idahorx

We are planning to buy a 450h and are curious about the Nav system. I'm trying to get a sense of the positives and negatives.

- It seems that all dealer inventory has the Nav system included, though I believe that it's an option and not standard equipment
- the nav system costs a lot of money and you have to pay for annual updates, whereas my garmin is portable and already has lifetime updates included
- Seems that the Levinson audio system requires Nav. Is this correct? Do people find the Levinson audio to be worth the upgrade?
- Appears to need the Nav system for many lighting an locking options to be configurable by the customer.
- Enform suite duplicates a lot of functionality already on my smartphone and requires annual fees.

In other words, it seems to me that the Nav and enform are expensive and duplicate a lot of functionality I already have with my GPS and smartphone, and require annual fees/upgrades. On the other hand, there may be a level of overall feature availability and integration that I would be disappointed to leave out.

So my question to the community is: if I were to special order an RX without the Nav, do you think this would be penny-wise and pound-foolish?

Thanks in advance for your comments!

Cruiter

Harold, welcome to C/L, it's a good place to find most of your answers.

The NAV system like anything has it's positive features and some maybe not as good as a dedicated NAV only system but overall it's a 'must have' as it does far more than just navigate. For one thing, it's required if you have the HUD. And it incorporates your radio, a/c, NAV, weather, traffic, and most of the car's setup settings all in one that you operate either verbally or by the one hand director system on top of the console. Yes, it adds a bit to the price, but it's probably the most common option short of leather and moon-roof. Down the road when you sell or trade 'not' having it will be a very big factor.

It takes a while to get comfortable with it but once you do, it's very logical and easy to use. Spending time in your driveway with the manual is a great way to start. Of all the ones I've had, once learned, it's the easiest to use with the most features. But it's not a dedicated NAV only system so it might lack a few features a device like a TomTom would have such as elevation but it's got what is needed.

cossie1600

I think the NAV option is about $3K. If the nav is all they have in stock, they might be able to sell you a car in stock cheaper. Is it worth $3K? Probably not, but it sure is nice to have it. Remember you can't put $ signs to justify car purchase

idahorx

Thanks for the replies so far.

Just to be clear, the alternative I'm looking at is the Display Audio system, which as far as I can tell still has all the audio capabilities, backup camera, and car setup capabilities. It's about $2K cheaper than the Nav/Enform.

waapples

I like the factory screen, where I have a control over everything from the steering wheel. Mine has the passenger side mirror camera, which is pretty useful when I park or squeeze into a narrow areas. I doubt the aftermarket ones work with the side mirror camera.

dentate

You do not have to buy annual upgrades to the nav system--my 2009 is still original, my 2010 still had the original system in it - it is not a subscription. To my ears, the Levinson system is worth the money--there are some that will argue otherwise. If in doubt, go to your dealer and give both a listen - perhaps for you there will be no discernable difference for you but to me it is much crisper. Unless you are keeping your RX for a very long time, I think your resale value without navigation would be greatly diminished. The bluetooth function is fantastic and for 2013 messages now appear on screen and can be read to you while driving. The ability to customized the vehicle setting can be done through navigation and I don't know how you would do them otherwise unless paying a dealer to do so. I cannot comment on Enform since sadly it is still not available in Canada. I don't think I have ever seen a 450 without navigation.

dentate
Oshawa, ON

Evitzee

A built in, fully integrated nav system is compelling because it knits many of the vehicle's functions (audio, climate, maintenance, navigation) in one unit that can be controlled with the quasi-mouse. It will probably pay you back at trade in time, very few people want luxury vehicles now without factory nav.

The Enform feature is nice, my wife and I do a lot of travelling and I can sit at home or in the hotel room in front of my laptop and put in the next days destination(s), download them to the vehicle, and can access them on the fly. It includes the SOS feature and after the first year is about $275/yr although you don't absolutely have to have this feature. The Nav will continue to work just fine and requires no fees at all, ever, unless you want to upgrade the maps in the future.

Personally, I wouldn't want a Lexus without nav, and I don't think many second owners would either. Sometimes luxury has a price higher than we are comfortable with. Your choice.

waapples

Sorry I haven't yet read the entire manual, but is 2010 Nav DVD based or HD based or CF based?

I can see why they charge money for DVD map upgrades, but software upgrade maps should be provided at least the cars are under factory warranty.

Not sure about ML, again, haven't spent much time with my RX yet, but seems like my Bose on Porsche sounds much better, but I"m pretty sure ML sounds better than the standard unit.

GrandSedanFan

iTrader: (1)

I would not have one without it. However, the Remote Touch is something that comes naturally to someone who is familiar with computers and mice, not so much for those who do not use computers often. I love it. I think it is a great alternative to iDrive COMAND, or a very large touch screen. YMMV.

dctex99

My '13 was one of the first built in May and they have an upgrade that came in JUNE on NAV; cost is $228, but they admitted that unless I travel alot it is not necessary!! Most of us just don't keep cars very long so the REAL cost when y ou see the difference in trade in is significant!! Take a look at used Lexus as I did last night....2010's are either $30-32 or $35-37.....and they will sell the NAV equipped ones first because very few want stripped Lexus and many know that NAV also includes many other options!!!

kitlz

Welcome to CL, idahorx. Non-nav RXs are out there. My dealer usually gets a few but the majority come with it. You might need to expand your search. Special order is not necessary. Personally I couldn't live without nav. The reasons have been covered for the most part. I'd add the convenience factor. It doesn't require putting it up or taking it down. No tell tale marks on the windshield either. Plus I'm so used to the Lexus system. The integration is great.

Updates are completely optional as previously mentioned. I haven't bothered to do it on the 330 and now the 450h. Still made it to my destination just fine. Lexus has a website somewhere listing the changes so you can decide whether it's worth it. I continued my subscription to Enform and traffic. Weather is not worth it IMO.

ML in the RX is decent. It gives you a few extra speakers and the ability to watch DVDs while parked. Bass is still missing. I haven't made any modifications though because I know it'll never end. I keep my installer busy changing the fog lights instead, LOL!

f152tall

Nothing beats a factory installed, integrated Nav system. We love ours. Integrated with XM traffic it is very accurate.

UCSB

I doubt if you will ever see a 450h without NAV. It is expensive for what it does, but all of the other features of the car are also controlled through the screen. So rather than think of it as a NAV system, it is more accurate to think of it as the UI to your car. It is a big part of the experience of driving the car; even when you are not using it for navigation. I would imagine it will kill your resale value if you don't get it because virtually every other 450h will have the option when you go to sell. You can get the basic functionality for free on your smartphone or tablet (and it will be up-to-date) ... so I understand your reluctance.

Marqevans

I have had numerous RX's without Nav. My 2012 has Nav. Not sure I would pay to get it again. That being said there are many positives as mentioned. I love destination assist, but will not pay for the subscription when it runs out at the end of the first year. I think just having the garmin was safer. Changing radio stations and other functions with the mouse through the nav screen is distracting versus just hitting buttons and turning dials. As far as resale goes my dealer has plenty of RX's without nav and buys all its loaners without Nav. If there was a big resale advantage, I'm sure they would buy them with nav.

tfischer

When I bought my SC new in 2001, few cars had NAV. Although technically an option at that time (it was later made standard on the SC), at least 90% of the SCs shipped with NAV installed. I was not crazy about the idea, and thought it was just a toy that I had been forced into buying.
Less than a year later I was hooked, and when, in 2007, I went shopping for an '04 RX, I had two requirements: a list of acceptable colors and NAV. At that time, my guess would be that fewer than half, and maybe fewer than a quarter of the RXs had the NAV (but I would wait, and I'm glad I did). My understanding now is that far more than half of the RXs have the NAV, but there is probably a place where you could check that.
The point of this story (and most of my stories have no point) is that I consider the NAV essential on any new or used car I get from here on out and (2) the NAV is becoming far more common. I would agree with the above observation that having the NAV will be a big positive factor at resale or trade-in.
Phones are everywhere, and Garmins can stick to your windshield, but the big, built in NAV is by far the most convenient way to travel. Don't leave home without it.