AudioMan

As the title states, my wife's starter appears to be going out. There is just a single click when turning the key, and after turning the key enough, the car will eventually start.

The battery was replaced around a year ago and in the past, my experience with batteries going bad is that the starter will click several times when a battery is going bad, or try to turn the engine over but will not have enough juice to do so. Bad starters will give a single click.

After researching these forums, it appears that this problem is the starter as the vehicle is a 99 with around 120K miles on it (similar to other examples where the starter went out).

With all that being said, I plan on doing this tonight and after looking at the motor, the airbox will have to come out to access the starter. Are there any suggestions to make this job go any easier?

I also read that this problem is caused by a brass connector going bad in the starter solenoid, would a new starter replace all of this or is this solenoid somewhere else? The local NAPA has a remanufactured starter for $140 (after core return), does that sound about right?

She is at work right now (in a parking garage) and I can only hope the car starts to come home tonight as this morning it took turning the key close to 15 times.

bob2200

I saw a used Lexus RX300 starter up on Ebay last night.

I'd be inclined to stick with the Toyota/Lexus replacement part. In the past, friends have found that some aftermarket starters are very inferior in starting torque, etc., because of fewer windings and other shortcuts. I don't know about NAPA parts though.

I think that the solenoid would be included as part of the starter on any unit you purchased.

Tammy

Insure you disconnect the battery ground prior to starting the removal.

Might check with a Toyota dealer for a remanufactured unit. They do not require a core or it's charge.

bob2200

Another thought. This is from a June 23rd posting on this forum:

"You say it 'tries to crank.' Does it turn over or not? Reason that I ask is that in my 1999 RX300, at about 135,000 miles it would intermittently fail to turn over at all. Battery was new so that wasn't the problem. Problem was in the starter, which the dealer wanted over $600 to replace. I took it out myself (extremely easy) and determined that one of the solenoid contacts had worn out, which is a common problem with these Nippon Denso starters. Part cost me $7.00 (from an independent shop that repairs starters and alternators.) No problem since."

AudioMan

Yes, I have read that as well but do not know of any local repair shops for starters and alternators and need the part today. With the mileage on the car I am just as content replacing the whole unit.

While searching these forums, it appears that the ES300 starter is accessed from under the car, but I can see the starter in the RX towards the top of the engine, is it easier to replace from under the car??

alsalih

Here is a link for the contact set

http://catalog.drivewire.com/drivewi...er+Contact+Set

However I would recommend simply replacing the whole starter to avoid future problems with the solenoid, motor,...etc. The best starters are the Denso rebuilt which is $192 (from www.sparkplugs.com) plus you don't have to ship the core back. The NAPA starter should be just fine; it would be my second choice. Just stay away from any Autozone rebuilt electrical parts.

salimshah

The obvious culprits are:

Battery**. [Charge overnight and jump can eliminate that]. You can have it load tested as well.
Cables/connectors. Visual and manual ...no contact should be able to be moed by hand]
Solenoid. [With a thick screwdrive you can jump contacts but not for the weak at heart and can be dangerous]
Starter Motor [if nothing else, this is it .. some times you can catch it smoking]

** clicking can be bad battery as well, watch the display lights .. if they dim when you hear clicking then re-check battery and connectors]

One of the problems with DIY is we become too focused on cost savings. I would urge you to look at the situation with down-time and convinience. Also look at the life of adjacent components. [Assuming minimum repair is to rebuild solenoid contacts. Based on milage and time, the starter motor may alos be on its last leg. So looking at down time and in order to save pending/imminent more work, it might be better to replace the whole unit].

Salim

AudioMan

Thanks for all your help. I got a remanufactured unit today at NAPA for around $140 plus core (they also have a better unit for $180 with lifetime warranty as opposed to 3 year warranty, but we will probably keep this car for only 2 or so more years).

I will just replace the starter tonight and have the battery tested as well. All contacts appeared tight last night when I tried to move them but I will double check just in case.

salimshah

Dont forget to do a step by step write-up. For safety, do remember to disconnect the gnd [I prefer removing the battery* as the wires have a tendency to swing back to their natural state]. Also keep a sharp eye out for loose objects (washers, spacers, nuts, sockets etc) ... you dont want them to fall in the flywheel well.

Include all the little things you need to do to gain access.

Check the price of starter from dealership. My prefernce has always been OEM and my labor.

Salim

* Once the battery is removed, I check the new starter on the bench before installing it. Solenoid throw needs to be confirmed and adjusted if required.

AudioMan

The battery may need to be removed anyway as it is close in area to the starter. At a minimum, the entire air box will have to be removed and I *might* be able to get to the bolts after that.

What is the advantage of pulling the negative on the battery as opposed to the positive? I never really understood that as you need both to complete the circuit so it would seem removing either would be sufficient?

I will do the writeup afterwards.

salimshah

You are asking a bonus question ..

Both terminals are needed to complete the circuit. BUT the negative is distributed with a bare conductor (as it is connected to the body/chasis). So the unprotected - runs every where. I still have a pitted wrench, which touched the hold down as I was tightening the + terminal of the battery*. Now I attach the + first and then attach the - last (if my wrench accidentaly touches the hold down or other surface, I dont create fireworks).

Salim

* Fortunately battery was not charging [no H2 or O2] and the damage was limited to missed heat beat and a pitted wrench.
I have know that H2 and O2 are produced during charging but thought the quantity is so low that nothing adverse woudl happen. WRONG .. I had a 6v motorcycle battery on charge and a lit match near bye, split the battery in two ... acid went flying every where.

At times the reason for high markup on repairs is due to the fact the some one else [dealership] is taking the risk. It is not just pure profit.

salimshah

AudioMan:

Still washing out the grease under your fingernails?

By now the starter should be in.

Salim

AudioMan

Yes, the new starter is in as of 11/4 and the car starts perfectly every time. Total install time was just over an hour and could be done again in about 45 minutes. Very easy and I will do a writeup in a day or so (sorry pregnant wife did not want to come out and take pictures, so I will be descriptive as memory will allow).

I rank it about as hard as changing disc brake pads. (2 wrenches out of 5).

AudioMan

Oh, very little grease, only road dirt that is under the engine. Very nice for washing hands afterwards as it came right off. Grease is a bit more tough to wash off.

AudioMan

Here is the write-up for replacing a starter in a 99 RX 300 with AWD. Follow these instructions at your own risk. I am doing this by memory so there may be small things that I have forgotten. In general, this should be enough info to complete the job if you have some common sense. I did not test new starter before putting it in vehicle but figured the reman units were tested after the remanufactured process. Your mileage may vary (YMMV).

Tools required:

1/4 inch ratchet with some extensions
3/8 inch ratchet with appropriate extensions (figure at least a 6 inch extension if not a little longer)
3/8 inch Breaker bar (mine is about 12 inches)
Possibly a small flat head screwdriver for some prying of misc clips

-Remove the negative battery cable, then the positive battery cable. Keep the socket on your ¼ inch ratchet (not sure on size) as you will need this same size for most things

-Remove the two bolts that hold the battery strap in the car, the one towards the front of the car has to be completely removed and the one towards the rear, which is on the rear of the battery, has to be loosened a bit. Now remove the battery strap

-Pull the battery out of the car and the plastic tray under it as well

-Unclip the MAF sensor wire from the MAF

-Using ¼ inch ratchet, loosen the clamp connecting the top part of the airbox to the intake tube (part where MAF is)

-Remove top part of airbox from vehicle

-Pull out the filter

-Unbolt three bolts at bottom of airbox (inside of box)

-Loosen vacuum hose from rear of airbox and pull away (use a small flat head to move the clip if needed)

-If you try to remove the rest of the airbox at this time, you will notice some ground wires running along the back through a clip. Remove the ground bolt where these grounded to the vehicle

-Slowly work the bottom of the airbox up (you will also notice that the throttle cable runs through a clip on the rear, just use common sense and you can get this clip off of the cable

-You can not completely remove the bottom of the airbox, but there is enough slack that you can just set it on top of the engine and out of your way

-You should now see the starter on the side of the engine

-There are some wire retaining clips just under the larger power wires going to the starter, you may need to unclip this to give more slack in the wires as you pull out the starter

-Using your breaker bar and extensions, there are two bolts that need to be loosened just a bit then use the larger ratchet to finish the job. My breaker bar is not very large, but with some force I got the bolts free

-After these bolts are out, you should be able to pull the starter out a bit, but not completely as there are two sets of wires going to it. There is a clipped in wire on one side and a bolted in power wires on the opposite

-Slightly turn the starter each way so you can get better access to these connections. You will need a ratchet on one of them and the other side clips in, but you may need the flathead to work it free. Also, there is a cover to the side with the larger cables that unclips and you can move it out of the way

-After wires are removed, the starter will just pull out of the vehicle

-Take new starter and insert into spot where old one was removed, but not completely as you will need some slack

-Reconnect all connections to new starter, and then work it fully into hole. Make sure that it is fully seated in the hole and flush against engine. You will probably have to turn the starter a bit clockwise and counterclockwise to work it fully into the hole

-After fully seated and lined up with boltholes, tighten the bolts back in place. I don’t have the torque specs on these, but I just made them nice and tight.

-Make sure the wires around the starter are back in their retaining clips

-Replace the airbox and don’t forget the vacuum hose and re-grounding of wires that run through the clip on the rear. Throttle cable should be routed properly as well and make sure the MAF cable is put back on the MAF

-Replace battery connecting the positive cable first, then negative

-Make sure no tools are left in the engine and everything is assembled correctly

-Put the keys in the ignition and fire that beyatch back up. Our vehicle started on the first turn and started perfectly

-A note on the starter I used. It was purchased from NAPA for around $140 after the core return. It has a 3-year warranty and I was a bit skeptical on the quality as they also had a more expensive model with lifetime warranty. Before putting the remanufactured starter back in the vehicle, I held it up against the OE starter. It looked identical and I actually think it was either a remanufactured OE starter, or a remanufactured unit from the same manufacturer of the OE starter. Everything down to the color of the screws on the side was exactly the same. When starting the car, it has the exact same sound as the OE starter as well.

-Total time was just over an hour for this job, but if you know what you are doing it can be done in about 45 minutes (possibly less). Now wash up a bit and think about what you will do with the $460 you saved by not taking this to the dealership to have them do the work.