*sigh* Lexus "quality" well maybe.. Dealer Quality - not so much.
08-10-16, 09:47 PM
#16
Lexus Champion
Thread Starter
RE: Comments about service centers going down hill
Get used to it. Ironic in that those that complain loudest are some of the ones causing the bad service. Dealer per car profit margins are getting decimated and the result is both a reduction is salesperson pay and service staff pay. Almost the ENTIRE service staff walked out of one of the Lexus dealerships close to me when their compensation structure got slashed. Literally, almost everyone quit and service went to **** immediately due to short staff and new less competent replacements. Even the detailer said screw this and left.
Should be no surprise that the replacements having less experience and willing to work for less or the older guys getting paid less now provide less than stellar service.
So big congrats to those like SSmoked getting cars at huge losses and telling others not to stand for less than below cost, but now complaining about poor service or the byproduct of ever decreasing profit margins. Seriously, what do you expect and then you complain about it? What a joke and interesting how you cannot see the forest for the trees.
Get used to it. Ironic in that those that complain loudest are some of the ones causing the bad service. Dealer per car profit margins are getting decimated and the result is both a reduction is salesperson pay and service staff pay. Almost the ENTIRE service staff walked out of one of the Lexus dealerships close to me when their compensation structure got slashed. Literally, almost everyone quit and service went to **** immediately due to short staff and new less competent replacements. Even the detailer said screw this and left.
Should be no surprise that the replacements having less experience and willing to work for less or the older guys getting paid less now provide less than stellar service.
So big congrats to those like SSmoked getting cars at huge losses and telling others not to stand for less than below cost, but now complaining about poor service or the byproduct of ever decreasing profit margins. Seriously, what do you expect and then you complain about it? What a joke and interesting how you cannot see the forest for the trees.
There is so much back cash built into vehicle sales that the dealers are not losing any money. They may not be rolling in it because they aren't screwing over the customer nearly as bad as they used to, but believe me, no dealer is selling cars at a loss, they are banking at 3-4% above cost, I don't care what sob story they give you.
Santa Monica Lexus belongs to the LACARGUY mega-dealership group, they have 9 dealerships in LA, Audi, Porsche, VW, Lexus, Toyota, Scion, BMW, Mini, and Bentley, and soon to be 10 with the new Frisker according to local news. Mike Sullivan the owner has a personal net worth of over $582 million, and he has personally stated that at his dealerships his salepeople net no less than $4,000 per sale, if he isn't netting at least $4,000 he won't close the deal, at the higher end dealerships like his BMW and Lexus it is closer to $6,000 and at his Bentley closer to $20,000.. This was stated by him in local interviews back in May of this year. His 9 dealerships netted over $600 million in sales in 2014.
There is ZERO excuse for the crappy service and abuse to my car, I don't give a flying Wallenda about their low profit margins sob stories, I read the news, I watch the interviews, and I spent a good 20+ years working at various dealerships.
Last edited by mjeds; 08-10-16 at 09:52 PM.
08-10-16, 10:54 PM
#17
Pole Position
X2☺👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
I'm with you. There is NO EXCUSE, ZELCH, NADA, ZERO, WHATSOEVER!!
There are many other persons/groups want to own a Lexus dealership. The slots are limited especially in already established markets .
If the people who owns and runs a particular Lexus dealership thinks that they are not making any money and actually loosing money, then why do they stay in it? They can return the franchise back to Lexus HQ and just hang it up and let the next person or group have a run at it. It's a free country and nobody is forcing them to give bad service. The reason they are still in it is bc there ARE LOTS OF MONEY IN IT. I realize all of this is relative.
Just curious to know if EVER there is a Lexus dealership in the USA who closed shop due to NOT ABLE TO MAKE IT FINANCIALLY OR JUST GO BANKRUPT 😧?
There is NO EXCUSE! !!
How many times have we seen ads on TV recruiting for potential clients by lawyers?
I'm with you. There is NO EXCUSE, ZELCH, NADA, ZERO, WHATSOEVER!!
There are many other persons/groups want to own a Lexus dealership. The slots are limited especially in already established markets .
If the people who owns and runs a particular Lexus dealership thinks that they are not making any money and actually loosing money, then why do they stay in it? They can return the franchise back to Lexus HQ and just hang it up and let the next person or group have a run at it. It's a free country and nobody is forcing them to give bad service. The reason they are still in it is bc there ARE LOTS OF MONEY IN IT. I realize all of this is relative.
Just curious to know if EVER there is a Lexus dealership in the USA who closed shop due to NOT ABLE TO MAKE IT FINANCIALLY OR JUST GO BANKRUPT 😧?
There is NO EXCUSE! !!
How many times have we seen ads on TV recruiting for potential clients by lawyers?
There is so much back cash built into vehicle sales that the dealers are not losing any money. They may not be rolling in it because they aren't screwing over the customer nearly as bad as they used to, but believe me, no dealer is selling cars at a loss, they are banking at 3-4% above cost, I don't care what sob story they give you.
Santa Monica Lexus belongs to the LACARGUY mega-dealership group, they have 9 dealerships in LA, Audi, Porsche, VW, Lexus, Toyota, Scion, BMW, Mini, and Bentley, and soon to be 10 with the new Frisker according to local news. Mike Sullivan the owner has a personal net worth of over $582 million, and he has personally stated that at his dealerships his salepeople net no less than $4,000 per sale, if he isn't netting at least $4,000 he won't close the deal, at the higher end dealerships like his BMW and Lexus it is closer to $6,000 and at his Bentley closer to $20,000.. This was stated by him in local interviews back in May of this year. His 9 dealerships netted over $600 million in sales in 2014.
There is ZERO excuse for the crappy service and abuse to my car, I don't give a flying Wallenda about their low profit margins sob stories, I read the news, I watch the interviews, and I spent a good 20+ years working at various dealerships.
Santa Monica Lexus belongs to the LACARGUY mega-dealership group, they have 9 dealerships in LA, Audi, Porsche, VW, Lexus, Toyota, Scion, BMW, Mini, and Bentley, and soon to be 10 with the new Frisker according to local news. Mike Sullivan the owner has a personal net worth of over $582 million, and he has personally stated that at his dealerships his salepeople net no less than $4,000 per sale, if he isn't netting at least $4,000 he won't close the deal, at the higher end dealerships like his BMW and Lexus it is closer to $6,000 and at his Bentley closer to $20,000.. This was stated by him in local interviews back in May of this year. His 9 dealerships netted over $600 million in sales in 2014.
There is ZERO excuse for the crappy service and abuse to my car, I don't give a flying Wallenda about their low profit margins sob stories, I read the news, I watch the interviews, and I spent a good 20+ years working at various dealerships.
08-11-16, 09:12 AM
#18
lol, someone got a good deal on their RCF so now this tech at another dealer can fraudulently say he installed a cabin air filter when he did not. Yeah that sounds super justified.
08-11-16, 03:03 PM
#21
Lexus Test Driver
I don't know if it is Nationwide, but I do know in this region that it seems most if not all dealerships have restructured sales and service staff pay in the last 1 to 2 years. The pay cuts I am aware of are in the 40% to 40% range.
Basic logic - Dealership profit margins are slashed (good or bad doesn't matter to me) . . . This resulted in sizeable pay cuts/restructuring of compensation for sales and service staff . . . Reduction of 30% to 40% of someone's compensation results in apathy or the better, smarter guys leave and find something else to do . . .
What do you expect service to be like when all the best, smarter and more diligent employees book it?
Candidly, I could care less if a dealership makes money or loses money and I have friends, acquaintances and clients that own various dealerships and I have had service techs that left the industry (and some that left Lexus) due to recent pay cuts that were pretty extreme.
08-11-16, 03:18 PM
#22
Lexus Test Driver
You guys obviously don't know people in the industry.
I am all for getting good deals and as I said in the post right above this one, I could care less if dealers makes mint or crash and burn as a whole.
I just found it humorous that you bellyaching about bad service when the reason for bad service is the reduction in resources allocated to service staff caused by the decrease in profit margins.
Look, if you want great service . . . buy a Porsche or a Ferrari. I still get marvelous service at both places and I hear Bentley, Maseratti and etc. are super great butt smoochers also.
The reason, price control with those brands partly dictated by production numbers and limited allocation to most of the smaller to mid size dealerships.
Lol, try to purchase a new Ferrari at costs . . . while you are at it, try and purchase a new never owned Ferrari period or even a 488 at MSRP . . . Now compare the level of service and see if their is a correlation between what service staff is paid and the level of service provided.
I am all for getting good deals and as I said in the post right above this one, I could care less if dealers makes mint or crash and burn as a whole.
I just found it humorous that you bellyaching about bad service when the reason for bad service is the reduction in resources allocated to service staff caused by the decrease in profit margins.
Look, if you want great service . . . buy a Porsche or a Ferrari. I still get marvelous service at both places and I hear Bentley, Maseratti and etc. are super great butt smoochers also.
The reason, price control with those brands partly dictated by production numbers and limited allocation to most of the smaller to mid size dealerships.
Lol, try to purchase a new Ferrari at costs . . . while you are at it, try and purchase a new never owned Ferrari period or even a 488 at MSRP . . . Now compare the level of service and see if their is a correlation between what service staff is paid and the level of service provided.
08-11-16, 03:46 PM
#23
Lexus Champion
You guys obviously don't know people in the industry.
I am all for getting good deals and as I said in the post right above this one, I could care less if dealers makes mint or crash and burn as a whole.
I just found it humorous that you bellyaching about bad service when the reason for bad service is the reduction in resources allocated to service staff caused by the decrease in profit margins.
Look, if you want great service . . . buy a Porsche or a Ferrari. I still get marvelous service at both places and I hear Bentley, Maseratti and etc. are super great butt smoochers also.
The reason, price control with those brands partly dictated by production numbers and limited allocation to most of the smaller to mid size dealerships.
Lol, try to purchase a new Ferrari at costs . . . while you are at it, try and purchase a new never owned Ferrari period or even a 488 at MSRP . . . Now compare the level of service and see if their is a correlation between what service staff is paid and the level of service provided.
I am all for getting good deals and as I said in the post right above this one, I could care less if dealers makes mint or crash and burn as a whole.
I just found it humorous that you bellyaching about bad service when the reason for bad service is the reduction in resources allocated to service staff caused by the decrease in profit margins.
Look, if you want great service . . . buy a Porsche or a Ferrari. I still get marvelous service at both places and I hear Bentley, Maseratti and etc. are super great butt smoochers also.
The reason, price control with those brands partly dictated by production numbers and limited allocation to most of the smaller to mid size dealerships.
Lol, try to purchase a new Ferrari at costs . . . while you are at it, try and purchase a new never owned Ferrari period or even a 488 at MSRP . . . Now compare the level of service and see if their is a correlation between what service staff is paid and the level of service provided.
http://gothamist.com/2014/06/24/deal...es_rare_fe.php
http://jalopnik.com/5833174/mechanic...00-ferrari-f40
Example of poorly paid Lamborghini techs
http://jalopnik.com/5701493/owner-of...still-fighting
Bmw obviously employs cheap young labor too
http://jalopnik.com/5628903/bmw-deal...ner-out-of-27k
It doesn't matter what brand or how much you paid for the car, there are going to be careless bad techs. Ultimately its the dealers fault for not educating and quality controlling them
Last edited by ssmoked; 08-11-16 at 03:55 PM.
08-11-16, 04:37 PM
#24
Lexus Test Driver
These Ferrari dealer's pay structure must be super poor too huh?
http://gothamist.com/2014/06/24/deal...es_rare_fe.php
http://jalopnik.com/5833174/mechanic...00-ferrari-f40
Example of poorly paid Lamborghini techs
http://jalopnik.com/5701493/owner-of...still-fighting
Bmw obviously employs cheap young labor too
http://jalopnik.com/5628903/bmw-deal...ner-out-of-27k
It doesn't matter what brand or how much you paid for the car, there are going to be careless bad techs. Ultimately its the dealers fault for not educating and quality controlling them
http://gothamist.com/2014/06/24/deal...es_rare_fe.php
http://jalopnik.com/5833174/mechanic...00-ferrari-f40
Example of poorly paid Lamborghini techs
http://jalopnik.com/5701493/owner-of...still-fighting
Bmw obviously employs cheap young labor too
http://jalopnik.com/5628903/bmw-deal...ner-out-of-27k
It doesn't matter what brand or how much you paid for the car, there are going to be careless bad techs. Ultimately its the dealers fault for not educating and quality controlling them
Look, there are going to be good and bad experiences and unhappy people no matter where you go or what the dealership does in some instances.
lol, those are wrecks and have very little to do with service people receive day in and day out.
One can obviously scour the Internet to find a complaint about anything Ferrari and Lambo owners can be a bunch of prima donnas or very demanding.
Without a doubt, I have always been very happy with service I have gotten at Ferrari, Lambo or Porsche.
. . . Then again some people will find something to whine about no matter what and perhaps I just am not one of those individuals . . . Talk about high bottom problems, I am greatful to have awesome cars to take to get serviced!
Last edited by DougHII; 08-11-16 at 04:42 PM.
08-11-16, 04:57 PM
#25
Lexus Test Driver
Dude though, think about. What an occupational hazard.
You are a young 20 something assistant service tech making $80k a year and you get the keys to an Enzo . . . and you are told to take it around the block. What do you do? You make chicken feed and cannot afford the brakes on the car with 6 months take home and may never get another chance. What do you do?
I don't know about an Enzo, but I can tell you without a doubt that an F40 or a CGT will bite you in a blink of an eye with what should seem to be a modest throttle input. Not surprising at all and these non-granny saver high performance cars can get the best of them if you are not paying attention.
You are a young 20 something assistant service tech making $80k a year and you get the keys to an Enzo . . . and you are told to take it around the block. What do you do? You make chicken feed and cannot afford the brakes on the car with 6 months take home and may never get another chance. What do you do?
I don't know about an Enzo, but I can tell you without a doubt that an F40 or a CGT will bite you in a blink of an eye with what should seem to be a modest throttle input. Not surprising at all and these non-granny saver high performance cars can get the best of them if you are not paying attention.
08-11-16, 05:05 PM
#26
I've had several friends in retail selling, every product the one fellow had was marked up above what he paid for it 100%. That means when he bought a product for say $500. his selling price was $1000. and the funny thing is he was the lowest cost out fit in the whole state. So don't tell me a car dealer of any sort is not making the big bucks. No way could they afford the $3,000,000. new building and land and maybe its even more than that, the land alone could hit that 3 mil easy, so the dealer ship could be more in the 6 mil range for building and land, very very fancy building just for the Toyota dealer in the area here. Its very likely a huge secret what the real cost to the dealership is for new cars, I would make a wild guess that a 50K car makes more than 15K profit to the dealer. The build cost for the factory is very likely in the 10K region, unless some goofy taxes bump it up and other overhead like pensions, hundreds of square feet of office space and such. Once tooling is set its all easy. To stamp a sheet metal part it takes seconds, buying materials in bulk cuts costs tremendously. Machining parts is dirt cheap these days.
08-11-16, 05:27 PM
#27
Lexus Test Driver
I've had several friends in retail selling, every product the one fellow had was marked up above what he paid for it 100%. That means when he bought a product for say $500. his selling price was $1000. and the funny thing is he was the lowest cost out fit in the whole state. So don't tell me a car dealer of any sort is not making the big bucks. No way could they afford the $3,000,000. new building and land and maybe its even more than that, the land alone could hit that 3 mil easy, so the dealer ship could be more in the 6 mil range for building and land, very very fancy building just for the Toyota dealer in the area here. Its very likely a huge secret what the real cost to the dealership is for new cars, I would make a wild guess that a 50K car makes more than 15K profit to the dealer. The build cost for the factory is very likely in the 10K region, unless some goofy taxes bump it up and other overhead like pensions, hundreds of square feet of office space and such. Once tooling is set its all easy. To stamp a sheet metal part it takes seconds, buying materials in bulk cuts costs tremendously. Machining parts is dirt cheap these days.
specialty cars and low production cars may hold $10k front end gross or more, but we are talking high end, low production, high demand like S Coupe, GLS, some higher end AMG, Porsche C4S, Targa, Turbo, GT3, GT2 and etc.
there is surprisingly small profit margins these days on cars, even used cars.
08-11-16, 10:51 PM
#28
Pole Position
I can still imagine the "tech" who chages the oil on your Porches is the lowest paid person in that dealership with the least experience!
There is a Porches dealership next to the dealership I am familiar with where I used to take my MB in for service at the attached MB dealership in the "Deep South". I think it is all owned by the same people. Anyway, I found out that there is really only ONE CERTIFIED PORCHE tech!! And he is not there everyday! ! So what happens when he is not there at the PORCHE service? I guess other techs get to monkey around with Porches?
IDK, when I took my MB in there to the MB dealership, I've always gotten good service. No complaints, except for the high prices. I know it is all relative. Certainly when compared to Ferrari or Bentley or Bugatti, the MB prices might be a bargain.
All I'm saying is there is no excuse for poor service or incompetent service.
Apply the same logic to the medical service world will be a disaster! ! So some hospital administrators/people in our political system think they can save lots of money by using Nurse Practioners (NP) or Physician Assistants (PA) in rural small emergency room departments EXCLUSIVLY AND TO REPLACE REAL EMERGENCY MED ICAL DOCTORS. YES, I think NP's AND PA's have a place in the medical delivery system, but not in this case.
It is all good until a REAL COMPLICATED AND BAD TRAUMA PATIENT SHOWS UP WITH LIKE A GUN SHOT WOUND OR STAB WOUND TO THE CHEST/ABDOMIN OR A REAL HEART ATTACK OR STROKE PATIENT. Only a few NP's or PA's would be able to handle the above. So if that patient happened to be you (or someone you care about) driving cross country and got into a car accident or just got sick for whatever reason in the middle of nowhere in a rural town America, you are SOL!
So buget cuts leads to the above. And the smartest and brightest in medical schools are not going into the low payING specialty anymore simply unable to pay the student loans in a timely manner. So it is common place now in middle rural America ER with NO REAL DOCTOR PRESENT. Yes, sometimes the doctor is available via telemedicine. But any time anyone trying to intubate or put in a chest tube to save a patient on emergency basis via telemedicine will be disastrous. So until enough of bad things happening and enough people complaining, things are not going to get better.
No excuse for poor service.
There is a Porches dealership next to the dealership I am familiar with where I used to take my MB in for service at the attached MB dealership in the "Deep South". I think it is all owned by the same people. Anyway, I found out that there is really only ONE CERTIFIED PORCHE tech!! And he is not there everyday! ! So what happens when he is not there at the PORCHE service? I guess other techs get to monkey around with Porches?
IDK, when I took my MB in there to the MB dealership, I've always gotten good service. No complaints, except for the high prices. I know it is all relative. Certainly when compared to Ferrari or Bentley or Bugatti, the MB prices might be a bargain.
All I'm saying is there is no excuse for poor service or incompetent service.
Apply the same logic to the medical service world will be a disaster! ! So some hospital administrators/people in our political system think they can save lots of money by using Nurse Practioners (NP) or Physician Assistants (PA) in rural small emergency room departments EXCLUSIVLY AND TO REPLACE REAL EMERGENCY MED ICAL DOCTORS. YES, I think NP's AND PA's have a place in the medical delivery system, but not in this case.
It is all good until a REAL COMPLICATED AND BAD TRAUMA PATIENT SHOWS UP WITH LIKE A GUN SHOT WOUND OR STAB WOUND TO THE CHEST/ABDOMIN OR A REAL HEART ATTACK OR STROKE PATIENT. Only a few NP's or PA's would be able to handle the above. So if that patient happened to be you (or someone you care about) driving cross country and got into a car accident or just got sick for whatever reason in the middle of nowhere in a rural town America, you are SOL!
So buget cuts leads to the above. And the smartest and brightest in medical schools are not going into the low payING specialty anymore simply unable to pay the student loans in a timely manner. So it is common place now in middle rural America ER with NO REAL DOCTOR PRESENT. Yes, sometimes the doctor is available via telemedicine. But any time anyone trying to intubate or put in a chest tube to save a patient on emergency basis via telemedicine will be disastrous. So until enough of bad things happening and enough people complaining, things are not going to get better.
No excuse for poor service.
These Ferrari dealer's pay structure must be super poor too huh?
http://gothamist.com/2014/06/24/deal...es_rare_fe.php
http://jalopnik.com/5833174/mechanic...00-ferrari-f40
Example of poorly paid Lamborghini techs
http://jalopnik.com/5701493/owner-of...still-fighting
Bmw obviously employs cheap young labor too
http://jalopnik.com/5628903/bmw-deal...ner-out-of-27k
It doesn't matter what brand or how much you paid for the car, there are going to be careless bad techs. Ultimately its the dealers fault for not educating and quality controlling them
http://gothamist.com/2014/06/24/deal...es_rare_fe.php
http://jalopnik.com/5833174/mechanic...00-ferrari-f40
Example of poorly paid Lamborghini techs
http://jalopnik.com/5701493/owner-of...still-fighting
Bmw obviously employs cheap young labor too
http://jalopnik.com/5628903/bmw-deal...ner-out-of-27k
It doesn't matter what brand or how much you paid for the car, there are going to be careless bad techs. Ultimately its the dealers fault for not educating and quality controlling them
Last edited by lexusrus; 08-12-16 at 12:23 AM.
08-11-16, 11:02 PM
#29
Pole Position
One of my friends has a Toyota Tundra and another with a FJ . The local Toyo dealer tried yo balance his tires/rims, but was unable to. Both had factory upgraded rims. Toyota dealership told them the dealership did not have the proper equipment to do it correctly. The nearest Toyota dealership able to do it was like 4 to 5 hours away!!!
08-12-16, 12:21 AM
#30
Pole Position
I disagree. Especially on the USED car. There are way more money in the USED car business! !!
I'm thinking I'm in the wrong line of work! !! I need to be in the car business! !!😊😀☺😁😂😀
I'm thinking I'm in the wrong line of work! !! I need to be in the car business! !!😊😀☺😁😂😀
$15k profit on a $50k car???? Not even close. I have seen front end gross numbers for various mid line and maybe 10% of that for a $50k car, but much less many times. Back end can be a profit center, but you are way, way, way off base for a $50k car.
specialty cars and low production cars may hold $10k front end gross or more, but we are talking high end, low production, high demand like S Coupe, GLS, some higher end AMG, Porsche C4S, Targa, Turbo, GT3, GT2 and etc.
there is surprisingly small profit margins these days on cars, even used cars.
specialty cars and low production cars may hold $10k front end gross or more, but we are talking high end, low production, high demand like S Coupe, GLS, some higher end AMG, Porsche C4S, Targa, Turbo, GT3, GT2 and etc.
there is surprisingly small profit margins these days on cars, even used cars.