The SC swap Consultation FAQ
01-19-11, 06:54 AM
#1
The SC swap Consultation FAQ
Since we all have different goals with each individual car, I decided to make a realistic FAQ on what JZ engine can do what, and who each JZ engine is for. Realistically.
I think we can (most of us) agree that the Toyota rocks. Bullet-proof is a widely used term.
Some of the enthusiasts can agree that the M-series inline 6 is the best, but these are not MKII-III Supras. You won't find me in the M-club either.
What this is, is a guide on how to enjoy your SC300/400 with a JZ engine.
OVERVIEW:
The sc300 is a great car. We (if you are reading this) all agree.
Referred to as the "Poor man's Supra" in the US, the jzz30 Soarer/Sc300 is a great start for any project.
Cruising, Drifting, Drag, Auto-Cross, Highway Destroying, it does it all.
But what category do most of us fall in, when we first attain our Sc?
We are gunna start with the street-car. Full interior, ECU's for everything, radio. This is the type of SC *most of us have.
Daily Driven STREETCAR:
2JZGE
The Sc300 Comes with a 2jzge, but you know that.
This engine is a JZ so there is no doubt in stock, untouched form, the GE short block assembly can withstand 4 times the base output, and run 9 second 1/4 miles. It's been proven.
The 2JZGE engine is equipped with:
Type: 24v, 3.0L, belt-driven DOHC four-valve, iron block, aluminum head
Displacement: 2,997cc (183 cid)
Bore x stroke: 86.0 x 86.0mm (3.39 x 3.39 in.)
Horsepower : 215 hp @ 5,8000 rpm
Torque : 218 ft.-lbs. @ 3,800 rpm
C/R : 10.5:1
Emission : EVAP
Fuel system : SFI, return-less
Fuel pressure: 44-50 psi @ idle
Fuel injectors: 330cc
Oil pressure: 47 psi minimum @ 3,000 rpm
Plug gap : 0.043 in. (1.1 mm)
Firing order :. 1-5-3-6-2-4
ignition timing: 6[degrees] @ idle.
-10.0:1 Static compression mean low boost or head gasket (This is a crossroads*, need to invest more money if you go any further).
-Cap and distributor ignition gets in the way of some compressors.
-Long Intake manifold runners for N/A torque (Least aesthetically pleasing of the three).
Some 2jzge's can make 220 ish to the wheels with I/H/E. This is fine for some people.
PROS
-Stock Toyota reliability.
-Easy to maintain (But, changing spark plugs is a chore with N/A manifold).
-Sound Great!
CONS
-If you abuse it, it can fail.
-Requires a good amount of effort to Turbocharge. It's not "Simple", but not "impossible" either.
-It looks hideous with it's N/A intake manifold.
-People forget that a w58, and A340 are weak, and will only hold moderate amounts of power.
There is an exception to every case, but most of us need the car to drive to work every day. Keep this in mind.
1JZGTE
The 1jz came in a bunch of JDM Toyota cars. Coupes, sedans, big body VIP saloons. It's the over square, little brother of the notorious 2JZGTE.
Toyota started the JZ family after Nissan's success in racing the RB series engine in the early 90's.
It's a JZ engine, so you know it's tough. It has an over-square design, which means it's rotating assembly right out of the box, can withstand RPMs in the 8-9k range.
It has .5 liter less displacement then it's bigger brother. That doesn't make it any less potent.
700hp with just a set of cams, and a single conversion is almost too easy to obtain.
The 1jz engine is equipped with:
Displacement : 2491cc
Valvetrain : Belt driven DOHC, 4 valves per cylinder
Fuel System : TCCS EFI, Premium Unleaded
Ignition System : Direct fire ignition
C/R : 8.5:1
Bore x Stroke : 86 x 71.5
Peak Power : 280PS @ 6200rpm
Peak Torque : 268 lb ft @ 4800rpm
Turbos : CT12A (2x)
Compressor wheel: 37/54mm
Turbine wheel : 52/42mm
Boost : (8.5 - 9.8psi)
Fuel Injectors : 380cc/min high impedance
Camshaft spec : 224 (in) 228 (ex)
Valve clearance : 0.15-0.25mm (in) 0.25-0.35mm (ex)
Spark plug : ND PK20TR11 / NGK BRK6EKPB11
Plug gap : 1.1mm (limit 1.3mm)
Base Ignition timing : 8-12 BTDC (jumper TE1,E1)
Idle rpm : 600-700
-8.5:1 Static compression, and a factory metal head gasket makes this engine eat boost for fun.
-Coil on plug ignition (Early 1jz's have brittle clips on harness that break).
-Forward facing intake manifold (Good top-end flow, looks great, easy to change spark plugs).
-Easy to make horsepower with simple bolt on's. Opening this engine is not usually required.
PROS
-2nd gen 1JZGTE's can be had for $1250 shipped engine / Trans/ Ecu/ Harness.
-Most 1JZGTE's have less then 50k KM, due to strict Japanese emissions.
-Over-square design make for a high revving engine out of the box.
-Soarer 1jz's snap right in only lengthening the harness.
-NOT an interference engine! Unless cam lift exceeds 9.5mm
CONS
-For some radical applications, the 1jz isn't enough. Fortification then takes place. More money spent.
-Some 1JZGTE's are either old 1st gens that need re-sealing, or a chaser version that takes away the plug and play aspect.
-1st gen 1Jz's have been known to get rod knock occasionally. Rebuilds then become necessary.
-Ceramic turbos like to blow with increased back pressure. The o2 housing for the turbos is the worst design ever.
It is solely responsible for crapping ceramic turbine wheels out the exhaust, so hi-flow Y-pipe/downpipes are a must to keep them alive.
-Completely stock turbo'ed they will make around 300-330ish to the wheels. Fine for some, not so much for others with bigger then street car aspirations.
2JZGE w/ Turbocharger (NA-T to the purists)
You know the specs!
PROS
-Removal of the engine is not necessary.
-Can make a little more horsepower to start with, compared to the 1JZ due to large single turbos to start with (350-400).
-Kits are cheap enough around $1500 DIY, with lots of different Turbos to start with.
-3 liters of displacement works great for heavy cars like the SC/GS/LS.
CONS
-Anything more than 330ish horsepower, will require opening the engine to do HG. At that point "might as well while I'm in here" takes over, and more money is spent.
-The horrible looking Cross-over manifold makes it a pain in the *** to change spark plugs easily. Re-using the TB gasket makes for potential boost leaks.
-IC plumbing is more complex.
-Distributor gets in the way of some compressor housings.
-MAF tuning is a nightmare compared to the MAP system the JDM JZ's have.
-The Australians make fun of us who aren't fortunate enough to start with a GTE.
2JZGTE (No $Hy!Te!)
-SPECS-
Induction :Sequential Fuel Injection, Twin CT-20 steel-wheeled Turbochargers (Sequential), Intercooled
Bore x Stroke :86mm x 86mm
Capacity (cc) :2997cc
C/R :8.5:1
Maximum Power 280hp @ 5600rpm
Maximum Torque 320ft/lbs @ 3600rpm
Redline 6800rpm
PROS
-This engine time and time again, has produced 1000+hp on completely stock internals. (1000hp isn't typical street car territory).
-3 liters of displacement pushes heavy cars along quite well.
-Can be equipped with a v160 Getrag transmission, that will also handle 1000+hp with a good clutch.
-Will decimate all with about 15 grand, and if needed, overnight parts from Japan.
CONS
-Insanely expensive compared to 1JZ, and NA-T. Even if you don't get the V160.
-US 2JZ's have a MAF. This is a restriction, and standalone type engine management is usually employed at high cost.
-Extra torque makes it a handful to drive in lighter cars. Easy to make a bunch of power. It's not hard with a 2j!
-This type of power almost makes it mandatory to upgrade brakes, tires, suspension, etc. This means more loot.
Street car Graph
(You got one!)
[=====2jzge=====]
(Cheap, lag-free)
[=======1jz=======]--More money-->
(T4 has great top end, loud W/G)
[=======NA-T==========]--More money-->
(Expensive, most potential)
[=======2JZGTE===========]--More money-->
0HP_____________________________500HP________________1000hp
Hopefully, this will help the common SC enthusiast make a decision on how to build a comfortable, Daily Driven, Boosted SC!
I think we can (most of us) agree that the Toyota rocks. Bullet-proof is a widely used term.
Some of the enthusiasts can agree that the M-series inline 6 is the best, but these are not MKII-III Supras. You won't find me in the M-club either.
What this is, is a guide on how to enjoy your SC300/400 with a JZ engine.
OVERVIEW:
The sc300 is a great car. We (if you are reading this) all agree.
Referred to as the "Poor man's Supra" in the US, the jzz30 Soarer/Sc300 is a great start for any project.
Cruising, Drifting, Drag, Auto-Cross, Highway Destroying, it does it all.
But what category do most of us fall in, when we first attain our Sc?
We are gunna start with the street-car. Full interior, ECU's for everything, radio. This is the type of SC *most of us have.
Daily Driven STREETCAR:
2JZGE
The Sc300 Comes with a 2jzge, but you know that.
This engine is a JZ so there is no doubt in stock, untouched form, the GE short block assembly can withstand 4 times the base output, and run 9 second 1/4 miles. It's been proven.
The 2JZGE engine is equipped with:
Type: 24v, 3.0L, belt-driven DOHC four-valve, iron block, aluminum head
Displacement: 2,997cc (183 cid)
Bore x stroke: 86.0 x 86.0mm (3.39 x 3.39 in.)
Horsepower : 215 hp @ 5,8000 rpm
Torque : 218 ft.-lbs. @ 3,800 rpm
C/R : 10.5:1
Emission : EVAP
Fuel system : SFI, return-less
Fuel pressure: 44-50 psi @ idle
Fuel injectors: 330cc
Oil pressure: 47 psi minimum @ 3,000 rpm
Plug gap : 0.043 in. (1.1 mm)
Firing order :. 1-5-3-6-2-4
ignition timing: 6[degrees] @ idle.
-10.0:1 Static compression mean low boost or head gasket (This is a crossroads*, need to invest more money if you go any further).
-Cap and distributor ignition gets in the way of some compressors.
-Long Intake manifold runners for N/A torque (Least aesthetically pleasing of the three).
Some 2jzge's can make 220 ish to the wheels with I/H/E. This is fine for some people.
PROS
-Stock Toyota reliability.
-Easy to maintain (But, changing spark plugs is a chore with N/A manifold).
-Sound Great!
CONS
-If you abuse it, it can fail.
-Requires a good amount of effort to Turbocharge. It's not "Simple", but not "impossible" either.
-It looks hideous with it's N/A intake manifold.
-People forget that a w58, and A340 are weak, and will only hold moderate amounts of power.
There is an exception to every case, but most of us need the car to drive to work every day. Keep this in mind.
1JZGTE
The 1jz came in a bunch of JDM Toyota cars. Coupes, sedans, big body VIP saloons. It's the over square, little brother of the notorious 2JZGTE.
Toyota started the JZ family after Nissan's success in racing the RB series engine in the early 90's.
It's a JZ engine, so you know it's tough. It has an over-square design, which means it's rotating assembly right out of the box, can withstand RPMs in the 8-9k range.
It has .5 liter less displacement then it's bigger brother. That doesn't make it any less potent.
700hp with just a set of cams, and a single conversion is almost too easy to obtain.
The 1jz engine is equipped with:
Displacement : 2491cc
Valvetrain : Belt driven DOHC, 4 valves per cylinder
Fuel System : TCCS EFI, Premium Unleaded
Ignition System : Direct fire ignition
C/R : 8.5:1
Bore x Stroke : 86 x 71.5
Peak Power : 280PS @ 6200rpm
Peak Torque : 268 lb ft @ 4800rpm
Turbos : CT12A (2x)
Compressor wheel: 37/54mm
Turbine wheel : 52/42mm
Boost : (8.5 - 9.8psi)
Fuel Injectors : 380cc/min high impedance
Camshaft spec : 224 (in) 228 (ex)
Valve clearance : 0.15-0.25mm (in) 0.25-0.35mm (ex)
Spark plug : ND PK20TR11 / NGK BRK6EKPB11
Plug gap : 1.1mm (limit 1.3mm)
Base Ignition timing : 8-12 BTDC (jumper TE1,E1)
Idle rpm : 600-700
-8.5:1 Static compression, and a factory metal head gasket makes this engine eat boost for fun.
-Coil on plug ignition (Early 1jz's have brittle clips on harness that break).
-Forward facing intake manifold (Good top-end flow, looks great, easy to change spark plugs).
-Easy to make horsepower with simple bolt on's. Opening this engine is not usually required.
PROS
-2nd gen 1JZGTE's can be had for $1250 shipped engine / Trans/ Ecu/ Harness.
-Most 1JZGTE's have less then 50k KM, due to strict Japanese emissions.
-Over-square design make for a high revving engine out of the box.
-Soarer 1jz's snap right in only lengthening the harness.
-NOT an interference engine! Unless cam lift exceeds 9.5mm
CONS
-For some radical applications, the 1jz isn't enough. Fortification then takes place. More money spent.
-Some 1JZGTE's are either old 1st gens that need re-sealing, or a chaser version that takes away the plug and play aspect.
-1st gen 1Jz's have been known to get rod knock occasionally. Rebuilds then become necessary.
-Ceramic turbos like to blow with increased back pressure. The o2 housing for the turbos is the worst design ever.
It is solely responsible for crapping ceramic turbine wheels out the exhaust, so hi-flow Y-pipe/downpipes are a must to keep them alive.
-Completely stock turbo'ed they will make around 300-330ish to the wheels. Fine for some, not so much for others with bigger then street car aspirations.
2JZGE w/ Turbocharger (NA-T to the purists)
You know the specs!
PROS
-Removal of the engine is not necessary.
-Can make a little more horsepower to start with, compared to the 1JZ due to large single turbos to start with (350-400).
-Kits are cheap enough around $1500 DIY, with lots of different Turbos to start with.
-3 liters of displacement works great for heavy cars like the SC/GS/LS.
CONS
-Anything more than 330ish horsepower, will require opening the engine to do HG. At that point "might as well while I'm in here" takes over, and more money is spent.
-The horrible looking Cross-over manifold makes it a pain in the *** to change spark plugs easily. Re-using the TB gasket makes for potential boost leaks.
-IC plumbing is more complex.
-Distributor gets in the way of some compressor housings.
-MAF tuning is a nightmare compared to the MAP system the JDM JZ's have.
-The Australians make fun of us who aren't fortunate enough to start with a GTE.
2JZGTE (No $Hy!Te!)
-SPECS-
Induction :Sequential Fuel Injection, Twin CT-20 steel-wheeled Turbochargers (Sequential), Intercooled
Bore x Stroke :86mm x 86mm
Capacity (cc) :2997cc
C/R :8.5:1
Maximum Power 280hp @ 5600rpm
Maximum Torque 320ft/lbs @ 3600rpm
Redline 6800rpm
PROS
-This engine time and time again, has produced 1000+hp on completely stock internals. (1000hp isn't typical street car territory).
-3 liters of displacement pushes heavy cars along quite well.
-Can be equipped with a v160 Getrag transmission, that will also handle 1000+hp with a good clutch.
-Will decimate all with about 15 grand, and if needed, overnight parts from Japan.
CONS
-Insanely expensive compared to 1JZ, and NA-T. Even if you don't get the V160.
-US 2JZ's have a MAF. This is a restriction, and standalone type engine management is usually employed at high cost.
-Extra torque makes it a handful to drive in lighter cars. Easy to make a bunch of power. It's not hard with a 2j!
-This type of power almost makes it mandatory to upgrade brakes, tires, suspension, etc. This means more loot.
Street car Graph
(You got one!)
[=====2jzge=====]
(Cheap, lag-free)
[=======1jz=======]--More money-->
(T4 has great top end, loud W/G)
[=======NA-T==========]--More money-->
(Expensive, most potential)
[=======2JZGTE===========]--More money-->
0HP_____________________________500HP________________1000hp
Hopefully, this will help the common SC enthusiast make a decision on how to build a comfortable, Daily Driven, Boosted SC!
Last edited by spoolxexo; 02-13-11 at 06:50 AM.
kool
02-25-11, 12:58 PM
#10
Yea, change the thread title to "SC JZ thread" because it includes the 2jz-ge which is not a swap, but doesn't even include the larger displacement all aluminum alloy V8 which is better. Also, I would like to see a 2jz making 220whp with I/H/E! Is this supposed to be an FAQ or FAB (frequently answered bull****)
02-25-11, 01:40 PM
#12
Ok.
While spoolxexo may be trying to help the information is this thread is misleading and counter-productive. A simple point. Put 700HP on any engine and you will be happy to have it last even 50,000 miles without a rebuild. Does spoolxexo mention the 1000-3000 mile spark plug & oil changes you will have to do? The difference in power-band and spool time between the 1JZ or 2JZ? I am trying to be respectful but that is very difficult in a thread with a lot of much bad information.
That research went into turning a raspy unbalanced V8 into a smooth quiet luxury automobile not a high performance race car.
While spoolxexo may be trying to help the information is this thread is misleading and counter-productive. A simple point. Put 700HP on any engine and you will be happy to have it last even 50,000 miles without a rebuild. Does spoolxexo mention the 1000-3000 mile spark plug & oil changes you will have to do? The difference in power-band and spool time between the 1JZ or 2JZ? I am trying to be respectful but that is very difficult in a thread with a lot of much bad information.
That research went into turning a raspy unbalanced V8 into a smooth quiet luxury automobile not a high performance race car.
02-25-11, 02:49 PM
#13
And the 2JZ-GTE is? That must be why Toyota used it in their GT500 MKIV right?...Or did they use a 3s-gte and then a 3uz-fe? I guess neither was designed to be a race engine for a high performance car. I can see why a long iron block engine would probably be a bad idea. In fact, the GTE was originally in the Aristo which obviously is a race car. I don't see how an over-square all aluminum V8 with 6 bolt mains has any less of a race design though. Maybe the VP of TRD was lying when he said that the 1uz was based off of a race design originally and that it was planned to be used in GT500 race cars. I guess we will never know so we will just go with what you say about unbalanced V8's and smooth race iron 6's.
02-25-11, 06:27 PM
#15
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3y7qbSCB44