Driver window stuck down
05-12-12, 09:00 PM
#1
Intermediate
Thread Starter
Driver window stuck down
Did an oil and ATF change on the car
I usually drop driver window down as I drive the car onto the ramp to gauge how far I have to gas.
After the work was done, I proceeded to reverse off the ramp and put up the window. Nothing...
Tried again, it started coming up in normal speed, I thought, ok let's do a reset on it. Maybe it's acting up on the anti-pinch thing again.
Put it half way down, and tried to put it up, it went straight down and would not come back up.
I've pulled the battery to completely reset the car already and my dad(primary driver of this car) told me the window has been acting up and sometimes just wouldn't go back up after being down. I wish he told me a bit in advance...
Here are the symptoms which I hope I can get some feedback on what to do next.
When I try to put the window up or down, I hear a click from the window control module. All the other windows don't give this click noise since it is operating as it should.
I thought maybe the module is not working so I pulled it off, cleaned it a bit and tried again.
I found that the clicking is from the black box that's outlined in red.
When I press the down operation on the driver window, the courtesy light dims, but when i press up, light doesn't dim.
If i trigger the "auto" up function and release, I can hear two clicks along with a quick dim on the courtesy light.
I cannot hear or feel the click in my hand when I tried all other windows.
Does this prove I don't have a motor problem and it's switch related?
It's Sunday tomorrow, all Toyota parts stores are closed and I am still not sure if it's a motor, regulator or the module that's bad. Am I looking at pulling the door panel off and try to unscrew a few things to push the window back up?
I usually drop driver window down as I drive the car onto the ramp to gauge how far I have to gas.
After the work was done, I proceeded to reverse off the ramp and put up the window. Nothing...
Tried again, it started coming up in normal speed, I thought, ok let's do a reset on it. Maybe it's acting up on the anti-pinch thing again.
Put it half way down, and tried to put it up, it went straight down and would not come back up.
I've pulled the battery to completely reset the car already and my dad(primary driver of this car) told me the window has been acting up and sometimes just wouldn't go back up after being down. I wish he told me a bit in advance...
Here are the symptoms which I hope I can get some feedback on what to do next.
When I try to put the window up or down, I hear a click from the window control module. All the other windows don't give this click noise since it is operating as it should.
I thought maybe the module is not working so I pulled it off, cleaned it a bit and tried again.
I found that the clicking is from the black box that's outlined in red.
When I press the down operation on the driver window, the courtesy light dims, but when i press up, light doesn't dim.
If i trigger the "auto" up function and release, I can hear two clicks along with a quick dim on the courtesy light.
I cannot hear or feel the click in my hand when I tried all other windows.
Does this prove I don't have a motor problem and it's switch related?
It's Sunday tomorrow, all Toyota parts stores are closed and I am still not sure if it's a motor, regulator or the module that's bad. Am I looking at pulling the door panel off and try to unscrew a few things to push the window back up?
Last edited by wing0; 05-12-12 at 10:10 PM.
05-12-12, 11:30 PM
#2
Mr W,
I don't own an RX, it's my DIL's and I am only the mechanic for it. I have never had problems with the window switch but do you have "auto- up or down" on the other windows or only on the drivers? If only on the drivers, I would assume that relay is to latch onto the up or down til it comes to the end of travel or the button is "unlatched". I suppose one relay COULD be used to "auto" more than one window, but I don't know what would happen if 2 or more were "auto'd" at the same time. Can't quite see how one relay would do that. I would pull the rubber boot from the post to the door and make sure there is NO evidence of damage to the wires in that arra. You may have to pull the door panel off and jump juice directly to the motor (disconnected connector) to establish that the motor is indeed not the problem. My suggestion is to pull the trim panel and plug the master switch back in (or leave it plugged if possible) and while holding the switch in the up position, rap the motor a couple or three times with a wooden hammer handle to "jar" the contacts in the motor. If it works then, it probably is your motor. I believe the 2 clicks you feel in "auto up" is because the window is stuck down (for whatever reason, probably motor) and the relay is "latching" and "unlatching" because it senses amp draw that is excessive. It doesn't know the window is not at limit and causing the draw.
"Unscrewing a few things to push the window up" won't work unless you are ready to tape the window up, completely free from being held up by the motor.
I don't own an RX, it's my DIL's and I am only the mechanic for it. I have never had problems with the window switch but do you have "auto- up or down" on the other windows or only on the drivers? If only on the drivers, I would assume that relay is to latch onto the up or down til it comes to the end of travel or the button is "unlatched". I suppose one relay COULD be used to "auto" more than one window, but I don't know what would happen if 2 or more were "auto'd" at the same time. Can't quite see how one relay would do that. I would pull the rubber boot from the post to the door and make sure there is NO evidence of damage to the wires in that arra. You may have to pull the door panel off and jump juice directly to the motor (disconnected connector) to establish that the motor is indeed not the problem. My suggestion is to pull the trim panel and plug the master switch back in (or leave it plugged if possible) and while holding the switch in the up position, rap the motor a couple or three times with a wooden hammer handle to "jar" the contacts in the motor. If it works then, it probably is your motor. I believe the 2 clicks you feel in "auto up" is because the window is stuck down (for whatever reason, probably motor) and the relay is "latching" and "unlatching" because it senses amp draw that is excessive. It doesn't know the window is not at limit and causing the draw.
"Unscrewing a few things to push the window up" won't work unless you are ready to tape the window up, completely free from being held up by the motor.
05-12-12, 11:43 PM
#3
Intermediate
Thread Starter
Mr W,
I don't own an RX, it's my DIL's and I am only the mechanic for it. I have never had problems with the window switch but do you have "auto- up or down" on the other windows or only on the drivers? If only on the drivers, I would assume that relay is to latch onto the up or down til it comes to the end of travel or the button is "unlatched". I suppose one relay COULD be used to "auto" more than one window, but I don't know what would happen if 2 or more were "auto'd" at the same time. Can't quite see how one relay would do that. I would pull the rubber boot from the post to the door and make sure there is NO evidence of damage to the wires in that arra. You may have to pull the door panel off and jump juice directly to the motor (disconnected connector) to establish that the motor is indeed not the problem. My suggestion is to pull the trim panel and plug the master switch back in (or leave it plugged if possible) and while holding the switch in the up position, rap the motor a couple or three times with a wooden hammer handle to "jar" the contacts in the motor. If it works then, it probably is your motor. I believe the 2 clicks you feel in "auto up" is because the window is stuck down (for whatever reason, probably motor) and the relay is "latching" and "unlatching" because it senses amp draw that is excessive. It doesn't know the window is not at limit and causing the draw.
"Unscrewing a few things to push the window up" won't work unless you are ready to tape the window up, completely free from being held up by the motor.
I don't own an RX, it's my DIL's and I am only the mechanic for it. I have never had problems with the window switch but do you have "auto- up or down" on the other windows or only on the drivers? If only on the drivers, I would assume that relay is to latch onto the up or down til it comes to the end of travel or the button is "unlatched". I suppose one relay COULD be used to "auto" more than one window, but I don't know what would happen if 2 or more were "auto'd" at the same time. Can't quite see how one relay would do that. I would pull the rubber boot from the post to the door and make sure there is NO evidence of damage to the wires in that arra. You may have to pull the door panel off and jump juice directly to the motor (disconnected connector) to establish that the motor is indeed not the problem. My suggestion is to pull the trim panel and plug the master switch back in (or leave it plugged if possible) and while holding the switch in the up position, rap the motor a couple or three times with a wooden hammer handle to "jar" the contacts in the motor. If it works then, it probably is your motor. I believe the 2 clicks you feel in "auto up" is because the window is stuck down (for whatever reason, probably motor) and the relay is "latching" and "unlatching" because it senses amp draw that is excessive. It doesn't know the window is not at limit and causing the draw.
"Unscrewing a few things to push the window up" won't work unless you are ready to tape the window up, completely free from being held up by the motor.
I finally got the window to go back up!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SUPER EXCITED as I can finally go sleep properly.
All 4 switches have auto up/down feature.
I plug the master switch back on and of course it doesn't do anything, and as I was getting frustrated. I smack the switch on the side a few times while pressing the switch. Suddenly I hear this slight noise and a delay, then the window began coming up, but not in a one smooth motion, instead it's as if the switch is not sending a continuous signal. Got it totally up, not touching it!!! I almost want to take the switch off and block off the contacts on the PCB board to prevent anybody accidentally touching it! (If police pull my dad over, they can go over to the passenger side to talk to him)
i did open up the whole thing, exposing the other side where the switch would push on specific contacts to perform specific operations. There was no dirt to wipe off.
What do people mean by cleaning the switch? Do you actually take the switch button off and clean the inside?
I still feel something is out of whack with the switch module. It's the door that gets the most vibration and the switch getting used the most as car usually get one occupant inside.
Also, horrendous prices on a replacement switch. I would rather convert to manual window for that price
05-13-12, 12:15 AM
#4
AS stated, I've never had reason to have one of those switches apart, but I have had MANY other master switches apart and virtually ALL have to have contacts inside even if the have a complicated electronic panel on the back like that does. And YES, you do have to take the switch apart to clean the actual CONTACTS, which MAY well be your problem. I've been used to fixing things all my life (spent my life in automotive work) so it's not usually a problem for me to figure how to get things apart without breaking something. Most of the time the snap together, some of the time there are screws involved, but if you're a clever guy you can figure how it's held together without breaking it. There are all different kind of designs so 1st. time around even I would have to figure it out. They don't intend for you to fix that kind of thing, just buy a new one so no manual on how to take the switch apart. I can virtually guaranty it can be cleaned up just fine. The contacts are copper (with silver plating on it) and I would generally use 0000 steel wool if just dirty or 320 grit wet (use it dry) sandpaper if the contacts are burned. Clean ALL the contacts while you're in there.
P.S. If the contacts are burned they are going to be developing a high Ohms resistance and causing the problem that might appear like a bad motor. Also, when the switch is held (if the auto relay dousn't "unlatch" the juice) the high resistance from the poor contact (rough burned contacts) will heat it up and can cause contact (or partial contact) just from the expansion and change of shape of the contacts. That's why a starter that's going bad will sometimes work if you hit the key several times. The heating from poor contact resistance causes slight contour change and may result in canceling the road service call. But you may not be so lucky the next time. Grins!
P.S. If the contacts are burned they are going to be developing a high Ohms resistance and causing the problem that might appear like a bad motor. Also, when the switch is held (if the auto relay dousn't "unlatch" the juice) the high resistance from the poor contact (rough burned contacts) will heat it up and can cause contact (or partial contact) just from the expansion and change of shape of the contacts. That's why a starter that's going bad will sometimes work if you hit the key several times. The heating from poor contact resistance causes slight contour change and may result in canceling the road service call. But you may not be so lucky the next time. Grins!
Last edited by code58; 05-13-12 at 12:32 AM.
10-31-12, 11:25 AM
#5
Driver School Candidate
A likely solution...but where to order the relays?
Did you end up fixing this problem? I'm traveling the same journey with this popular problem--with the addition that sometimes pushing the "up" button after the window just traveled down makes it go again down, rather than up. Not just no response, but sometimes the opposite response. This points to the very relays you showed on the the photo, which are both "H-Bridge" relays--designed to reverse polarity to directly drive a DC motor. Also their specs and size indicate a strong likelihood of contact failure over time, since those window motors push and pull quite a heavy load and probably have a heavy inrush and outrush.
Also, as you did, banging the switch board (lovingly of course) whilst the other board's switch is held down instigates the immediate corrective action. So the problem is quite certainly on this board. (The "Power Window Switch" board in the hand-rest, either driver's side or passenger's side.)
Now I'm trying to find both of them online--Mouser is out of the CR2-12V, and the other one (Taiko TB2-160) is only available from the alibaba folks (who sell only in bulk lots). Any ideas on where to get these?
If not, then the next step is to crack open the relay case and try to clean it manually.
This is all theoretical at this point, but it's the most plausible solution yet, since I've already tried cleaning contacts, checking connections, and resoldering everything suspicious.
Where can we get some new relays?
Also, as you did, banging the switch board (lovingly of course) whilst the other board's switch is held down instigates the immediate corrective action. So the problem is quite certainly on this board. (The "Power Window Switch" board in the hand-rest, either driver's side or passenger's side.)
Now I'm trying to find both of them online--Mouser is out of the CR2-12V, and the other one (Taiko TB2-160) is only available from the alibaba folks (who sell only in bulk lots). Any ideas on where to get these?
If not, then the next step is to crack open the relay case and try to clean it manually.
This is all theoretical at this point, but it's the most plausible solution yet, since I've already tried cleaning contacts, checking connections, and resoldering everything suspicious.
Where can we get some new relays?
10-31-12, 11:31 AM
#6
Intermediate
Thread Starter
Sorry, I can only post a quick reply so I don't forget about this thread.
I was not able to fix the switch even though I was debating on whether to open it up.
In the end, I was able to find a used switch online and now using it as the primary switch.
i wanted to ensure I had something that's well enough before I attempt to play around with the original switch, but I have yet to have time to do it.
I was not able to fix the switch even though I was debating on whether to open it up.
In the end, I was able to find a used switch online and now using it as the primary switch.
i wanted to ensure I had something that's well enough before I attempt to play around with the original switch, but I have yet to have time to do it.
10-31-12, 07:45 PM
#7
My drivers window went down and stayed down the other day. It was the physical switch button itself that i could tell was broken and didnt feel like the others. I removed the switch from the door, using a pocket screwdriver i pryed each side clip from the button and removed what was left of the white plastic fork piece thats between the button and the spring under it. Now it actually moves faster up and down. I guess because the up and down contacts are no longer impeded.
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03-02-13, 07:42 AM
#8
The relay marked "CR2-12V" will go bad after many up/down cycles. Symptoms will include window going down when up is selected. The relay is avaliable... Just google CR2-12V. I replaced mine and my window works perfectly now.
03-05-13, 06:11 AM
#9
Driver School Candidate
How did you know it was the big relay?
(Am I overthinking this!?!?)
Thanks!
03-05-13, 04:42 PM
#10
(had this all typed and my computer erased it)
The other relay controls the other windows. The CR12 relay is present at all the windows and controls only that window. The relays are hard to find, but this place seems to have them:
http://wellic.com/0/1599944/cr212v.html
The other relay controls the other windows. The CR12 relay is present at all the windows and controls only that window. The relays are hard to find, but this place seems to have them:
http://wellic.com/0/1599944/cr212v.html
09-14-13, 08:57 AM
#11
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I'm having same issue where window did the opposite of what was intended. It's only done it once but that seems like gesture enough that I should probably be planning to replace it.
Any pointers on swapping out this relay? I presume it's soldered onto the board?
Any pointers on swapping out this relay? I presume it's soldered onto the board?
02-16-18, 01:02 AM
#15
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RX300 Window Relay
I had the same problem, got this one on ebay, nice price, fit so nice and fast shipping!!
https://www.ebay.com/itm/NAIS-CR2-12...ZZeWxx&vxp=mtr
https://www.ebay.com/itm/NAIS-CR2-12...ZZeWxx&vxp=mtr