Ultimate 1uzfe W58 Conversion Thread! (LOTS OF PICS!)
12-05-09, 09:18 AM
#151
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There's a howe throwout bearing on ebay 130349009051 with the same part number as yours, but looks a bit different. Can I use this one? Also, where do I get the spacer and what size should it be?
12-05-09, 10:23 PM
#152
The spacer you're asking about I'm assuming is the T.O.B. spacer. If you order the kit, it will come from Jake, same as in Matt's car.
I found a few things out in the process of collecting parts for my swap. I looked at a **** ton of pictures to compare pre-1995 W58s to mine. Maybe the pics I saw weren't taken from the appropriate angle, but the output shaft lined up with the shifter on mine the same as it did for the SC300 units. Like I said, maybe I missed something.
The things that I learned (with definite truth, and not just speculation) that need to be changed on a MKIII W58 (like mine) to make it the same as a MKIV/later SC300 W58 were:
-I ordered an external shifter assembly. Take everyone else' word for it, it is a pain in the *** to find. I called probably 60 junk yards, and no one wanted to separate them from transmission. I lucked out in finding one.
-The ring inside the MKIII tail shaft that the shifter sits in will not work for the MKIV shift assembly. I had to buy one of those as well.
-The MKIII tail shaft does not have the mounting points for the extended shifter. I wish this had been posted, but I learned the hard way.
-I ended up just buying a MKIV tail shaft, instead of making brackets for the shifter to work. It wasn't worth the hassle to me.
I can post pictures if anyone wants to help clarify anything I mentioned. Red, I don't mean to jack your thread but I know I would like to have known some of this specific info before I started buying stuff. I figure this is an excellent thread to post any helpful information.
I found a few things out in the process of collecting parts for my swap. I looked at a **** ton of pictures to compare pre-1995 W58s to mine. Maybe the pics I saw weren't taken from the appropriate angle, but the output shaft lined up with the shifter on mine the same as it did for the SC300 units. Like I said, maybe I missed something.
The things that I learned (with definite truth, and not just speculation) that need to be changed on a MKIII W58 (like mine) to make it the same as a MKIV/later SC300 W58 were:
-I ordered an external shifter assembly. Take everyone else' word for it, it is a pain in the *** to find. I called probably 60 junk yards, and no one wanted to separate them from transmission. I lucked out in finding one.
-The ring inside the MKIII tail shaft that the shifter sits in will not work for the MKIV shift assembly. I had to buy one of those as well.
-The MKIII tail shaft does not have the mounting points for the extended shifter. I wish this had been posted, but I learned the hard way.
-I ended up just buying a MKIV tail shaft, instead of making brackets for the shifter to work. It wasn't worth the hassle to me.
I can post pictures if anyone wants to help clarify anything I mentioned. Red, I don't mean to jack your thread but I know I would like to have known some of this specific info before I started buying stuff. I figure this is an excellent thread to post any helpful information.
Last edited by MongooseGA; 12-05-09 at 10:27 PM.
12-08-09, 06:53 PM
#154
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RP, I know I've been asking a lot of questions, and sorry for that. But did you ever get a smog check done on your car after the manual swap? If so did you get into some trouble with the smog computer showing a difference in the tranny, and not being able to pass smog?
Rite on for everything man.
Rite on for everything man.
12-08-09, 06:58 PM
#155
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The spacer you're asking about I'm assuming is the T.O.B. spacer. If you order the kit, it will come from Jake, same as in Matt's car.
I found a few things out in the process of collecting parts for my swap. I looked at a **** ton of pictures to compare pre-1995 W58s to mine. Maybe the pics I saw weren't taken from the appropriate angle, but the output shaft lined up with the shifter on mine the same as it did for the SC300 units. Like I said, maybe I missed something.
The things that I learned (with definite truth, and not just speculation) that need to be changed on a MKIII W58 (like mine) to make it the same as a MKIV/later SC300 W58 were:
-I ordered an external shifter assembly. Take everyone else' word for it, it is a pain in the *** to find. I called probably 60 junk yards, and no one wanted to separate them from transmission. I lucked out in finding one.
-The ring inside the MKIII tail shaft that the shifter sits in will not work for the MKIV shift assembly. I had to buy one of those as well.
-The MKIII tail shaft does not have the mounting points for the extended shifter. I wish this had been posted, but I learned the hard way.
-I ended up just buying a MKIV tail shaft, instead of making brackets for the shifter to work. It wasn't worth the hassle to me.
I can post pictures if anyone wants to help clarify anything I mentioned. Red, I don't mean to jack your thread but I know I would like to have known some of this specific info before I started buying stuff. I figure this is an excellent thread to post any helpful information.
I found a few things out in the process of collecting parts for my swap. I looked at a **** ton of pictures to compare pre-1995 W58s to mine. Maybe the pics I saw weren't taken from the appropriate angle, but the output shaft lined up with the shifter on mine the same as it did for the SC300 units. Like I said, maybe I missed something.
The things that I learned (with definite truth, and not just speculation) that need to be changed on a MKIII W58 (like mine) to make it the same as a MKIV/later SC300 W58 were:
-I ordered an external shifter assembly. Take everyone else' word for it, it is a pain in the *** to find. I called probably 60 junk yards, and no one wanted to separate them from transmission. I lucked out in finding one.
-The ring inside the MKIII tail shaft that the shifter sits in will not work for the MKIV shift assembly. I had to buy one of those as well.
-The MKIII tail shaft does not have the mounting points for the extended shifter. I wish this had been posted, but I learned the hard way.
-I ended up just buying a MKIV tail shaft, instead of making brackets for the shifter to work. It wasn't worth the hassle to me.
I can post pictures if anyone wants to help clarify anything I mentioned. Red, I don't mean to jack your thread but I know I would like to have known some of this specific info before I started buying stuff. I figure this is an excellent thread to post any helpful information.
12-08-09, 07:05 PM
#156
From what I've learned, the 1995+ W58s all had the external shifter assemblies. If you don't have that, I can think of two reasons as to why: A) your swap isn't out of a 1995, or B) It's a very early 1995 model and didn't get it because they hadn't started using them yet.
I'm not too sure if the SC300 transmissions without that shifter will line up correctly. I think Matt may know the answer better than I would.
I will say though, that I've read of a few other members who have modified the actual shift lever on the older versions of the W58, which I'm assuming you have. Search for something like "W58 shifter R154 swap" in this forum. There was a member who showed how me modified the shifter to sit further back. Basically, they bent/welded on an extension to the existing shifter. The reason I didn't do this with my MKIII unit is because I didn't want to alter the throw of the shifter.
If you decide to look for a MKIV shift assembly (the external one), I have one for sale on eBay and in the classifieds.
I'm not too sure if the SC300 transmissions without that shifter will line up correctly. I think Matt may know the answer better than I would.
I will say though, that I've read of a few other members who have modified the actual shift lever on the older versions of the W58, which I'm assuming you have. Search for something like "W58 shifter R154 swap" in this forum. There was a member who showed how me modified the shifter to sit further back. Basically, they bent/welded on an extension to the existing shifter. The reason I didn't do this with my MKIII unit is because I didn't want to alter the throw of the shifter.
If you decide to look for a MKIV shift assembly (the external one), I have one for sale on eBay and in the classifieds.
12-09-09, 06:59 PM
#157
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But if you use the stock sc300 shifter out of 92-94, it should work. I know I'm going far back on this thread, but I'm reading every single reply to get prepared for my 1uz vvti w58 swap.
Last edited by scfou; 12-09-09 at 07:15 PM.
12-09-09, 10:11 PM
#158
I have personally swapped a few 92-94 W58 (farthest placed backwards shifter thats INTERNAL) and 95+ (external shifter). Both work just fine with any SC300 driveshaft (not sure about MK4 DS)
I have NOT tried a straight up MK3 W58... I can tell you a MK3 W58 + a MK4/SC300 tailshaft/shifter works (because it essentially makes it a MK4/SC3 tranny with weaker internals).
No smog check, its the joys of living in FL.
I have NOT tried a straight up MK3 W58... I can tell you a MK3 W58 + a MK4/SC300 tailshaft/shifter works (because it essentially makes it a MK4/SC3 tranny with weaker internals).
No smog check, its the joys of living in FL.
12-10-09, 01:10 AM
#159
I just walked in from my garage. Unfortunately, I can say this:
The MKIII and MKIV tail shafts are NOT interchangeable. At least, not without some physical modifications to the MKIV tail shaft. I got the MKIV piece to sit all the way down to the actual transmission mid-section, until about the last inch and a half, where it got stuck on something and wouldn't budge. Some buddies and I compared the two side by side and noticed a few very small, but apparently very different characteristics. I will post pictures to illustrate:
The MKIII is on the left, MKIV on the right. In the following pictures, the MKIII can be more easily distinguished by noticing that it the darker color grey.
Starting at the top, middle of the tail shaft housing, you'll notice that the ring that the "shift piston" (as I've been calling it) runs through sticks out (into the housing) on the MKIII, and is flush on MKIV. Probably not a big deal, but it's different. Next, the sprung pieces counterclockwise and slightly lower on both housings: they are different sizes. This could possibly be what kept my MKIV housing from sitting flush; its high enough to the drive shaft side of the housing that it would be allowed to slide down to the midsection juuust enough before stopping it.
A more detailed look at both:
MKIII
MKIV
One other thing I wasn't sure of:
The "shifter piston" slides into the channel that depresses a sprung nipple piece, correct? Looks like this:
Lastly, the tail of the housing:
Notice that the collar that the "shift piston" slides into in the MKIV (pictured on the right) allows about 1/2" more room between its edge and the rear lip of the housing. I can get my finger in the gap of the MKIV, but not of the MKIII.
So, now I'm scratching my head, thinking I'm "fuct". After a while of deliberation, we concluded that the MKIV tail shaft will not fit on the MKIII midsection (please chime in if you know differently). With this assumption in mind, I was left to replace the MKIII unit back on to the transmission. The issue I had then was that the MKIV external shifter would not sit into the collar that is bolted to the "shift piston". The male end of the shifter is too tall, and doesn't allow the cover to sit flush on the housing.
Hope this helps anyone trying to do some researching. Hope someone else can help me with my research and issues.
The MKIII and MKIV tail shafts are NOT interchangeable. At least, not without some physical modifications to the MKIV tail shaft. I got the MKIV piece to sit all the way down to the actual transmission mid-section, until about the last inch and a half, where it got stuck on something and wouldn't budge. Some buddies and I compared the two side by side and noticed a few very small, but apparently very different characteristics. I will post pictures to illustrate:
The MKIII is on the left, MKIV on the right. In the following pictures, the MKIII can be more easily distinguished by noticing that it the darker color grey.
Starting at the top, middle of the tail shaft housing, you'll notice that the ring that the "shift piston" (as I've been calling it) runs through sticks out (into the housing) on the MKIII, and is flush on MKIV. Probably not a big deal, but it's different. Next, the sprung pieces counterclockwise and slightly lower on both housings: they are different sizes. This could possibly be what kept my MKIV housing from sitting flush; its high enough to the drive shaft side of the housing that it would be allowed to slide down to the midsection juuust enough before stopping it.
A more detailed look at both:
MKIII
MKIV
One other thing I wasn't sure of:
The "shifter piston" slides into the channel that depresses a sprung nipple piece, correct? Looks like this:
Lastly, the tail of the housing:
Notice that the collar that the "shift piston" slides into in the MKIV (pictured on the right) allows about 1/2" more room between its edge and the rear lip of the housing. I can get my finger in the gap of the MKIV, but not of the MKIII.
So, now I'm scratching my head, thinking I'm "fuct". After a while of deliberation, we concluded that the MKIV tail shaft will not fit on the MKIII midsection (please chime in if you know differently). With this assumption in mind, I was left to replace the MKIII unit back on to the transmission. The issue I had then was that the MKIV external shifter would not sit into the collar that is bolted to the "shift piston". The male end of the shifter is too tall, and doesn't allow the cover to sit flush on the housing.
Hope this helps anyone trying to do some researching. Hope someone else can help me with my research and issues.
12-10-09, 02:40 PM
#160
I found an article recently about a guy using his MK4 transmission on a MK2 tail shaft so he wouldnt need to mod anything shifter-wise... He said he had to grind something down (probably the same issue as you had)...
Its doable, but it IS custom work. I have heard of the MK4 tail on the MK3... no idea what was involved.
Google search tailshaft interchangeability, as I am in class now and cannot.
Its doable, but it IS custom work. I have heard of the MK4 tail on the MK3... no idea what was involved.
Google search tailshaft interchangeability, as I am in class now and cannot.
Last edited by RedPhoenix; 12-10-09 at 02:58 PM.
12-10-09, 02:43 PM
#161
I found an article recently about a guy using his MK4 transmission on a MK2 tail shaft so he wouldnt need to mod anything shifter-wise... He said he had to grind something down (probably the same issue as you had)...
Its doable, but it IS custom work.
Google search tailshaft interchangeability, as I am in class now and cannot.
Its doable, but it IS custom work.
Google search tailshaft interchangeability, as I am in class now and cannot.
At this point I don't care if I use the MKIII or MKIV tail shaft. I just need one of them to work.
12-11-09, 05:55 AM
#162
Lead Lap
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so i was looking at this amazing build and great job by the way but i was looking at the link you put up (redphoenix) and i wasn't sure if it came with all the parts i need. im pretty sure that it does but does it include the W58 transmission as well?
