twizt2

Hey all
I just got back from checking out a local tuner who does some very fast supras. The guy I spoke to gave me a lot to think about and I wanted to see if you guys agreed with what he told me before I take when he said at face value. Here are a few things he said...

1. Go GTE instead of a NA-T setup. Once you decide to go beyond 350whp in a turbo GE it will cost you as much as doing the GTE swap up front.

2. The GTE engine is better suited for turbo duty. They're are some functional differences in the engine internally not just turbo and no turbos. Turboing a NA car will not give you the quality results you get when you have a turbo engine to start with.

3. Prices: Swapped, parts labor, tuned out the door. GTE with 6sp $10K, 1J $8K, NA-T $5,000

These guys have over 20 year experience in the "go fast" game. Should I take what he said as the gospel.

Thanks
Twizt

Koma

iTrader: (3)

What he said shouldn't be taken as law.
Although what he says is true from what I have read.
GTE's were stronger than the GE's to begin with and were built with the turbo in mind. The price does shoot up after a certain horsepower but I don't know at what point.

twizt2

Thx darch!
Yeah, he was really bullish on the GTE swap and said he would even do a 1J swap before he touched a NA-T.

SPORTcoupe

iTrader: (2)

I wouldn't go with this tuner.
Find someone who's done NA-Ts and knows the 2JZ engine and they'll tell you that the GE engine is just as strong as the GTE.
DaveH is a great example of a NA-T that has far exceeded the accomplishments of many TTs.

I tackled te NA-T project myself but definitely wouldn't try a TT swap just yet.
Too much wiring.

~Alan

awj

1. NO
2. Ehhhh, sort of - yea... but this is flat out wrong...
3. NO

Go to Toyomoto. You're in Florida. Tell Lance what you told us...

Then get out your wallet.

got_trd

8k for a 1jz swap?? what is he smoking....

IMO- i'd do the GTE swap over NA-T also... Or actually I would do a 1jz swap w/ 2jz bottom end and play with that for a while then actually buy a supra tt... (oops I think i just blurred out my master plan... hehe)

reamemiya

iTrader: (1)

where is the any reliability after boosting any car over factory? i think if you're planning on making more than 600+ hp then maybe the GTE is for you, but keep on dreaming. all that he said is basically common sense, but from what it sounds like this guy's just trying to pick out at your wallet.

twizt2

Sportcoupe - I'm going to have to keep lookin if i'm going to find an experienced NA-T tuner that will not cost a exorbitant amount of money. I'll pay for quality, but there is a point where you're paying too much.

AWJ - You kinda lost me for a second there.

got_trd - Yeah $8k for a 1J sounds like a really bad typo.

reamemiya - Does kind arouse suspicion when the only work they recommend is the most expensive stuff on the menu.

My goal is to have about 400rhp. Does that goal change the fact that I was going NA-T or should I, at that hp level, consider the GTE?

reamemiya

iTrader: (1)

i think there are more good tuners for na-t now than in the past.

for your 400hp goal you have 3 options which are GTE bpu++, 1jz bpu++, or na-t.

i would save myself the time and money and go with na-t.

2jz swap takes a good month. the quickest i heard it was done was 3 weeks, but he was on that car day in and day out (guessing most of the time was spent on rewiring the harness). and it costs twice as much. only + i see is bragging rights.

as where dropping in a turbo would take a couple of days and half the money.

mteele

iTrader: (5)

If money is an issue, go with a 1JZ swap. You can do the swap yourself and buy a front clip for about $2k. OR, XAT Racing over in Tampa will do the swap for you for $5k ($8k is waaaay overpriced).

Ebanks

IMO...

If your ultimate goal is 400 RWHP then just do a BPU tt swap. If they will really do a 6spd swap with all labor, parts, etc. for $10k that is a good deal. That complete motor with harness, ecu, all accessories, etc. is worth $3k if it is USDM and the Trans is worth $2500 or so. Throw in BPU parts and misc things needed to complete the swap and you are only paying about $2-3k labor for the swap. You could probably knock $2000 off that price by going with an auto swap with a restalled stock converter instead of a 6spd, and the car would be quicker too.

NA-T is fun, but if you only want 400 RWHP, it will be easier and less headache to just do a swap. On top of that, at 400 RWHP on a TT swap you are looking at near stock reliability, which is tough to beat.

-Ethan

twizt2

Thanks for the replies.

As far as the 1J, the only concern i've heard and maybe it's being blown out of proportion is the availability of parts.... and having to explain to each lexus technician why my engine compartment looks so different from all the others

Ebanks - Thx for your comment. Having "been there and done that" let me ask you, what really are the "headaches" that people always talk about when they try to talk up the GTE swap, especially at my hp goals?

Ebanks

The "headaches" really aren't anything in specific... Which is why they are headaches There are always small things going on that need to be tweaked here or there or things that aren't working properly. An NA-T is just more finicky (sp?) than a factory ecu controlled TT swap. Toyota put a lot more time into there ECU setup than any tuning you will ever have done on your NA-T, so if you goal is "only" 400 RWHP why not benefit from it?

-Ethan

Koma

iTrader: (3)

I'm still thinking the GTE is a stronger engine. It was built with turbo in mind. And I think it has forged internals, I don't know if the GE does.

awj

yea... those wimpy ge's can't take it...



Twist, I mean, it can take it just fine. It's your choice what to do. Choose the right shop though...

The less it costs, the more trouble - typically... It's cheap for a reason. Doesn't mean you need to overpay either. But sit tight and do some research...

There is a lot of info out there. Intellexual is a good start.

I'm amazed that Ebanks, is pushing the gte over na-t... not that it really matters, both are excellent ways to make power. Research the differences and know what you are doing or at least be able to guess...