DougHII

Transmission issues recurring problem, some electronic and then it started dumping fluid and slipping. Valve cover gasket at +/- 50k, driver side passenger door handle fell off twice, front passenger seat belt would not faster for two weeks, took it in, and it fastened for them. A week later, would not fasten. A rear window regulator/motor went out. One of the tail lights kept shorting out. The right reverse light did not work when traded and had intermittent issues for 2 years. Occasionally the right brake light and right turn signal would go out on that same tail light assembly. I could take the light out, clean the contacts and make it work. Water leaked into through a faulty trunk seal and screwed up some electronics.

And then I started to get a rattle underneath at idle that I could hear faintly with the window down that could have been either a heat shield or a catalytic converter. I traded it before it got bad or before taking it somewhere to diagnose.

As you can see, bad first experience. I also felt like BMW services was very vanilla and impersonal. Perhaps because I am used to dealing with Porsche, but BMW was very high volume, impersonal and kind of sloppy. I may not have been so frustrated if service was better or seemed to care.

4TehNguyen

iTrader: (1)

the M3 did not lose weight, it weighs more than a comparable E9X M. C class has lost weight though

toyotatom

Amazingly Top Gear just "happened" to have a video camera right there to see the RCF go into the grass also. What a joke

FSportIS

iTrader: (13)

Holy macro! That is like foreign language to me. I never encounter all these issues with my Honda or the Lexus. Almost all of my cars that I have run for 10 years are basically oil, transmission fluid, tire, brake rotors/pads change. Some light bulbs go out here and there but not much major issue.

I thought BMW give you maintenance for free for the first 5 years and everything is warrantied as well? I do like the its handling on the 235i which I tested recently but I still feel like the handling is too much computerized still so don't feel the soul of the car. I still prefer the steering feedback on the Lexus IS with F sport package.

Thank you very much for sharing your information. By the way, another friend of mine is also a BMW, Porsche, Benz racing instructor on the East side. He has been racing for 35 years or so. I think you might even know him. I am a newbie performance driver on the other hand haha.

Ryanmcd

I had an M5 and it got so bad they offered to tow it from my house and tow it back after it was fixed. It does not matter if the maintenance is free if your cars in the shop 3-4 times a year, or you go out of town and spend 1/2 your vacation at the dealer.

I think BMW sucks and people just get it because the name but most have never even owned one or are just so much of a die hard fan they deal with it. Same with some people here on this forum.

My step father worked on BMW and MB for 30 years and he has 2 old 198x MB's because he says the new stuff is trash.

If you have no brand loyalty it's a lot easier to get a car that fits your needs not your ego.

451BHP

One of the most-hyped aspects about the F8X was its weight loss. Can you provide a link which demonstrates that the F8X is heavier? Nearly everything I've found has the F8X as lighter (sometimes by as much as 200 lbs). I did however find one instance in which the F8X weighed the same. Still on my probationary period and can't post links.

Agreed re: the C63 though. The W204 C63 weighs between 3,815 and 3,900 lbs. Mine weighed in at 3,820 lbs.

The W205 C63's claimed curb weight is 3,615 lbs (non-S model).

05RollaXRS

One instance is, the M4 weighed 3610 pounds in the M4 vs RC-F comparo by Motor Trend. RC-F weighed 4040 lbs.

4TehNguyen

iTrader: (1)

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1029340

3450# in a stripper config with 3 gallons of gas. Meaning you add gas, the 80# penalty of a DCT and its close to 3600#.

according to this similary optioned E9X and F8X weigh within 80# of each other, despite the claimed 176# less number BMW claimed.
http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=974479

BMW misled people with this 3300/3400# nonsense. Really the M is going to weigh just a little more than an LFA and C7 Stringray? They already lied to us once saying the 1 series was going to be all lightweight. Then it wasnt. Now Im hearing the new C63 is going to be 3600# when the last gen one was over 3900# in some tests. With both powerplants weighing about the same, how did it lose over 300#.

gyrase321

A true luxury car is one that is aesthetically pleasing and mechanically superb, as well as durable. When paying $70k to 100k or more for a car, I expect no less. A so-called luxury car may run 0-60 in 3 secs, but if its door handles fall off and the lights start conking out in barely 40K miles of use, that's not a true luxury car in my opinion. It's a joke masquerading as a luxury car. I get that people pay for such cars (as a physician, I see this all the time in our doctors' lounge when people talk about the German cars they bought/leased). Some of the new grads fresh out of residency/fellowship training are excited to buy their first German luxury car. After a few months, they show up in the parking lot with loaners because their German car is in the dealer getting fixed. One radiologist friend of mine has a BMW 750i but a lot of times, he has a loaner X3 in the parking lot instead of the 750i. Sometimes you have to ask...what is the point?

carss

This propaganda about bad BMW reliability is getting silly so will add our personal experience. Just looking at our recent past/current BMWs:

2008 e92 M3: zero issues, just normal service (free)
2009 e92 M3: zero issues, just normal service (free)
2011 e92 335 xdrive: zero issues, just normal service (free)
2012 f10 550: zero issues, just normal service (free)
2014 f10 528: zero issues, just normal service (free)
2015 f82 M4: zero issues, just normal service (free)

The 2008 m3, 2011 335 and the 2015 M4 were through BMW's European Delivery program and were picked up in Munich with practically zero miles then driven throughout Europe for thousands of miles with no issues in the middle of summers before shipped here.

As with any manufacturer there are going to be situations where a specific car may encounter issues and the owner will be very vocal rightly so. But let's not generalize this to silliness.

05RollaXRS

Wow! Bimmer forums coming out of the wood works here on this forum in full force. I wonder how many RC-F/Lexus owners are going to Bimmer forums and policing those forums? Let me guess? ZERO!

Anything close to criticism of weak points in BMW/M4 are considered propaganda. It has become more and more clear that all of the criticism needs to be reserved for the RCF.

Read a little closer. DougHII used to be an ACTUAL M3 owner. All of the issues he listed were what he faced personally. There is no propaganda when you are narrating the issues you personally have faced with a particular brand

carss

Over the years I have had Lexus cars with the last one being a 2014 GS350 fsport, Have been a member here since 2006. Have also had Mercedes cars with the last one being a 2013 CLS550 so no specific brand loyalty here.

My point was the silliness of generalizations that a specific brand is unreliable based on a couple of specific cases and to prove that I listed my personal experience.

451BHP

Thanks for the links. So the F8X is still lighter than the E9X. The difference is just not as drastic as advertised. Still, with just that example alone, the delta is nearly 100 lbs (in favor of the new M3).

Re: the C63 - It lost weight because with the W205 chassis, MB replaced a lot of steel with high-strength, lightweight aluminum. The current SL is all-aluminum. Both new C63s also have carbon fiber driveshafts, optional lightweight performance seats, etc.

All that said, I think real-world, optioned-out W205 C63s will weigh in the 3,750 - 3,800 lb range. With 510 horsepower and 516 lb-ft, that's still a fairly good power-to-weight ratio (and it's still lighter by about 100 lbs, compared to the W204).

None of the cars in this segment are light. Hell, the ATS-V could end up being the lightest. To me, curb weight is important but not as important as how the car deals with the weight it has.

gyrase321

Your personal experience is an anecdote, which is okay. But beyond personal anecdotes, there are actual data collected by independent organizations like Consumer Reports and JD Power who analyze the data and arrive at similar conclusions. A generalization based on an anecdote is silly. A generalization based on millions of data points and statistically validated by independent organizations is not silly.

05RollaXRS

Not true. The E92 M3 weighed 3577 - 3650 lbs on nearly all of the tests. The new M3 is in the same ballpark give or take some pounds. There have been several tests where the M4 weighed 3604 - 3615 lbs and in some tests just under 3600 lbs as was the case with the E92/E90 M3.

Here is one of the earlier tests of the E92 M3 with 6 speed manual. It weighed 3571 lbs

http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...punishment.pdf

Here is another randomly picked test of the E92 M3 and it weighed 3544 lbs

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...son/specs.html

MDCT M4 at 3604 lbs

http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...son/specs.html

All in all E92 and F8X weigh very similarly.