jac17

Just finished an interesting conversation with salesman at dealership here in Texas and looking for feedback from prior experiences.

I first went to Edmunds.com and researched the invoice price for an 2012 RX 350 with Navigation. The following shows what I found when doing research on MSRP vs. Invoice:

RX350 Package MSRP Price Invoice Price
---------------------- ---------------- -----------------
Vehicle Base Model 39,075 35363
Comfort Package 1950 1678
12 speaker Premium Audio 110 94
19" Aluminum Alloy Wheels with
All Season Tires 660 568
Intuitive Parking Assist 500 430
Premium Package 2400 2172
Transmission Cooler, Heavy
Duty Alt/Radiator 238 238 (not shown so assume MSRP)
Wood & Leather Trimmed
Steering Wheel and Shift
**** 330 284
Cargo Mat, Cargo Net, Wheel
Locks and Key Gloves 255 255 (not shown so assume MSRP)
Cross Bars 259 259 (not shown so assume MSRP)
Delivery Processing & Handling 875 875
------------- ---------------
Totals 49117 44449

Therefore, I assumed I could start at invoice and go a bit lower or at least at invoice + 500. However, salesman stated that they "owned" the vehicle for almost 46900K and would give me the vehicle at invoice +500 or 47400. When I challenged that this is not what Edmunds showed as invoice, he stated that Edmunds wasn't aware of an invoice increase by Lexus and that it was up to 3% more than what they showed.

Seems fishy to me as even if it were true, that would make my price approx. 45800 vs. what he says they own the car for.

Therefore my first question is whether Edmunds invoice is fairly reliable when dealing with Lexus cars? My past experience is that they are reliable or certainly no more than a couple hundred dollars difference. What is your experience? Would you trust Edmunds from an invoice perspective?

Secondly, is it realistic to look at trying to purchase a 2012 RX 350 at invoice or close to it? Salesman said that Lexus dealerships don't even talk invoice, but of course, they would make an exception in my case

Looking for experiences and opinions as I am really disappointed in overall interaction. Are my expectations too high?

JimH2

I would try kbb.com to see if the prices match. Who knows what the salesman has in that $ 46,900 quote; Could have advertising fees, prep fees, etc. that they put into that figure. I would inquire with other dealers as well over the internet to see what they quote you with an "internet purchase price". It comes down to individual dealer differences on what you can purchase a vehicle for.

markrivers

+ 1 on the internet purchase price. it's usually lower compared to the price you get when you walk into the dealer.
Most dealer have an online department anyway, you do the transactions online then you meet the sales person after.. or when you get delivery.
Have you tried other dealers? that's how i buy cars/SUVs.. get the "out the door" price with everything on it, license, fees, registration, gap insurance etc.
THEN, you compare.. most of the times, the difference is around 500-1500 " ALL things equal".

try an out of state dealer as well, if you're near the border.

kitlz

jac17, any particular reason you are looking at the '12 when the '13 is coming out in a few months? The changes are significant enough to make a difference.

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/rx-...-page-2-a.html

Edmunds is good. True Car is another site I like that can give you an idea of prices in your area. Contact a few dealers and let them know what you're willing to pay.

markrivers

i almost forgot, BUY at the end of the month, when the sales person is lacking in his quota or has REACHED his quota and simply aspiring for the BONUS for selling x amount past quoata.
This is when you get the BEST deal, when the sales person doesn't care anymore about the margin, but the "SALE" itself for him to be able to get that Bonus.

kartah

Jac, seems like you have done your research and already know the numbers. If that's the case, I would recommend visiting other dealerships close to you. We visited four before we made the purchase. Some are even willing to negotiate over the phone. To me, dealerships will almost always lie about the numbers.

When you've decided on the dealership, make an appointment with your sales guy (as suggested by Mark) close to the end of the month. Have a set price (within reason - relative to invoice price) that you know you're willing to pay for the car. Make the offer just below that set price. Your sales guys will most definitely say, "no, that's impossible". And then give him your final offer of the price you have set for yourself and tell him to meet you at that price. Tell him that if they can meet you there, you're ready to sign on the dotted line, and immediately get up and slowly walk towards the door. But be serious, let them know that you are ready to make the purchase as long as they are willing to meet you at your price, thank the sales guy and slowly walk towards the door. Hopefully at this point, the sales manager will come out and you'll be able to make a purchase. Good luck!

MX5NES350

And the price will also be a difference. No way he would score a 2013 near invoice until much later in the game.

kitlz

I was referring more to prices dropping on '12s when the '13s come out.

markrivers

+1
i got a good deal on my 2011 because the 2012 were announced to be released within 2 months. ( at the time of purchase)
and since i wasn't interested with the nebula gray.. i'm pretty sure that my 2011 Tungsten Pearl looks a lot like the 2012 tungsten pearl.
that and 2,500 less.

UCSB

I don't think any of us can tell you how low of a price you can negotiate. Each purchase is an individual negotiation. Prices vary from dealership to dealership. They vary with economic conditions and in different parts of the country. Sometimes the dealership has access to incentives from Lexus that can silently affect price. Although if you have time and work with dealerships, you might find that price is more fluid than you might think if you just have a single conversation.

But, to answer your original posted question ... it is possible to get a Lexus at invoice or below. My FWD 450h was purchased in 9/2010. It had a sticker of $51,957 (~$54,500 if purchased in 2012) and I paid $45,500. So approximately $6,500 below sticker. I can't remember exactly, but this was at least a couple of thousand under invoice. BUT, this was in the depth of the auto sales slow down. At the time given what was going on in the country, it seemed like a fair deal to me. The mood over at the dealership now seems up beat in comparison to those days; so I am guessing that prices have rebounded up. You need to understand what is going on at the dealerships you are planning to use (ie are the cars moving, whats on the overflow lot, etc.). With the changes coming in 2013, you have a strong negotiating position developing. Although, at this point I would just go for the 2013. They are far enough out that over the next four months someone would probably be willing to lock one in with your name on it at a good price. Remember that each year there is possibility of a price increase. Although, I noticed that when I was configuring a new 2013 GS some of the components like the NAV system and ML audio had really dropped in price (about time on the NAV system in my opinion).

MX5NES350

Ah. OK. Then yes, they should get a killer deal. The 2013's will be at sticker, plain and simple. No dealer in their right mind would take money off a 2013 even if it is only some refreshed styling. Moving the 12's off the lot will be a high priorty so the incentives should be sweet.

TampaOwner

the answer to this is simple. ask him to show you the actual invoice. that is a very common thing for customers who know to ask for it. theyll never offer it, but most will show it to you if you simple ask. if they give you any trouble, just walk, if he wont show you, hes lying. if hes telling you the truth, hell show you. every dealership has the invoice for their car. keep in mind the dealeeships get money From the manufacturer called a "hold back" and other ince tives... so dealerships almost always pay LESS than the invoice. theres plenty of other lexus dealers that will sell u the car you want if this one gives you trouble.

TampaOwner

again, you have every right to see the actual invoice if you want to buy the car. dnt follow what he says or what edmunds says

rxsuperman

If the dealer shows the customer the invoice and it's higher than Edmunds, how do you then know if the dealer invoice number is truthful, Edmunds's number is incorrect, or dealer invoice cost has really gone up?

MX5NES350

I would hope (for the Dealer's sake) they don't have an 'invoice falsification printing/software machine' pumping out fake Lexus factory invoices for just such occassions and Edmund's "sources" are just inaccurate. The dealer would not be long for the world.