The Great 1JZ vs 2JZGTE vs NA-T Debate Thread
01-21-11, 05:38 AM
#61
Going back to the original question-
You need to sit down and figure out what your goals are.
Is it a racecar, daily driver, weekend highway car, show car?
How much HP are you shooting for and how much tuning are you willing to do yourself or pay to have done. Better make sure that tuning shop has insurance in case something goes awry..
What chassis is your swap going into?
Who's doing the wiring? I've seen the all kinds of screwy that can occur when someone does wiring themselves
Can you find a clean GTE? I honestly don't think I'd buy a swap unless I could inspect it in person. Jhot had 3 1JZ Soarers and the cleanest one(mine) had undocumented mileage, now would you buy an undocumented mileage motor over the internet?
The truly clean low mile motors are now GTE VVTI- The problem is that most of the real info on the in's and out's of these motors comes from Australia and the UK forums. There's quite a few interesting differences in the VVTI motors.
Example-
Aristo 2JZGTE VVTI uses a MAF sensor(not map) most of the swaps DO NOT come with the MAF(the amount of people in the states that can give you solid info on the VVTI swaps is minimal at best). Also, it has been confirmed to have steel wheels. It also can have the dreaded immobilizer option built into the ECU and if they send you that ECU, your screwed royally. If you know what to look for ahead of time and confirm witht he importer, you don't have to worry about it, but it takes research. You can get past both the MAF and Immobilzer ECU, also the Drive by Wire isn't a problem if you have Dr Tweak do the wiring.
1JZ VVTI? There isn't an inexpensive single turbo manifold available, YET..and imagine if that stock turbo needs a rebuild....Ive never even seen a used one for sale by itself....so turbo rebuild time $$
Goes on and on, but in the end, it's all about research and doing what you want with your money. It's not like you can't rip out the motor, sell it and do something else.
You need to sit down and figure out what your goals are.
Is it a racecar, daily driver, weekend highway car, show car?
How much HP are you shooting for and how much tuning are you willing to do yourself or pay to have done. Better make sure that tuning shop has insurance in case something goes awry..
What chassis is your swap going into?
Who's doing the wiring? I've seen the all kinds of screwy that can occur when someone does wiring themselves
Can you find a clean GTE? I honestly don't think I'd buy a swap unless I could inspect it in person. Jhot had 3 1JZ Soarers and the cleanest one(mine) had undocumented mileage, now would you buy an undocumented mileage motor over the internet?
The truly clean low mile motors are now GTE VVTI- The problem is that most of the real info on the in's and out's of these motors comes from Australia and the UK forums. There's quite a few interesting differences in the VVTI motors.
Example-
Aristo 2JZGTE VVTI uses a MAF sensor(not map) most of the swaps DO NOT come with the MAF(the amount of people in the states that can give you solid info on the VVTI swaps is minimal at best). Also, it has been confirmed to have steel wheels. It also can have the dreaded immobilizer option built into the ECU and if they send you that ECU, your screwed royally. If you know what to look for ahead of time and confirm witht he importer, you don't have to worry about it, but it takes research. You can get past both the MAF and Immobilzer ECU, also the Drive by Wire isn't a problem if you have Dr Tweak do the wiring.
1JZ VVTI? There isn't an inexpensive single turbo manifold available, YET..and imagine if that stock turbo needs a rebuild....Ive never even seen a used one for sale by itself....so turbo rebuild time $$
Goes on and on, but in the end, it's all about research and doing what you want with your money. It's not like you can't rip out the motor, sell it and do something else.
Last edited by RyanV; 01-21-11 at 05:47 AM.
01-21-11, 07:07 AM
#64
01-21-11, 10:09 AM
#66
gte & na-t
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The C6 Z06 is a monster, A BPU supra will not get it done. The low end torque, light weight and gear ratio and 450+whp does not look good for a BPU supra.
You can play arounds with some hyundais, kias haha but not no Corvette sorry
01-21-11, 10:21 AM
#67
At 420rwhp he won't be messing with Z06 corvettes.
The C6 Z06 is a monster, A BPU supra will not get it done. The low end torque, light weight and gear ratio and 450+whp does not look good for a BPU supra.
You can play arounds with some hyundais, kias haha but not no Corvette sorry
The C6 Z06 is a monster, A BPU supra will not get it done. The low end torque, light weight and gear ratio and 450+whp does not look good for a BPU supra.
You can play arounds with some hyundais, kias haha but not no Corvette sorry
i am thinking the same as quckgs, i mean there are alot of fast cars out there and i dont think stock turbos with a few bpu parts will have what it take to keep up or beat LS3+ cars or turbo and blown stangs or even the newer bimmers those can move pretty quick
01-21-11, 10:39 AM
#69
My wish list:
Head I would like a 2jz-GTE because parts easier to find parts for and for a weird reason cheaper. On GTE or GE head I would upgrade the cams, springs, and retainers. Valves would be cool but not a show stopper. Porting on both would be done. Looks GTE over the GE valve covers and FFIM would be upgraded on both.
2jz-ge/gte block don't care.. 3.4L stroker kit making the GE or GTE block pretty much identical.
Turbo: Not sure yet but def going to be single.
Electronics: Standalone on both.
So GE or GTE the only difference my setup would have would be coil on plugs vs the dist. Cost on GE over GTE well if I had a gte sitting around like I do a GE the cost would be almost identical, because I have GE it's just cheaper to do it all on the GE.
I left a lot out but.. The end....
Head I would like a 2jz-GTE because parts easier to find parts for and for a weird reason cheaper. On GTE or GE head I would upgrade the cams, springs, and retainers. Valves would be cool but not a show stopper. Porting on both would be done. Looks GTE over the GE valve covers and FFIM would be upgraded on both.
2jz-ge/gte block don't care.. 3.4L stroker kit making the GE or GTE block pretty much identical.
Turbo: Not sure yet but def going to be single.
Electronics: Standalone on both.
So GE or GTE the only difference my setup would have would be coil on plugs vs the dist. Cost on GE over GTE well if I had a gte sitting around like I do a GE the cost would be almost identical, because I have GE it's just cheaper to do it all on the GE.
I left a lot out but.. The end....
01-21-11, 11:13 AM
#70
gte & na-t
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Klaus
Lol that's when Na-t comes, na-t with 67mm turbo 590rwhp you can have fun and mess around with corvettes.
They will punk you with your BPU gte at 22 psi hahaha, i am very serious.
US on the other hand na-t lol , we are not goona worry about Z06 haha will give them a nice run for their money.
Come on you know it's true.
Lol that's when Na-t comes, na-t with 67mm turbo 590rwhp you can have fun and mess around with corvettes.
They will punk you with your BPU gte at 22 psi hahaha, i am very serious.
US on the other hand na-t lol , we are not goona worry about Z06 haha will give them a nice run for their money.
Come on you know it's true.
Last edited by 99SC42; 01-21-11 at 11:19 AM.
01-21-11, 12:14 PM
#71
I dunno about that. My XXT-i pulls damn hard.
I wouldn't bother with VVT-i period. Unless you want to fly somebody in to tune it, nobody that I know of in the US has much experience with them. Not to mention the MAF, DBW, and all the other crap you have to deal with.
I wouldn't bother with VVT-i period. Unless you want to fly somebody in to tune it, nobody that I know of in the US has much experience with them. Not to mention the MAF, DBW, and all the other crap you have to deal with.
01-21-11, 12:47 PM
#72
No way I am going through the hassle of buying, installing, and wiring a vvt-i just so I can disable it. What is the point? You can get clean low mile non-vvti swaps and just drop them in and go. Also, the Drive By Wire (DBW) will have to be addressed somewhere along the way as well as the MAF, which as pointed out once already is very difficult to source.
01-21-11, 01:38 PM
#73
Forum Administrator
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Mark / Japspec, please exit this thread.
Clean up on aisle 1jz in progress. Keep this thread mature and productive guys.
EDIT - guys lets also keep this thread on topic about the 1J v 2J vs NA-T. This thread isn't about Corvettes or Civics or whatever else.
Clean up on aisle 1jz in progress. Keep this thread mature and productive guys.
EDIT - guys lets also keep this thread on topic about the 1J v 2J vs NA-T. This thread isn't about Corvettes or Civics or whatever else.
Last edited by DaveGS4; 01-21-11 at 01:54 PM.
01-21-11, 02:15 PM
#74
BPU 1jz,
BPU 2jz,
XSPower Na-t 2j.
So given those three, now what?
01-21-11, 03:21 PM
#75
My argument will always be... If you are going to do a 1jz/2jz-gte swap you should open it up and check everything. If you don't it's just as dangerous as slapping on a "E-bay" knock off turbo kit. So without knowing what the HP goals and so on are it's hard to say what to do. If you have the money, know how and ability to tear down an engine checking everything before running it well 2jz-GTE all the way. If you are buying a GTE to go single and are going to pay someone to do everything for you... hey you will be able to brag about a owning a GTE. To be 100% honest if you are looking for performance and not care about bragging rights, both will get you there. Will a GTE last longer then a GE-T? It can but the GE-T can also out last the GTE. Tuning, condition on parts, how much abuse, supporting mods and many variables out there to say this one is going to win every time. Dollar per Dollar the GE is cheaper in a stock form... once you go to aftermarket they both share a lot of parts making them identical in cost to mod.
It's also hard to compare GE vs GTE for the reason if you compare 10 2jz-gte's with the same parts and same tuning they very in power. It's rare to get all 10 to get you the same amount of HP on all 10 of them. So in my opinion either or is good. For a lot of us NA-t is the way to do it and for a lot of others 1/2jz-GTE swap will be the way.
It's also hard to compare GE vs GTE for the reason if you compare 10 2jz-gte's with the same parts and same tuning they very in power. It's rare to get all 10 to get you the same amount of HP on all 10 of them. So in my opinion either or is good. For a lot of us NA-t is the way to do it and for a lot of others 1/2jz-GTE swap will be the way.