myspouses

This thread will talk about enforcement of proper communications from Toyota/Lexus, who have only just recently returned to 2008 versions of RX350 the important ability to become unstuck from a deep snow drift by rocking vehicle and applying power the way it was done prior to VSC. For those of you who live in snowbelts, I am informed this new feature--the VSC OFF button-- to allow rocking vehicle out of a deep snow drift, is on 2008 models. I am awaiting info. on whether any 3rd party wire harness might allow conversion of my 2007. Some have suggested becoming familiar with removing appropiate fuse.
Will Consumer Safety within Governments require a specific communication to go out to past customers?
Why are Consumers having to do the research themselves?

biff44

How would that help? The stability system seems to be able to power me out of parking places just fine. If they were going to add a feature that really helped, it would be electronically locking differentials!

I have not checked the fuse cluster, but I assume if you pulled the correct fuse you could turn off the VSA in your car for a short while.

myspouses

The 2008 manual is talking about helpers rocking a stuck vehicle.
Thanks, I'll experiment with fuses.

willard

Actually the 2008 uses one button to provide two "off" functions.

The first depression turns TC, Traction Control, off. TC prevents inadvertent wheelspin/slip by moderately braking the slipping wheel while simultaneously dethrottling the engine to prevent the rotors from overheating and warping.

A second l..o...n......g depression, with TC already off, will disable VSC.

For earlier RX models (works for my '01 AWD) simply unplugging the MAF/IAT module while the engine is idling will disable VSC/Trac (CEL/VSC/TC failure indicators will be on) for the next few drive cycles. The engine will die with the MAF/IAT unplugged, just plug it back in, restart the engine and drive away.

myspouses

My 2006 Acura TL has same "VSA OFF" function (Acura calls it Assist not Control) and this must be industry trend.
Do others think this trend mandated from a safety point-of-view,
in that failure to get unstuck because VSC is depowering engine had caused consumer feedback, OR
do you think this intentional all along (because 2WD RX350 2007 models had this) and it was a bit complicated with 4WD to reconfigure ECU?
Obviously the Toyota, Honda, etc legal beagles became used to the idea a driver could willingly shut off VSC. The VSC ON is automatic with each time the engine is started.

myspouses

The 2008 RX350 has a VSC OFF button and this is a change from 2007.
In 2007 only the 2WD had TRAC OFF.
The purpose as I understand it is to allow power when rocking vehicle to get it unstuck from a big snow drift.
I'd like to know what manual says on 400H about this.
(Have the 2008's hit dealers yet?)

jim256

Most other cars have had a "slip control off" since the systems first became available in the mid to late '90's. You can better get out of deep snow or loose deep gravel with wheel spin. However most if not all turn it back on as soon as the car speed hits 25 mph. With the advent of additional stability control features, they usually can't be disabled (probably for safety/liability) but you typically can disable just the anti-wheelspin feature. Toyota, for some reason, has not included disable switches in the past.

myspouses

Thanks very much Jim256. I'm wondering if the 400H can have wheel spin?
Has 2008 come out at same time as RX350?
and, Any thoughts about the fuse suggestion?

spwolf

RX350 already has TRC OFF, which is what should help you with the snow... right?

myspouses

There is a section in our 2007 manual that talks about TRAC OFF in the 2WD only. And it goes on to say this button when engaged is indeed for rocking vehicle out of mud/deep snow.

MadloR

Perhaps, you can locate the fuse (if there is one) that controls the VSC. Maybe by removing it, you can deactivate it.


Cheers,

MadloR

myspouses

I want to make it clear where I stand on Toyota/Lexus Communications
on this improved safety change. I have said elsehwere, this is a life or death situation for my area--being able through no fault of the Driver, to rock vehicle from a large snow-drift on a county highway that forms because of lake-effect snows (I'm east of Lake Huron with predominently west winds just like in Buffalo area)--which are forecast to increase with climate change.
Why are 2007 (or earlier) customers having to initiate comments/communications? Toyota wants to build a lifetime relationship for car-buying but they fail a simple courtesy that Dealers could handle for them.

Just have Dealers send a letter to previous customers explaining newer driver control feature and related comments in newer manuals and then go on to explain that Toyota can not engineer any retrofit fix but that customers wanting best practises for such a situation should talk to their Service Managers next visit to the Dealers. It is a simple idea and it shows respect for the lifelong relationship.

myspouses

Toyota/Lexus have some responsibility in that they gave drivers a product without ability to be rocked and wheel spinned out of a deep snow drift because (speculation--due to other manufacturers not electing to delete VSC OFF switch in the same timeframe) their lawyers were nervous about a vehicle having an accident after VSC OFF activated. Now industry trend and experience has taught that this was a wrong decision and they have reversed themselves.
They took away something and now have given driver control a boost for these situations.
A 'fix' is not on and so at least they have an obligation, as I see it, to communicate with the community of Buyers who trusted Toyota/Lexus to be putting the customers' interests for Safety first.

myspouses

I applaud new feature for allowing the rocking of a vehicle out of a deep snow drift.
Drivers here, through no fault of their driving, can experience white-outs and can end up in such a situation. I have this on my 2006 Acura TL and my understanding is Acura have always had this.

myspouses

Here are some examples of a cavalier
attitude that Lexus Executives may not be aware of:
eg#1: The e-brochure doesn't even mention this new button and it is extremely important if trying to unstuck an RX350 in a deep snow drift.
Then in same brochure they mistakenly call it Vehicle Skid Control
(and they have thanked me and are correcting this) as well as Vehicle Stability Control.
eg#2: The Jan. 26th Toronto Press Release says "with new VSC cut-off switch for driving confidence on any surface, under any weather condition."
eg#3: At least one customer service telephone respondent said I was wrong to say 2008 had a cut-off switch.
eg#4: When asked whether one could disable VSC by removing fuse and then reinstalling and going to Service Manager on next trip, the reponse was standard warranty would be voided.
eg#5: My dealer Sales people want this to go away and so they do not return telephone calls.
I have others but you get the point.
When should driver control and safety for the customers be truly felt, affect the quality of what goes in print and be expressed throughout the culture of Lexus?