Question about new Smog law?
09-29-09, 01:18 PM
#1
Question about new Smog law?
Hello all,
Long story short, I also have a 2002 Mustang that has a very bad exhaust leak. I had two muffler shops look at it and they said that the cat is cracked on the driver's side. So I asked him to remove the heat shield and spot weld (which will be done tomorrow) where the crack is. He said if the spot weld doesn't solve it and the cat is already bad, I may need to replace it. I asked him if he could put a universal Magnaflow catalytic converter to save on cost rather than purchase a whole new OEM stock catalytic converter system. He said that there is a new law that passed in CA where smog technicians check the CARB # on the cats now and it has to match the car. So that means I can't use a universal catalytic converter. If I have to buy OEM, it's going to cost a lot more!
IS THIS TRUE?
Long story short, I also have a 2002 Mustang that has a very bad exhaust leak. I had two muffler shops look at it and they said that the cat is cracked on the driver's side. So I asked him to remove the heat shield and spot weld (which will be done tomorrow) where the crack is. He said if the spot weld doesn't solve it and the cat is already bad, I may need to replace it. I asked him if he could put a universal Magnaflow catalytic converter to save on cost rather than purchase a whole new OEM stock catalytic converter system. He said that there is a new law that passed in CA where smog technicians check the CARB # on the cats now and it has to match the car. So that means I can't use a universal catalytic converter. If I have to buy OEM, it's going to cost a lot more!
IS THIS TRUE?
09-29-09, 11:44 PM
#5
Lexus Champion
If the car is past CA emissions warranty and if you need a new cat, I wouldn't see why a CARB-approved aftermarket cat can't be used. Besides unless you drive a Civic, Integ, DSM, WRX or Evo, most smog techs will just check to see if there is a cat installed...
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09-30-09, 11:03 AM
#8
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you can call Michael's muffler in San Jose at Capitol Expy auto mall. Very good pricing! They install c.a.r.b approved obdII certified converters. The only one's that have a problem with aftermarket are the manifold type converters on late model imports. I use them professionally and sublet my work for converters through them. BTW I own and operate a repair facility with a smog license. So I deal with converters issues all the time.
Last edited by jns350; 09-30-09 at 10:22 PM.
09-30-09, 10:01 PM
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But BAR gives a exception
. If you are the original station that has diagnose a defective converter you may sublet exhaust work to a muffler shop for repairs. I must stress "Exhaust" repairs only.As a repair station I may not sublet diagnostics or other repair for emission correction. Then I must inform my customer that a repair is being done other than my shop as in "subletting" work. Then last, I must warranty the repair as if it's was my own work done by my facility. If all three areas are met then you have complied with BAR regulations for converter repair as a smog repair station.
As a business owner I must always C.Y.A; follow and understand the rules....with the most important of them all big brother BAR.
Good observation!!!!!!
Last edited by jns350; 09-30-09 at 10:21 PM.
10-01-09, 09:37 AM
#12
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Wished you luck!!!! Congrats will be in order after you pass the test. You will be a much more marketable technician with that license under your belt. Not to mention more $$ per hour for you!!!! Good luck!!!
10-01-09, 10:58 AM
#14
Lexus Champion
You are correct. But BAR gives a exception. If you are the original station that has diagnose a defective converter you may sublet exhaust work to a muffler shop for repairs. I must stress "Exhaust" repairs only.
As a repair station I may not sublet diagnostics or other repair for emission correction. Then I must inform my customer that a repair is being done other than my shop as in "subletting" work. Then last, I must warranty the repair as if it's was my own work done by my facility. If all three areas are met then you have complied with BAR regulations for converter repair as a smog repair station.
As a business owner I must always C.Y.A; follow and understand the rules....with the most important of them all big brother BAR.
Good observation!!!!!!
But BAR gives a exception. If you are the original station that has diagnose a defective converter you may sublet exhaust work to a muffler shop for repairs. I must stress "Exhaust" repairs only.As a repair station I may not sublet diagnostics or other repair for emission correction. Then I must inform my customer that a repair is being done other than my shop as in "subletting" work. Then last, I must warranty the repair as if it's was my own work done by my facility. If all three areas are met then you have complied with BAR regulations for converter repair as a smog repair station.
As a business owner I must always C.Y.A; follow and understand the rules....with the most important of them all big brother BAR.
Good observation!!!!!!
10-01-09, 10:50 PM
#15
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I got an old boss of mine with a 2004 Hyundai Santa Fe, and he was saying his cats were bad. I pulled up a P0420 cat code, but here's the funny part - the car runs like crap - but there wasn't any code for oxygen sensor issues such as failed HO2S heaters or anything like that. There are 2 O2s - but there are placed fore/aft of the warm-up cat and I don't see one on the pipe leading from the main cat to the resonator. You think the O2s are shot, hence triggering the P0420 and causing the car to run in limp-home mode?
#420 codes are usually cat efficiency codes. Do you have snap on vantage? or a solus pro? You need to check the operation of the O2 sensors first. If the O2 sensors are switching then they are doing it's job. You can confirm the converters condition by matching the wave pattern of the primary O2 sensor vs. the post O2 sensor. If a "mirror" effect is found meaning both wave patterns are almost similar between each sensor then the converter is no good. As a side note* if you don't have those equipment handy then you can probe the leads of the sensors with an Ohm meter and check to see if there is switching activity. IMO if only the 420 code is present then odds are the o2 are switching and the ECM is recognizing the mirror effect. If you had in addition lean or rich mixture codes then I would not suspect the converter is bad yet.
Heater fail code for the o2s are usually spot on for a defective o2 sensor. Since it's an internal failure of the heater circuit. But oddly the o2 sensor can still be operational with a heater fail since it's just the light off feature that is not working.
But the most important part of your question is your comment of the car running very poor. Now if the car is running very bad then it could also trigger a 420 code since the vehicle is probably dumping loads of fuel in the converters making them fall off the charts. Tricky part also is if the converters are indeed bad then it's possible that the converters are bad as a result of the car running like crap.