Devh

Please don't take this the wrong way. You cant tell how good an oil is by how clean it looks or how it smells. Yes you maybe able to see how clean your engine is over time with the valve covers off or peering into the oil filter hole to observe the varnish etching build up but that's about it for looks. The only way to get any idea what you are using is working well for you is to perform oil analysis. If the report comes back good, great but that does not mean that the oil is superior to anything else as you may find a different oil that can give you the same results. If you use that so called superior oil but perform too frequent oil changes then you will not get any of the benefits of that oil.

roadfrog

Just to be clear, "springing" for Toyota oil does not break the bank. My Toyota dealer sells it in bulk for $5.05 per qt in Canada....no doubt cheaper in the US.

Doublebase

So what I'm understanding on this thread is that our engine - like certain others - is finicky. The variable valve timing mechanism has small passages the oil must flow through and if those passages get blocked/partially blocked, I will have drivability issues until those passages are clear.

I think there are other engines out there with similar type of circumstances, but for the most part it's not the type of oil you use with those engines, it's the maintenance schedule you keep with it. If you don't change your oil you are screwed. I am careful with the LS...I change it regularly. I may give the toyota oil a shot (after I burn through the 9 quarts of napa 0w20 I have laying around). In my opinion it is important to believe in the stuff you put into your engine...your radiator...your transmission. In some weird way it makes you feel better and that's part of the ownership of these things. I enjoy maintaining my vehicle, it's weird, I know, but I like to see how long things can last. I have a Honda accord with 300k on it. I changed the oil every 3k miles, the tranny fluid every 20k and the coolant every year. The thing still rides pretty darn well, but the lexus is my daily driver and I hope to put 300k on that with a little luck. Maintenance is key.

Doublebase

You're right, supposedly the color has very little to do with anything, but I will say the longer I go between changes, the darker it is. It's very important to change the oil when it's hot as well...the stuff that builds up between changes falls to the bottom of the pan when it's cold, and when it's hot the stuff is suspended in the oil and you get most of it out when you pull that plug.Whereas when it's cold the oil flows right over the stuff on the bottom of the pan, not getting enough of it out.

One thing I notice when I don't change my oil when it's hot, is that it's dirty looking right off the bat. Then when I do the next change - and it's hot - it looks cleaner and stays that way almost through the entire 5k miles.

Devh

Maintenance is paramount but over maintenance is a waste of money and time.
One can make the argument that changing out your fluids well before the recommended dealer interval will last longer because the oil is clean and the additive package is fresh. Unfortunately that has been proven not to be true. Especially with fleet vehicles.
The reason why the oil industry adopted the 3k oil change interval is during the days of leaded fuel contamination. Since unleaded only fuel, the 3k interval was still adopted by quick oil change places simply because of profits.

The reality is not what it seams and what we do know now from oil analysis is that there is a sweet spot with lubricants. If you change out your lubricants too early you may encounter more wear then if you did a normal recommended oil interval. Fresh oil will throw out more metal initially, then the oil will settle down with less wear until the additives get exhausted to where it goes back up again. So in a nutshell it's not beneficial changing out your lubricates early and it's a waste of money.
Going by what you believe in vs actual scientific data is where people get caught up in doing things to their car that either do not make much difference or could cause harm to their car like adding miracle additives.

Devh

The oil gets darker the longer you go but what does that have to do with keeping your engine clean. As long as the total base number is not exhausted you don't need to worry how dark your oil gets. Oil is suppose to get dark because it's doing its job.
If you want to believe in what you are doing, send a sample of your used oil to Blackstone labs and let them tell you, your doing it right.

Doublebase

How far are you going between changes? I'm doing the standard 5k on mobile one. One thing I'll never do is use a fram filter on one of these things...took one out of the box and there was a open space between the pleats...opened another box and it was the same thing.

Devh

I'm currently going with 5k oil changes as specified by Toyota. I believe the Toyota oil can go 10k miles between changes and once Toyota says I can I will go with that recommendation. I will also get an oil analysis to make sure the oil has held up. If not or it's on the edge of the TBN then I will lower that interval to 7k miles.
The Toyota synthetic may not have the extended formulations you find in Mobil one or other oils but that is also a good thing since it's speculated that those additives might be corrosive to the engine internals.

Fram filters are crap and they are a big joke. All other filters are just about good as the next with the exception of Fram.
I like to stick with Denso or Wix because they are quality filters.

roadfrog

My Toyota dealer charges 6 bucks for a filter and they even throw in a drain washer. No brainer there.

I will say that Fram's reputation has not been good. I will also say that I used them for over 30 years (even in my BMW) with no issues. Apparently the quality of their filters have improved in leaps and bounds over the last couple years though.

I'd also like to add that I use Blackstone Labs on all my vehicles every other oil change. Also, oil color has NOTHING to do with what's going on with it, etc. If it's dark, that just means it's doing it's job. I'd be MORE concerned if it were still like it came out of the bottle after a few thousand miles.

Doublebase

You pay to have your oil analyzed after every other oil change? That costs over $110 bucks, right? I know they have all sorts of different analysis packages available ranging from $40 to well over a hundred.

I've used fram filters a lot in the past too, but in the past I've always used the regular screw on type metal ones. Now that I can actually visually take a look at the filter element - because it's a cartridge type - I was able to see why everyone is so negative about that brand. And man they are right. I saw an opening in a pleat that would easily allow stuff to bypass right through the filter without being touched.

Devh

I believe Blackstone is a little more then $20 for the report. The most important value to get is the TBN. What most people do is a trend of three oil changes after the car has accumulated over 20k miles because new engines throw out metal before it settles down. Looking at the your fist report you can see where your TBN is then you can go a little longer on the oil the next time and get another analysis. From that you can determine what kind of millage you can run on this oil before you need to change it. Then just stick to what you feel comfortable with based on the oil analysis.
You will find your sweet spot and reduce the wear of your motor and best of all you will save time and money from unnecessary oil changes.

williakz

This course of action directly violates the original Lexus factory warranty on new vehicles which REQUIRES mileage- AND time-limited oil changes. In the case of some LS models, the mileage limit is every 5,000 miles, which I'm sure is much less than that produced by the TBN oil analysis method described above. Many owners are either under initial factory or CPO warranty or have purchased an extended warranty from Lexus or a third party insurer. Owners should check their warranty requirements BEFORE attempting to extend their oil change intervals. Otherwise, they could be jeopardizing coverage by giving their warranty company an "out" should an engine malfunction result in extensive and expensive damage.

roadfrog

Blackstone is about 20 bucks, plus your shipping costs to them. They then send you an email with a PDF of the report when completed. They will also send you a case of bottles and shipping labels for free if you ask on their website.

Doublebase

Nice, thanks.

Devh

I personally stay within the factory recommendation which I have stated a few post back however if and when Toyota revises their recommendation based on their synthetic oil to 10k miles across the board, I will then perform an oil analysis to make sure it has held up.
The subject of extend oil change intervals beyond the factory recommendation has come up and it was determined that the manufacture has the burden of proof that the lubricant failure was the direct or indirect cause of the warranty claim. This also goes for aftermarket parts.
You are well within your rights however the hassle is not worth the trip.