RXKen

Ok I'll agree with that statement sort of, it is marketed as a cross-over vehicle, somewhere between a car and a SUV, so it simply depends where on the spectrum you want to place it.

Quote:

The only two things that the FX does better than the RX is in handling and acceleration, but keep in mind that there are unacceptable trade-offs.

First off, that's a highly opinionated statement. The FX also stops quicker than the RX among other benefits, which might be handy in avoiding an accident... Are there trade-offs between the two vehicles? Sure, but it runs both ways, and you haven't defined what is and what isn't "acceptable".

Quote:

The FX handles well, but has a very low driving position (like a Camry station wagon) and a very stiff suspension (for a bone-jarring ride like Kia Sorento.)

Again, a very opinionated and inaccurate statement. My friend who owns the RX330 says just the opposite, that the seating position in the FX is "too high". What might be more interesting would be to MEASURE the seating position as well as to MEASURE the length of travel in each direction. What is the maximum and minimum heights and movements for both vehicles? When you have that information come back and we can discuss this in a more productive manner. Bone Jarring? I haven't ridden in the Sorento, but there is NOTHING about the FX that is "Bone Jarring". The ride is firm but compliant, like a good sports car based vehicle should be.

Quote:

The FX is fast, but the exhaust and tires are also very noisy. I believe that quietness and comfort are the two key pre-requisites for a luxury vehicle.

I will agree with your statement that the FX is fast, for what it is anyway, but the tire noise and the wind noise are both LESS than the RX. I've driven both cars back to back and my friend who owns the RX agrees that the tire noise is almost a wash but perhaps slightly quieter in the FX, but the wind noise is noticeably quieter in the FX vs. the RX. The exhause note on the FX is sweet and the RX has nothing that compares to it. You know JRB would be a good person here to have put a tape recorder in each car or take a sound meter with him and see what the noise levels are in each vehicle.

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The FX simply does not qualify to play in this price range. Some FX interior pieces are made of very flimsy plastics, obviously cost-cutting economy car quality.

Do you make this stuff up or just regurgitate something someone else has told you??? Let's start with "qualifying in a price range" what does that mean exactly? Next lets move to the FX's interior. Yes some parts are made of plastic, the same is true in the RX. Now you are going to try and convince me that the plastic used in the RX is somehow "superior" plastic? We haven't broken ANYTHING in our FX in over 20,000 miles and a year's worth of use, no plastic parts have broken or done anything other than what they are supposed to do, nothing is "flimsy". I wouldn't expect either car to use flimsy cheap plastics and I don't think either car does. Since YOU brought up the subject of interior components. Explain to me why the RX doesn't have REAL aluminum??? Did you notice that REAL METAL aka Aluminum used in the FX? Not only does it look good, but it is durable too, in fact I wish they used even more of it than they already did!

Quote:

You won't see that in the RX. There are real luxury SUVs, and there are imitations. Choose wisely.

True, there are imitations, perhaps you are thinking of the Dodge Durango or Kia Sorrento, because the FX is no imitation, if anything it is the leader in its category and ground breaking in many areas that other manufacturers are now trying to duplicate!

Quote:

If you can live with the trade-offs, you can of course trade in your RX for the FX if your heart so desires. Keep in mind that you already have the finest SUV on the road. It'd be like dumping Britney Spears for Oprah.

I can think of a lot of people I'd dump Britney Spears for, although Oprah might not be one of them. Maybe people can't live with the trade-offs inherent in choosing the RX, did you ever think of that? As I've said many many times in this thread, choose the car/suv/whatever that is best for YOU.

Please stop trying to come here though and toss out OPINION as if it were FACT in support of some "my car is better than your car" attitude. It doesn't lead to anything constructive or a better understanding of either vehicle. You should be using this thread as a vehicle and means of education, not a soap box upon which to bash the competition.

nsx01

JohnsRX,

It is not too late to trade in your RX for a FX. Since you speak very highly of the FX. I think the FX should be in the ugly class as the pontiac Aztec
Who let the FX OOOOOOOOuuuuuuuutttttttt.

toy4two

I can't believe the level of service I get at Lexus. I'm young at 24 and figured they would try to hose me like all other mechanics. Boy was I in for a shock. Late one Sunday afternoon I broke a wheel lock and even through they were about to close they stayed open just so they could fit me in. They've also replaced entire assemblies under warranty. My antenna was bent, did they blame me? Nope, even through I drove it into my garage with it up bending it, they replaced the whole motor. I came in saying I heard some noise from the engine, they couldn't recreate it but they went ahead and replaced all the belts for free, say what? These are even wear items.

They've got me for life and I'm recommending them to everyone I know.

HarrierAWD

Mr. RXKen:

First, please refrain from these non-sense attacks. Unlike Internet newsgroup, all forums in ClubLexus are moderated. My opinions may differ from yours (actually, your friend's according to your post,) but no two persons can possibly agree 100% on everything. I'd like to hear your opinion, even if it differs from mine. So I'd hate to see your post removed or your account terminated.

My opinions on the RX300, new RX330 and FX are based on my ownership and personal test drives, none was "made up" or "hear-say" from friends. I'm semi-retired so I have plenty of time to test drive cars, among other things. Back in the old days, I used to travel a lot for business and had driven at least 50 different models of rental cars, SUVs, and one minivan (yikes.) So I do have some knowledge and experience in comparing vehicles, maybe better than the average folks, though I don't think that I'm as good as those editors at Car and Driver or Motor Trend magazines.

I have a 2002 RX300 just like the original poster, so there's absolutely nothing about "my car is better than your car" attitude. He and I own the exact same vehicle. He just liked the FX more based on his opinion, I liked the RX more, also based on my opinion.

My opinion on the FX stands: It's fast, but too noisy (try a highway merge on a short ramp it handles very well, but the ride is bone-jarring (try a highway with expansion joints.) Feel free to disagree, but please at least take a real test drive first. You just might agree with me after all. Thanks.

JRB

Regardiing noise levels, I don't consider our FX45 to be noisy at all. I just did a quick check of a recent Car & Driver comparison, which measured the interior sound levels of four different vehicles at a 70 mph steady cruise. At a steady highway speed the engine is not working particularly hard and most noise entering the cabin is from wind and the tires. In this comparison, the FX45, the Cadillac SRX, and Porsche Cayenne and the VW Touareg all measured exactly the same, at 68 db. In a different issue, in which they test true luxury SEDANS, the Mercedes S430, the Jaguar XJ8 and the Audi A8L were all measured at 67db - only one db less. And the "as-tested" prices of these cars ranged from $65,000 to $88,000.

The RX330? In February 2003 C&D tested it and recorded a 69 db sound level in the same test. Again not much different but you certainly can't argue that it's any quieter.

If you want "quiet" you should buy either the LS 430 or the BMW 745i, which were both measured at 65 db!

HarrierAWD

Very good research, but I was referring to highway merge. Could you give us the full-throttle acceleration db number for the RX330 and FX35? (To be fair, the FX45 is a V8.) Thanks.

Also db number alone does not tell the whole story. The type of sound matters, too. For example, at the same db number, a low-frequency exhaust noise is more annoying than engine humming sound at a higher frequency.

The FX has an annoying exhaust roar. It's at the "perfect" frequency to drive me nuts. Maybe some people like the sporty sound, but I sure don't. The RX has no exhaust sound, just wind noise above 70 mph. Wind noise is a bit annoying, but it's better than exhaust sound IMHO.

parula

Harrier,

that would bug me too, RX is GREAT, a quiet engine/exhaust system!

You have some really good points imo. I wonder where/directionally they took the noise readings? For instance in the RX, as you mentioned, the windshield noise is pretty bad both to me, wife and several riders compared to standard minivans, Explorer, etc. we ride in routinely too. It is almost as if the RX is noise balanced, a nice quite (ABSOLUTELY GREAT!!) chassis/cabin offset by a rush of wind noise above 40mph windspeed on the front windshield, even more I think than the '99 that eventually became tolerable to me. That noise on the windshield is really annoying, and about the only rub I have for the car which is simply amazing overall, because the noise is right in the front where my attention is and the windnoise is there. I'm going to test drive an FX for comparision. I'd love to have a noise meter on the front cabin on these cars to test the windshield noise. Anybody have one?

I read a review somewhere I think that LX put better/thicker/? glass on the side of the car to reduce side wind noise - knuckle thunk the side front window - or the little triangle window that had a TSB on earlier models for windnoise and the fix was thicker/better??? glass I think. It sure seems firmer than the front but it is hard to tell given the size difference - I wonder if/ why they didn't or can't do that for the front shield - would be great to have a more quite windshield, imo? You'd think the technology's out there. Does the FX cost more, maybe it has a different/better grade of glass?

- - - saving my pennies

LexFather

That is because some people in the FX think they are driving a Ferrari with a backpack . Nissan has been making great stock exhaust notes recently, I think it sounds ridiculous in a SUV. My opinion though. Maybe 1 day I'll get the whole notion of fast SUVs that are that much quicker to roll over.

BTW, where is the "Utility"?True. I find the FX a good buy at 35-40k. 50k for an Infiniti anything is nuts. Re-sale value of a used condom. It shares the G35 steering wheel, gearknob, door handles, seats, etc etc. I don't see the ES/IS parts in the RX. BTW, the following is a statement from Infiniti concerning their OWN interiors....Challenges coming Challenges coming

With an assortment of new products coming, Deutsche Bank analyst Rod Lache said the coming year "looks great" for Infiniti, but he quickly cautioned that the automaker has to "hit the mark…to continue the momentum." And Lache points to several challenges Infiniti is facing.

While the automaker recently topped the J.D. Power Customer Satisfaction Index, it has room to improve its quality, analysts note. Some of that is perceived quality, and Infiniti is frequently faulted for falling short in terms of its interiors. That, said, Igo, is an area the division intends to address over the next several years with better designs and more up-market materials.

There's also the issue of the Q45, the model that's supposed to serve as Infiniti's flagship. The current Q simply gets lost in the crowd, said Lache, and Infiniti officials don't disagree.

"This car has to be a dream car for all your clients," said Patrick Pelata, the Nissan board member in charge of product planning and strategy. "It has to be distinctive and expressive of your brand."

Asked what that might mean going forward, Pelata disarmingly responded, "I'm not sure we have the right answer" at the moment. It is quite possible, Pelata suggested, that the Q series might be dropped entirely, with Infiniti shifting its focus to the more sporty M series.

JRB

At full throttle, C&D measured the RX330 at 71 db; the FX is 3 db louder at 74. The FX's 74 was the same as the Porsche Cayenne, whereas the VW Touareg and Cadillac SRX were one db louder at 75. So as was the case with the 70 mph coasting levels, all of the four of the V8-powered vehicles in the C&D comparison were within 1db of each other. I think all of these are tuned for a sportier exhaust sound, which obviously some find appealing while others would like no engine exhaust note whatsoever. On the FX45, I found the exhaust note to be in line with the car's character - no complaints here. That said, one of the main reasons why I decided on the FX45 was that I didn't particularly care for the higher pitched (and to me, louder) engine and exhaust note of the FX35. Along with the added power and torque of the V8, the 45 gives a "throatier" exhaust sound that I found very appealing.

The higher db level of the RX at 70 mph coasting must be attributable to a little more wind noise, as some here have complained about. But I haven't found it to be objectionable at all on my wife's RX. On our last service visit, I did have them add some insulation material around the base of the front windshield, but this was done in an attempt to eliminate some creaking noise when going over bumps, not for wind noise.

HarrierAWD

Thanks for the info. Looks like my ears didn't fool me after all: RX330 at 71 db, FX45 at 74 db. I suppose the FX35 that I test drove must be at least 76 db or higher during acceleration.

The RX330 I drove on the highway had the Goodyear tires on (I didn't get the Michelin RX330 on the highway.) It got some tire noise on certain pavement. The wind noise didn't kick in until I got over 70 mph, which is quite nice IMHO.

HarrierAWD

JRB is kind to provide us with the db readings from Car & Driver, so no need to get a noise meter. I suppose C&D would put the meter right next to the driver's ear?

The Acura MDX used to be plagued with wind noise problem when it first came out. Acura solved the problem by increasing the thickness of the windshield glass. So thicker glass is indeed helpful.

parula

HarrierAWD, tks, confirms my theory, I discussed this with folks at the local Safelite autoglass repair store; they told me all the glass they sell is the same thickness and at least the people I talked to had no clue about noise transmission properties in their products. I am neither a noise engineer or a glass specialist but I believe with some little effort I could quiet that windshield at nominal cost notwithstanding safety issues and regulatory limitations.

I can't wait to test that FX for front cabin noise!

kutscher

The fx is quite quiet, but not like the lexus. The 04 I drove had some rattles and wind noise. The engine noise was close to my GS4, in my opinion. the exhaust sound was good.
here was my quick review
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...5&pagenumber=5

HarrierAWD

FWIW, aluminum is far cheaper than the genuine walnut wood used in Lexus. It's really not an exotic metal. You can easily find aluminum foil in any kitchen.

JRB

True, but I wonder why Lexus decided to use the fake aluminum (plastic) on the center console area, instead of the real thing, especially if it's so cheap as you say. Otherwise, the genuine wood and the rest of the interior are much classier than the materials used in the FX, I would agree.