BiggerOkie

Wife informed me today that her passenger side window will not move.....and you know it....its stuck all the way down. I just had to tell her "park it in the garage until I can look at it"(shift work sucks sometimes). I do know this......it clicks from both buttons(drivers and pass. side) When I say 'click", I assume it is some kind of solenoid. SO......my question is, is this a motor problem? She did tell me that for a month now(she couldnt tell me this when it first started ) if the window is partially down, she has to take it ALL the way down then back up to completely get it back up(could this play into the problem?). So ANY info would be appreciated....

Thanks
David

code58

.

Hi David,
Where Ya been? Ya, I know, that shift work . There are several things it could be. Maybe your wife doesn't know up from down.... er, no, I didn't say that did I? Don't tell her! JK Have someone hold the switch "UP" while you slam the door a couple of times. If the motor is getting weak (brushes worn?) it may just jar it into action. Another thing you can do is bang on the bottom or inside of the door to try and jar it loose. (Someone holding the switch "up" naturally) If that fails, remove the door panel and hit the motor with the end of a hammer handle while someone holds the switch "UP". If any of this works, hold the switch in the UP position for 4 or 5 seconds to do a reset on the "up" and "down" limits once it gets to the top. Even if it works and gets the window back in proper operation, you MAY still need a new motor if yours is getting weak.

BiggerOkie

Too late!!! I woke her up and read your reply to her!!!!!!!!! She is on her way(shes Cherokee Indian so she CAN track you down!!) JK.......ok...I will try this when I get up this afternoon. I really appreciate the help...

BTW...what ARE YOU doing up so late

BiggerOkie

Tried the slamming the door trick when I got home this morning.....no go. When I woke up this afternoon my wife informed me that my 13 yr old was playing with it and it went up. So at least its in the "up" position. Still confused on what it might be, since it appears to come and go.

code58

I generally get to bed by 2- 2:30 AM. Have to feel the pain of you shift workers SOMEHOW. Besides, now I have to keep one eye open so I don't get scalped!
I'm used to tearing things apart so I probably would take the door panel off and unplug the motor and jump juice directly to it in both direction a half dozen times or so to make sure the motor works consistently. Then with a test light or other testing device of your choice I would test the output of the plug going to the motor. Up and then reverse the leads about half a dozen times. I believe you have relays under the dash that do the reversing of the juice for up and down. You should have contacts in the switch that, with enough age, get burned or crudy and make poor contact. I believe the RX door switch has electronic component on the bottom of it. It's a little hard to diagnose from this far away. The relays that you hear should be under the dash and could be bad but relays are one of the most trouble free parts on a car generally. I would suspect either dirty contacts in the switch or worn out brushes in the motor. The power has to come from the main switch and through the door switch to the motor I'm pretty sure. I kinow the door motor (any of the 3) won't operate with the door switch disconnected, even if you are only trying from the drivers switch. I generally go to the farthest point and follow the juice back from there till I pick it up (if the end unit is not operating). I do have a short finder system that makes it easier to find sometimes. Intermittent can be a bear.

salimshah

David ... If you make the title of the thread a bit more descriptive, you would get more responses in your thread.

I am going on a limb here ,,,, there was discussion on similar problem and the dealer diagnosed the culprit to be the driver side (master-switch). The OP was complaining that he had to purchase the whole set and not just one switch ... that is how Lexus stocks the part ... switch assembly.

Just a reminder that a solution/problem faced by one person does not mean it is your problem too. Proper diagnostics is essential.

Salim

thomas1

Could even be a wire in the door hinge area that is making and breaking...I bought a Camry for my mother in law and the windows didnt work, Took the drivers door apart and followed the harness to where it goes thru the door jam...Pulled back the wired and right where they bend found 4 wires in different states of breaking. Soldered new wire into those four lines and the windows work great.....The owner discounted the car to me because of it... He had aldready replaced the door switch which was similar to the RX300 switch (not same) but with the same number of buttons...I would look at those wires first....maybe you will get lucky like me. ANd Roger, go back to sleep...you are a wild and crazy guy.

BiggerOkie

Very good point. Thank you
Could it be the master switch when it does it from both?


Thomas, when I get up tomorrow and start looking I will definitely look for bad wires.

Again, I appreciate all the help

David

code58

Nope Thomas, I'm a middle child, that means "peace maker", which truly does describe me. Now, the "wild and crazy guy", I'll blame that on my wife. I wasn't like that when I married her (which was a loooong time ago!) She taught me how to laugh (I mean really laugh!), it was laugh or be laughed at, so I thought learning was the better choice.
Concerning the wires breaking. They have used a different kind of copper for the last 12-15 years and it is less flexible and more brittle and prone to breakage. It carries a higher amperage on a smaller wire, hence the reason for using it. The looms have become so loaded with wires (more than a hundred in some looms) that they had to do something to keep the looms smaller than your arm. I did Code 3 outfitting and we built pretty much all of our looms. Where we soldered (mostly inside where several wires came together into one) you would sometimes have a problem with breakage from the brittlement of the soldering. I personally prefer butt connecting and IF it requires water proofing, use the water proof butt connectors. I NEVER used the "insulated " crimp slot, ALWAYS the "non-insulated" to do crimps on insulated wire. Absolutely secure and will not cause further embrittlement. As you know, they have had some problem on F-150's like our with the same wires at the hinge post where they flex. Butt connect and use a "loop" (like an airplane looping) of nice fine wire from the electronics shop to relieve strain and end the "brittle breakage".

BiggerOkie

Your gonna have to sleep more!

code58

David, I would probably look where Thomas said 1st because the juice has to come through the master to the door. The window will not operate with EITHER switch disconnected. If it were a break in the wire (or wires) it would explain why it does it with both. As I stated before, the relays you hear come into play to do the reverse of direction (probably MORE than just that.)

thomas1

Hey When I splice the wire I do it on either side of the hinge point so that the flexing does work on the solder joints...Yea I am a old NAVY Electronics tech that knows the meaning of flexing and breaking...Thanks Roger for your tips, but I dont like the butt joints, just me. I used them for years when I worked at my former company, but unless you have the proper crimping tool, they should not be mis-used. The tool I have cost like $100, My former company decided they were a one time kit tool...for a electrical fire hazard retrofit...After the installation, the tool was bye bye...

salimshah

Is it the master switch or not? Cant say much ,,, other than I saw a discussion on it. The dealer has the switch in stock and they can swap it out and see. The ohm-meter test can be misleading as the motor has a higher current draw. With the schematic you can do a voltmeter test and confirm the right +12v and gnd with switch in different position with load ... be careful as you would have to work with battery connected and the glass would move]

Readers (who have interest) can clearly see, how much engineering goes into the machines we drive. Little things like strain-reliefs and tie downs make a difference. Around the door hing the right amount of slack is needed.

If you guys allow me to make a sweeping statement, Lexus connectors and wires are very good. I am comparing with BMW's of late 80's and 90's where the insulation would wear off as the wires rub with each other.

In summary, if you work on electrical stuff, remember to reattach strain reliefs, tie-downs and the right amount of slack in the wires [another reason for not repairing by a simple lap-joint ]

Salim

code58

Hi Thomas,
I respect your feelings about butt connectors, but after using probably tens of thousands of them i feel very confident in the job they do. We used the best you could get. I used a long frame Thomas (any relation? ) & Betts crimping pliers and as stated, ONLY ever used the non-insulated cavity on the insulated wire. I tested it several times on different size connectors and wire and after crimping. clamped one end of the wire in a vice and pulled until failure. Not once did it ever pull out of the crimp, always broke the wire (and we used good wire) some place in the length of the wire. That's what convinced me of the integrity of the connection. What is the last time you've seen a soldered connection on the pos. battery cable, regardless of how much juice it carried? I figure if the crimp on the heaviest duty car or truck electrical systems (batt. pos. cable) is deemed sufficient (and I believe it is) then the use of butt connectors, DONE RIGHT, is also sufficient for most of what I do, or did. I was always very conservative (outfitted at a 150-200% safety level) and amp clamped everything I did to eliminate any guess work, since most all of it was custom work (often one of a kind). This was all law enforcement and MUST NOT fail, even if used for hours at a time.

code58

Thomas,
For curiosity sake we turned on everything that could be turned on at one time in a Black and White. (obviously this condition, even with heavy equipment use, would almost never happen.) We recorded a 125 amp draw with an amp clamp. They used extra heavy duty batteries but that juice all flows through the original Ford factory crimped positive battery cable and back through the factory crimped ground cable. I rest my case.