fly2low

Please see my signature. Other than Lexus (Toyota) under Akio Toyoda, Ford is also my favorite manufacture for more affordable cars at the moment.

If you even ask this question, the answer is get a Mustang GT because then you are likely doing 2 laundry lists of the features and stats of the cars. S550 has a much nicer interior than S197 platform but Lexus is just at another level that I treat RCF as a GT car like Jaguar Type F than a sport car like M4.

And yes I test drove S550 Mustangs: ecoboost and GT.

Of course, there is that GT350 coming with a pricing, comparably equipped, will be similar to RCF. But although I love Mustangs and drooling over the thought of GT350, as long as the sun still rises in the east and sets in the west, I personally wouldn't buy a $60k+ Mustang (my wife will veto it).

However, everyone has their own opinion and goal. So, the best decision is yours.
I got the RCF because I want a nice GT car with reliability and relatively cheap maintenance and I want to keep the car for a bit long time.

Another thing that for me is relevant to the topic is, when GT350 comes out, I am hoping S197 Boss 302 owner will rid of their cars, causing a price dip, and I will be ready to swoop one if it is at mid-upper 20s level with low mileage and excellent condition

BAlbright

Nine pages on this topic. Wow! This should not even be a discussion. The Lexus is in a completely different league. I spent 21 years in car sales....the big thing about domestics is the poor reliability and workmanship. All new cars smell pretty and are nice and tight when they're brand new. Take a look at those domestics after they get some miles on them. They FEEL old and the tightness is gone. So too, is the resale value. The dealership I worked for also has a Ford franchise ( I sold Acura and Subaru) so I stopped by to take a look at the new Mustang. I do think it looks pretty good on the exterior, but I think it looks sooo domestic/cheap on the inside.

ToyLexFAM

20 years in a Ford/Lincoln/Mercury/Chrysler/Hyundai dealership (service side), and I completely agree!

fly2low

The 2 cars aren't in the same class. If you want to get a fast RWD V8 then mess with it to make it faster, start with a Mustang. If you want a finesse GT car (nice interior and all) that can still hang on with the sports cars, then RC-F is your answer. My answer is neutral as, de facto, Lexus (Toyota) and Ford are my favorite manufacturers, as voted by my money. I got my RCF because I want a nice GT that is relatively "cheap" compared to Jaguar or Aston Martin, that also will still run 10 years from now with a Japanese car maintenance cost. The RC-F is naturally compared to M4 and RS5 but I think it should be compared to Jaguar F type, Aston Martin Vantage, or any of more a GT car (and compare M4 and RS5 to Corvette, for example). Maybe the sub 100K price prohibits such comparisopn

I am also willing to bet my left ball that the will also be many many more after market support for Mustang GT than for RCF

I have a '65 rodded Mustang (high 11, low 12) clutch car, a '69 Cougar (a cruiser), 2 Lexus GS 350 F Sport (his and her daily drivers), a '14 Fiesta ST with some Mountuned parts (another toy), an '03 Evo I have got since new and was built by Roadrace Engineering (RRE is a big name in Evo community) that will run low 11s. For me personally, my Evo and Mustang are my "go crazy drive nuts" cars. However, I also have this personal philosophy that any street cars go faster that 11s 1/4 miles is not fun. It is too fast and before you know it you are in the "go-to-jail" territory. Plus my Evo shop, RRE's boss told me that the car would be fine at this power level, I could easily add 100 awhp but drivetrain parts will start to break.

So I didn't want an M4 instead I got the RCF as it is more of a GT car IMO (test drove an F-type Jaguar S trim. Love the exterior, hate the interior, depreciation, and Ducati-tuned exhaust which I think is to juvenile for a car this class.

I was planning to get the upcoming Mustang GT350 as a stable mate for my RC-F but my local dealer where I bought my Fiesta ST from flatly rejected my proposition that I will pay msrp and choose all the options that I want. Well, it is up to them if they want to run the business myopically and estranged a potential repeat customer with multiple cars. So the plan is up in the air as it is pointless to go around and ask the same questions to other dealers when the car is not even produced yet.

Which brings me to this side non-Lexus-related topic (Moderators, if I may). The price of S197 '12-'13 will take a hit when the GT350 is out. I am still sweet on it and might just get it. I think there will be a substantial proportion of Boss owner who will sell and upgrade to GT350. If you even want to go more "cheapie" and just want a fast staightline car any '12-'14 Mustang GT with the Coyote engine will have a bargain basement price and you can make it as fast as you want (it all depends on how much money you are willing to spend on the car, right?)

Civic Si-r

7No

iTrader: (1)

I owned a Boss 302 when younger. Recently, I considered purchase of a used '12 or '13 Boss. My research found that there are some known issues with these vehicles and that Ford is sometimes problematical about warranty repairs. Some owners are replacing the shifter, the clutch, finding that the pin striping is coming off, etc. So while the 5.0 GT or the 350 GT look comparable on paper, one may find oneself in the service dept frequently. Also, there may be occasion to have to argue with service depts to get service. This is not something I would look forward to. Yes, you can buy a lot of repairs for a $20K price diff, but it just wouldn't be worth it to me to take the chance that I would be involved in such hassles.

oohpapi44

iTrader: (1)

Before information like this is spread around, I wish people would also take the time to quantify these types of statements with actual facts or links to support them. This situation hasn't happened to you directly but yet it is quoted as fact that 'some' owners are experiencing issues.

- how large of an issue is this? Percentages, links, etc
- if issues are known, then exactly how is Ford not honoring the warranty?
- what does frequent service dept trip mean, how many more than average service visits?
- why would you need to argue to get service at a service dept?

You've already done the research so please share. Your results obvsiously bother you enough to where you won't bother with a test drive.

7No

iTrader: (1)

So, I'm supposed to canvas all the Boss owners to get this quantitative data for you? Obviously (spelled correctly) this was my impression from interacting with some Boss members on the online forums. Used Boss's are still holding value well so everyone doesn't share my reservations. However, it's clear that Lexus doesn't share the same reliability problems.

oohpapi44

iTrader: (1)

If the impressions you found during your 'research' are enough to come online and present them as a basis to completely disparage a vehicle without any current first hand knowledge, then yes. Why wouldn't you?

Especially when you are referencing a pre-owned 12 or 13 Boss. What does that have to do with THIS model?

Diesel350

I can vouch for the Ford quality overall. It's just not there yet. I own one and it's just straight up disappointing that Ford is still cutting corners. If your ok with wasting your time bringing your Ford into the dealership because your mirror fell off then by all means buy one.

7No

iTrader: (1)

MODERATOR EDIT - 7no, exit this thread.

Civic Si-r

Video of them loading up the GT350R...the raspy note this thing makes just screams ...mean

Carbon wheel set on a American production vehicle has never been done, drops 50 LBS of unsprung weight. Carbon brakes, rear seat delete and many more creature comforts removed in order to maintain a full track vehicle. Can hardly wait to see a match up against the C7 Z06 and the GT350R

fly2low

Pages of endless discussions. Let me make it easy for you:

You want an absolute performance: 911 Turbo for more street duty, GT3 for more track duty. Hey, even the RC-F engineers admit that.

You want an absolute performance with the bang for the buck: a high variant (Z06 or ZR1 if they gonna make one Corvette. I am neutral to GM brands though. Sometimes they make great products sometimes they make ****ty products.

You want absolute performance in "reasonable area": M4/3, and maybe M2 let see if they make it right.

You are a Ford die-hard who wants an absolute performance: GT350 for more street duty GT350R for more track duty. Ford seems to create many high performance variants of their cars lately. A good thing for customers: more choices to have.

You want a performance with a "bang for the back" Mustang GT (although it is really hard to find unloaded ones with "mark-up games{ dealer put a markup but succumb to a bit below msrp if you are serious, at least here in LA/OC area) The ones I see more likely in the $47k $48k area which I don't really think is a bang in the buck anymore. That price is when you want to equip your Mustang GT as equipped as the RC-F but, as much as I like it, the quality is not on par.

You want a sporty GT car that can go wild and track-able: Jaguary F-Type R. I did crosshop with Jaguar prior to my purchase. I found that the "R" is a bit too much. I think the "S" variant with 380 HP supercharged V6 is quite nice too although the Ducati-tuned exhaust is tiresome after awhile. The interior is a let down, though, Hyundai-grade plasticky (you know when they try to make something looks shiny and nice but not really use better materials). There is one more thing that bug me. If you search less than years old XK they are can be as low as around $10k. As much as I like the Jag, I think twice before to full the trigger unless you are leasing it just like the other 99.99% Jaguar customers.

You want a balanced GT car, with a nice interior, and a melodious engine, rare enough, and you don't have to have the best performance car out there. but likely you won't a "fifth year problem," that is after the warranty expires on any Euro cars. Get the RC-F (if you can find one, ****** it as they only allocate 2200 for the US market. I can't really profess enough of my love to Mr. Toyoda for making the brand interesting. Thunk of RC-F as a "bargain" GT car because if you are like me, you don't compare it to M4/3, Audi RS5, or AMG C63, but to the GT cars like Jaguar F-type, etc.

Disclaimer: I didn't not include Camaro variants as I really can't stand the dash layout. I also don't trust Chrysler and Fiat, even more that they are now one company. I don't trust Italian reliability either, so now Italian cars listed here.

Bonus: you want to go fast and you are the type who modifies your car and your pocket is deep enough: start with a GT-R. I personally dislike the sterile feel of the car but you can't contest that the car is fast, easy to drive, and can be made faster easily.

fly2low

The world has gone mad. I drove RCF, M4, and Mustang GT back to back to back.

M4 has an amazing torque but the biggest letdown is the artificial steering feel (c'mon bmw, this used to be your forte), the Lexus actually beats BMW on steer feel. The M-DCT transmission startles in traffic, OK for a fast driving, not OK if you drive it in a real world. I put all setting in the sport plus while driving.

RCF has less torque but a very melodious top end. The "regular" auto is very fast, it even blips (rev match) when put on Sport plus. The interior hands down nicer and that M4 has the $4k executive package and leather. Exterior is subjective but RCF makes my blood moves while M4 doesn't. Call me childish but that adjustable rear wing excites me.

Mustang GT, albeit without Performance Package that has a shorter rear end just feels ..... slow after driving those two. I'm sorely disappointed. The saving grace is that the steering feel is NOT worse than M4. I will update this once I drive a PP & recaro GT. Interior is a leap forward compared to the previous model with an aeroplane theme (i am a sucker for aircrafts as you can see from my handle. RCF still has the best interior but the surprise is although BMW has better quality materials, the design is just drab compare to the GT premium.


These are all just personal opinions.


For the record I was an ///M fan until Bangle. I love vintage Fords and have a first gen Mustang and Cougar.

But I dare you to guess which of these 3 cars is in my garage now?

Like I said the world has gone mad.

4TehNguyen

iTrader: (1)

im actually considering the Stang GT now, but nothing anytime soon. Come to realize Im not willing to pay the $80k for RCF that I would like. Been doing a lot of research on the GT. Would be nice to do something different than a 3rd lexus in a row and the mods are cheap and plentiful. If the GT didnt step up the styling and interior quality to what it is now, I wouldnt have considered it. Not to mention a GT Premium + Perf package can be had for 36-37 probably with some negotiating. Going to wait till 2016s come out to see what kind of deals can be had. Chuckling at some of my older posts

Motor Trend Head 2 Head:
Camaro 1LE - 1:22.81
BMW M4 - 1:23.73
Lexus RCF - 1:24.05
Mustang GT Perf - 1:24.32

Keep in mind the GT is using pretty meh tires, not PSS or the 1LE tires.