Lexusfreak

Harrier brings up a very valid point! Mst of the so called red "long life" coolants out there say they don't need to be changed for 5 years or 150,000 + miles or more. Can someone tell me (us) what the deal is with Toyota's "long life" coolant then if we still need to change it every 2 years or 30,000 miles? It seemes that it just "regular" coolant that's dyed red with a different chemical mixture than say the Prestone "green" conventional stuff.

HarrierAWD

I have the Toyota coolant here. (No I didn't buy it. Lexus gave it to me for free because my coolant level kept going down after the 30K service.)

Here are the ingredients:
Ethylene Glycol
Diethylene Glycol
Water
Organic Acid Salt
Hydrated Inorganic Salt

In another section, it claims that it does not contain silicates nor borates.

Anyone with the green Prestone please post the ingredients. Thanks.

HarrierAWD

The Prestone green can last 3 years or 36K miles, longer than the Toyota "Long Life." This is my first Toyota (Lexus.) Maybe the Toyota coolant used to last 6 months in the old days.

And I always wonder why Toyota needs a different kind of coolant anyway. What exotic metal or material do they use inside the engine? It's just aluminum, cast iron, rubber, and plastic like any other cars, right? Will the Toyota engine melt away or go kaput if Prestone is used? Don't get me wrong. I like Toyota. I just don't understand this coolant thing.

On an unrelated note, many GM owners have discovered that the Dexcool doesn't really last 5 years. Now they are recommending every 3 years. (Ex-GM owner myself.) I guess the Dexcool orange color is used to hide the rust. Very clever.

Lexusfreak

Very intresting about the GM Dexcool Harrier For me personally, I usually do an engine coolant flush every 2 years anyways even if I use the Prestone or "long life" stuff.......I just fussy that way I guess, or mentally ill (depending on your point of view lol) & the so called "long life" stuff is only a few bucks more than the regular green stuff anyways so the cost is no big deal. I too however am courious why Toyota's "long life" suggest to change it at such a short interval.......anybody know the answer? Maybe somebody should call Lexus head office & ask them about that!?

saber

There is one camp of Toyota/Lexus owners think it's normal for a Toyota/Lexus engine to need a valve job at 150,000 - 200,000 miles, to need a new water pump at 100,000 miles, a new radiator after 10-15 years and a new cylinder head gasket after about 15 years. If their favorite local mechanic tells them they also need a whole new aluminum cylinder head after 15 years due to erosion of the coolant passages in the head or excessive warpage of the head, they think that's pretty normal and unavoidable as well. These are typically the same owners who use aftermarket coolants because they believe Toyota Long Life Coolant is nothing special and dyed red for marketing purposes.

Then there is another camp of owners who think Toyota Long Life Coolant was specially developed by the Toyota engineers to protect the life of the engine, head gasket, cylinder head and radiator for more like 30 years or 500,000 miles and to extend the life of the water pump out to 175,000 -250,000 miles.

I'm a member of the second camp. and here's why:

http://www.saber.net/~monarch/toyred.jpg
http://www.saber.net/~monarch/238..JPG
http://www.saber.net/~monarch/89thermohouse.JPG

HarrierAWD

Those photos sure are impressive. Thanks. So I suppose there is something special about Toyota coolant. Maybe they don't want to list all the ingredients so that other manufacturers can't copy it.

JCtx

That's exactly what it is buddy. Just as your picture said, change it once a year, and you can put the cheapest coolant you can find (w/distilled water, of course), and it'd look the same.
It's the same analogy as changing your oil every 1,000 miles; you can use $1 oil and have the same results as fully synthetic one.
The advantages of one coolant or oil over another start showing when the miles/time accumulate. Give us something better before making those biased claims; you sound like a toyota employee

This is another subject that can go forever, just like oil. Put whatever makes you happy on your car; you can't go wrong with ANY brand, as long as it's changed REGULARLY. And dispose of it properly .

Good day gentlemen.

saber

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ELP_JC
[B]That's exactly what it is buddy. {Toyota Long Life Coolant is nothing special and dyed red for marketing purposes]

The Toyota Long Life Coolant is special. There are no silicates in it that can abrade and shorten the life of the water pump seal or which can drop out of suspension and cause deposits and blockages to form on the radiator core tubes. There are no borates in Toyota Long Life Coolant that can pit and erode the aluminum components of the cooling system. Erosion of cylinder head cooling passages is a common cause of cylinder head gasket failure in some Toyota engines.

Prestone Long Life Coolant and Havoline Extended life Coolant don't contain silicates or borates either, but if too much air gets in the cooling system due to a weak radiator cap or low coolant level in the coolant overflow bottle, nasty chemical reactions can take place causing a sludge to form: http://www.saber.net/~monarch/deathcool.jpg

The Toyota Long Life Coolant doesn't have any of these limitations.and potentially devasting consequences because it's chemistry is unique and special. In other words, it's a fail-safe antifreeze that
keeps the cooling system clean and free of deposits or serious corrosion even if neglected for up to 5 years. It's also the a very convenient antifreeze to use because if just the radiator is drained and refilled once a year, it is not necessary to drain the engine block or to ever flush the system because the drained coolant will always be crystal clear like this http://www.saber.net/~monarch/89drained.JPG. in other words, no deposits or sediment will form in the cooling system that need to be flushed out. So the savvy owner can maintain his/her cooling system by just draining and refilling the radiator once a year (a simple procedure that costs only $15 worth of coolant) vs taking the car to a dealer for a $150 -$200 flush and fill job every 2-3 years.

Carpe Diem

Here we go again! Quick, everyone turn your back to the wind with foul weather gear on.

George

TxLexus

I am the one who was suppose to try the toyota coolant and keep you guys posted. I will this week. As soon as it stop raining.

Changing coolant every year??? Waste of time and money.
I havent change my coolant in 3 years and I ve been using Walmart Supertech brand and I have never even use distill water.

As for Oil you guys would die laughing.
I use synthetic oil with a cheap oil filter. I change the oil filter every 2-3 thousand miles. and add in more oil. I dont change my synthetic oil til every 12-15 thousand miles.

I been doing this to all my cars for over 10 years. I know alot of members gonna shake there head.

BUT on the SC4 TWO HUNDRED and TWENTY THOUSAND SOMETHING MILES BABY. Still runs like a dream.

saber

> Changing coolant every year??? Waste of time and money.

I said I just drained and refilled the radiator once a year with a 50/50 mix of the original factory fill coolant: (Genuine Toyota Long Life Coolant and distilled water). That's just a PARTIAL coolant change once a year.

It's far easier and less complicated, obviously, to just drain and refill the radiator once a year compared to draining and flushing the entire cooling system every 2-3 years. Plus the inside of the cooling system stays immaculate for decades and unlimited miles. http://www.saber.net/~monarch/238..JPG http://www.saber.net/~monarch/89thermohouse.JPG Plus in some cases water pump life is extended out to 15-25 years or 200,000 -300,000 miles. Those are major benefits for the cost of just $15 worth of coolant once a year, for the owner who plans to keep a Lexus a long time.

> As for Oil you guys would die laughing.
> I use synthetic oil with a cheap oil filter. I change the oil filter every 2-3 thousand miles. and add in > more oil. I dont change my synthetic oil til every 12-15 thousand miles.

On a Corolla forum today a guy said his 2000 Corolla engine recently blew up at 104,000 miles while cruising on the freeway. He had been using Mobil 1 synthetic and extending oil changes out to 15,000 miles. I told him both Toyota and Lexus advise owners not to extend oil change intervals when using synthetic oils. Here's what Toyota's website says: http://www.saber.net/~monarch/synno10K.jpg

You may luck out since the Lexus V8 is a little more tolerant of extended oil changes compared to some other Lexus and Toyota engines.

TxLexus

Well Guys, I did state that i will give you an update.

I finally changed my coolant last week. I am the one who was using WALMART SUPERTECH COOLLANT.
My car was running fine. Although on cooler nites, when going freeway speed, i did notice the temper gauge drop to the cooler side. but it has never overheat. So Supertech coolant do fluctuate the temp.

Well I spent 15 bucks for the RED TOYOTA LONG LIFE coolant just because of this thread.
Well I did notice that the temp gauge DOES NOT fluctuate like the Supertech. It was always normal or just a tad cooler at times.


My conclusion.
Is Toyota coolant better? I think its a little bit better than Supertech, I dont know about other brands.
Would I buy it again? NOPE

Would I continue to use Walmart Supertech coolant. Hell YEAH

IMO, for you lexus owners who ask which coolant to use. well if you have to ask, I say you should stick with the RED.

saber

The engine will run at the same temperature regardless of which brand of coolant is used because the cooling system thermostat controls the engine temperature. The reason for using the Toyota Red Coolant is to prevent cooling system corrosion and the build up of mineral deposits which will lead to engine overheating and other serious damage when the car is 7-15 years old. All Toyota / Lexus forums are full of owner complaints of needing new $4,000 engines when their cars are only 10-15 years old. All these engine failures are tracable to owners who have a "I know or my trusted local mechanic knows better than the Toyota engineers" attitude and refuse to use Toyota products and / or follow Toyota maintenance instructions.

JCtx

Well, that's the crap manufacturers want you to believe.
As long as you use products with the manufacturer's specifications or better (this is the key), nothing will happen to your engine, AS LONG AS you follow the recommended maintenance; THIS IS the problem with most failures. No coolant will protect your engine for 10 or years, regardless of mileage. Products that fall within this category are coolant, motor oil, gasoline, brake fluid, and transfer case gear oil. Some manufacturers claim SPECIAL agents (Honda is one) are on their power steering, transmission, and differential fluids. Right or not, it's better to stick to those, especially under warranty, but there's absolutely no reason why not use a long-life coolant which has no silicates, borates, phosphates, or nitrites. There's nothing special about a Toyota engine and radiator gentlemen; they're made of the same materials than any other modern engine. Just change the coolant when you should and you'll be fine. Oh, and a very important note: USE DISTILLED WATER. Tap water is another source of trouble.
As far as I know, Lexus doens't require any special fluids like Honda does; I use premium stuff myself, like fully synthetic motor oil, and the best coolant available (Havoline long-life; borate, silicate, nitrite, and phosphate free), AND change them much sooner than recommended, so complete drainage is not an issue. A coolant change sets you back less than $10 if you do it yourself, which is a piece of cake; cheap insurance. I change my oil and filter every 3K miles on my SC (which happens every year) and motorcycles (with similar mileage per year), and about every 4K on daily drivers. Finally, I enjoy working on my cars and motorcycles, nobody does it like me, and I have the time. Otherwise I'd let the dealer do it.
There are only TWO key words about maintenance: proper products and regular intervals. Don't fall for the 150K-mile coolants, or 15K-mile oil changes; that's crap IMHO.

jonathancl

i also like http://www.saber.net/~monarch/deathcool.jpg.