately attractive. the SC is just a bit too bulbous for me. but neither is UGLY ugly. both are not very attractive though. but that's just my opinion on their styling.
Handling is going to be a toss up. the Legend rides more sporty than the SC400, the SC is a floaty car like the LS400/Mercedes cars. The steering is vague, but direct. It goes where you point it. I like the Legend's steering better on the highway, you can feel where the car is going to go and the varible weight steering is nicely weighted after 60mph.
Acceleration, the Sc400 will definitely peace out on the Legend off the line, but after 4000rpm it kinda looses its oomph and then if you've got a Type II Legend the Legend will definitely walk it back down. especially in a drag race. For merging the Legend is hands down better, for top gear passing like 50-70 the SC400 will be slightly better.
Fuel economy (bench racing here) the Legend and SC seem to have the same fuel economy, so you're not going to be making your decision here.
like i said before, the shiftin on the SC is very lethargic and it's pretty weak kneed when it comes to the suspension.
The V8s aftermarket isn't necessarily jumping. just because it's got a supercharger available doesn't mean it's jumping. the Chassis itself can swap parts with the supra, so that's where its' other aftermarket comes from. body kits are just as scarce for the SC as they are for the Legend. There's only a few people in japan who make them...do a real search across SC kits and Legend Kits...cross those with the kits made in america for both...
you'll see that the legend is about the same on body kits. I think there's 8 different designs for both cars. Maybe 5 for the Legend Coupe (more than 8 for the sedan) 10 for the SC...
All it comes down to is preference...
my preference is the Legend.
I would like to know what your opinions and say about this.
OMG
Reading all the crap makes me think many of you have never owned a Rear wheel drive car
"RWD = ThE UlTrA SuPeR HotNIz"
RWD is by far overrated in the minds of you RWD=GOD guys. I'm drving a turbocharged RWD car WITH Limited Slip Differential now, and seriously, I don't see any thing GLARINGLY better.
the ONLY thing it did better than my legend was a donut in a medical clinics parking lot at 12am.
My legend handled VERY well, The cornering was neutral with power on, and with power off it liked to step the rear out. with this RWD buzzard, i've got a good set of tires on it (like the Legend), and it SOMETIMES goes to neutral handling. Most RWD cars are designed to understeer. the Legend was one FWD car designed to "oversteer" so that in practice it was a very neutral handling car.
Legend wrecks normally involve the person spinning the Legend out versus plowing through stuff...if you've plowed your legend over a curb, you suck at life.
Im sick of all the RWD v. FWD stuff
As for the cars themselves...
After driving an SC400 (it DID have 20" wheels on it so take that for what it's worth) It's not necessarily a SUPER DOOPER GREAT car. the interior was claustrophobic, the shift pattern was lethargic, the power was all in the first 3000rpm, and the had all types of interior noises...Let alone, the materials faded over time, so some parts of the lower dash were different colors than the ones adjacent to them. I was not impressed, and RWD doesn't do anything for a car's performance on the road...
Kill all that RWD noise -_-
EDIT:
and the more i look at the Legend's competition, the more i'm impressed with just how advanced this car was...the only cars that really competed with it performance were the V8 and turbo charged versions of different manufacturers. As far as aesthetics, the Legend was the inspiration for design for the following 12 years. It was truely a ground breaking car. The interior is still one of the most comfortable i've ever been in, even if the car is a little too low for its own good. The car is, was, and will always be a classic. and comparing it with stuff in its era you'll easily see the Legend was on a whole other level.
You wont find a better car all around than the Legend in that era. or for the price you can get one now. but hurry and get your Legend before the prices really start spiking...they're slowly going up right now.
as for my opinion on the SC400 and LEGEND...
If you're getting an automatic Legend, go for the Type II if you're comparing to the SC400. Type I if you're not a racer guy. they're both pretty quick.
As far as coupes, i can't really say, I never liked the Legend Coupes styling. It's just not very proportionately attractive. the SC is just a bit too bulbous for me. but neither is UGLY ugly. both are not very attractive though. but that's just my opinion on their styling.
Handling is going to be a toss up. the Legend rides more sporty than the SC400, the SC is a floaty car like the LS400/Mercedes cars. The steering is vague, but direct. It goes where you point it. I like the Legend's steering better on the highway, you can feel where the car is going to go and the varible weight steering is nicely weighted after 60mph.
Acceleration, the Sc400 will definitely peace out on the Legend off the line, but after 4000rpm it kinda looses its oomph and then if you've got a Type II Legend the Legend will definitely walk it back down. especially in a drag race. For merging the Legend is hands down better, for top gear passing like 50-70 the SC400 will be slightly better.
Fuel economy (bench racing here) the Legend and SC seem to have the same fuel economy, so you're not going to be making your decision here.
like i said before, the shiftin on the SC is very lethargic and it's pretty weak kneed when it comes to the suspension.
The V8s aftermarket isn't necessarily jumping. just because it's got a supercharger available doesn't mean it's jumping. the Chassis itself can swap parts with the supra, so that's where its' other aftermarket comes from. body kits are just as scarce for the SC as they are for the Legend. There's only a few people in japan who make them...do a real search across SC kits and Legend Kits...cross those with the kits made in america for both...
you'll see that the legend is about the same on body kits. I think there's 8 different designs for both cars. Maybe 5 for the Legend Coupe (more than 8 for the sedan) 10 for the SC...
All it comes down to is preference...
my preference is the Legend.
10-03-06, 12:38 AM
#4
i had a 93 legend L coupe which if i rememeber right it came with the type 2 engine. i think the coupes had the type 2 b4 the sedans. the legend was nice, BUT it was heavy. i mean really heavy. i loved the car, even more if i had the 6 speed. BUT now since i had the sc3 in my life, i dont think i would ever trade it for a legend 6-speed. my interior in the SC is still very beautiful. im sorry to hear u didnt like urs but mine is perfect. i think the lines on a SC looks better then that of a legend. i mean the legend was nice, but the SC is hot. and u talked about aftermarket backin on the SC4. well from what i rememeber there was NOTHING for the legend. i mean give it u can do a NSX head swap, but there was no room for turbo. the legend engine just did not have any potential, with the SC its limitless. til this day i still see NEW kits for SCs popping up. i havent seen a new kit for the legend in a very long time. i dont think u checked out http://intellexual.net/faq.html#06 but if u look there are ALOT of different kits.
Last edited by kietlander; 10-03-06 at 12:43 AM.
10-03-06, 03:15 AM
#5
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Make enough power and youll have Torque Steer. But a stock legend Ill doubt this will be a big problem.
And I dunno about you but driven both fwd and rwd extensevely Id have to say a powerful FWD car is much much more prone to understeer then a similar powered rwd car. There is a dynamic advantage of a RWD vs FWD everything else being equal. This is not subject to oppinion its pure fact, Tire has a limited amount of adherence it can provide. If you burden it with both propelling the vehicle and guiding the vehicle, versus splitting those duties to 4 tires instead, well you figure it out.
The SC300/400 will understeer just like any vehicle. But in most cases it tucks very nicely if I just ease of the throttle. In some case a very quick jab on the brake might be needed. If you have bad front tires then obviously youll understeer. But In my cases the times I tracked my SC and autocrossed it, I have found that it rotates on command quite nicely. If things get to hot ease of the throttle a bit and there you go. Off course given the type of car it is, a slow in fast out is the best way to go about things. Its also a car that rewards smooth consistent driving with faster times.
You have a point with the tranny, but it can be fixed by resetting the ecu followed by agressive driving. Or you can manually shift it.
Seems to me you based your informative and authoritive data based on one test drive provided by some granny's SC400. I bet that it still comes equipped with generic crap all season tires, change to a better compound tire and its behavior improves drastically.
IMO The advantages of RWD vs FWD wont be as noticable in sub 2500 lbs cars making 200 or less hp. But the heavier and More powerful vehicles get the cleared that disadvantage of fwd becomes. For example people like to mod Grand Prix GTP since they can make easy power, but when was the last time anyone broke any time attack records on one? Car handles poorly due to its weight and fact all the power goes in the wrong axle. Not saying SC is the best handling car ever but it definitively has more potential then a similar equipped fwder.
And I dunno about you but driven both fwd and rwd extensevely Id have to say a powerful FWD car is much much more prone to understeer then a similar powered rwd car. There is a dynamic advantage of a RWD vs FWD everything else being equal. This is not subject to oppinion its pure fact, Tire has a limited amount of adherence it can provide. If you burden it with both propelling the vehicle and guiding the vehicle, versus splitting those duties to 4 tires instead, well you figure it out.
The SC300/400 will understeer just like any vehicle. But in most cases it tucks very nicely if I just ease of the throttle. In some case a very quick jab on the brake might be needed. If you have bad front tires then obviously youll understeer. But In my cases the times I tracked my SC and autocrossed it, I have found that it rotates on command quite nicely. If things get to hot ease of the throttle a bit and there you go. Off course given the type of car it is, a slow in fast out is the best way to go about things. Its also a car that rewards smooth consistent driving with faster times.
You have a point with the tranny, but it can be fixed by resetting the ecu followed by agressive driving. Or you can manually shift it.
Seems to me you based your informative and authoritive data based on one test drive provided by some granny's SC400. I bet that it still comes equipped with generic crap all season tires, change to a better compound tire and its behavior improves drastically.
IMO The advantages of RWD vs FWD wont be as noticable in sub 2500 lbs cars making 200 or less hp. But the heavier and More powerful vehicles get the cleared that disadvantage of fwd becomes. For example people like to mod Grand Prix GTP since they can make easy power, but when was the last time anyone broke any time attack records on one? Car handles poorly due to its weight and fact all the power goes in the wrong axle. Not saying SC is the best handling car ever but it definitively has more potential then a similar equipped fwder.
10-03-06, 06:07 AM
#6
Pole Position
Stock for stock your comparison seems fair and I agree for the most part.
But once you start modding, the SC has a clear advantage especially if you consider the SC300 in your comparison, which is a closer match to the Legend anyway.
Don't get me wrong, Legends are sweet cars. My boy has one and I respect it as much as the SC. Both are icons of the Japanese luxury revolution that took place the early 90's. But with the SC sharing Supra DNA, the mod potential is much higher, V8 or 6.
But once you start modding, the SC has a clear advantage especially if you consider the SC300 in your comparison, which is a closer match to the Legend anyway.
Don't get me wrong, Legends are sweet cars. My boy has one and I respect it as much as the SC. Both are icons of the Japanese luxury revolution that took place the early 90's. But with the SC sharing Supra DNA, the mod potential is much higher, V8 or 6.
10-03-06, 06:12 AM
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dont really now about the legends ,but i never liked the bodystyle, still looked like to 80's jus look at the sc ,they kept the same chasis until 2000 .to me there is no comparison whatsoever the lexus is by far a better car in everyway looks performance ,luxary ,quality
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10-03-06, 09:40 AM
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legends are okay, i don't like them the body doesn't look sporty or anything. To me it doesn't even feel luxury when i sit in it.
the lexus is by far a better car in everyway looks performance ,luxary ,quality
10-03-06, 06:59 PM
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As far as over powered FWD cars. I can't argue with that, but a finite balance of power and tire must be served between two chassis.
The setup to make an equally powerful FWD car handle well is going to be much more difficult than a RWD car. FWD IS prone to understeer, but a balanced chassis will, in practice, will be more stable than a RWD chassis in similar conditions.
That said, i do agree with you on the fact that when you start going heavier, the difference in drive wheels start to make a difference, but those differences will be exacerbated, even with light chassis, by wet conditions. Along with RWD cars, a FWD with the similar weight and power output (and grip) will be a bit of a hand full without electronic controls. But the FWD will be more naturally stable, and given the driver's capability, you may actually end up with a faster car on a track.
But i do agree, dry conditions, Same Tire widths up front, a 300lbsft FWD car Versus a 300lbsft RWD car, the RWD will be less prone to push with the same suspension configurations. But they're both dynamically different beasts and what works for one car doesn't work for another. so it takes a different tuning approach to making a FWD car handle, which is part of the fun.
The setup to make an equally powerful FWD car handle well is going to be much more difficult than a RWD car. FWD IS prone to understeer, but a balanced chassis will, in practice, will be more stable than a RWD chassis in similar conditions.
That said, i do agree with you on the fact that when you start going heavier, the difference in drive wheels start to make a difference, but those differences will be exacerbated, even with light chassis, by wet conditions. Along with RWD cars, a FWD with the similar weight and power output (and grip) will be a bit of a hand full without electronic controls. But the FWD will be more naturally stable, and given the driver's capability, you may actually end up with a faster car on a track.
But i do agree, dry conditions, Same Tire widths up front, a 300lbsft FWD car Versus a 300lbsft RWD car, the RWD will be less prone to push with the same suspension configurations. But they're both dynamically different beasts and what works for one car doesn't work for another. so it takes a different tuning approach to making a FWD car handle, which is part of the fun.
10-03-06, 07:36 PM
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FWD is not for performance its for packaging purposes. That is why you don't see RWD Kias, Civics, Cobalts, etc etc. Its cheaper to make and build.
You don't see FWD Ferraris, Porsches, or Lamborghinis. You don't see FWD Bentleys, Maybachs or RRs...
FWD is better b/c its cheaper.You want the real deal, you go with RWD. Then you have the sudden emergance of AWD being sold now by tons of car makers, not just Audi and Suburu.
I've owned RWD/AWD/FWD, you can feel the difference as soon as you touch that pedal.
BEING PUSHED (RWD)> BEING PULLED (FWD)
As for the Legend, I love that Acura, the best Sedan/coupe they every made.
You don't see FWD Ferraris, Porsches, or Lamborghinis. You don't see FWD Bentleys, Maybachs or RRs...
FWD is better b/c its cheaper.You want the real deal, you go with RWD. Then you have the sudden emergance of AWD being sold now by tons of car makers, not just Audi and Suburu.
I've owned RWD/AWD/FWD, you can feel the difference as soon as you touch that pedal.
BEING PUSHED (RWD)> BEING PULLED (FWD)
As for the Legend, I love that Acura, the best Sedan/coupe they every made.
10-03-06, 07:43 PM
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