parscale

I need some help...

I have a 2007 Lexus LS460L with about 75k miles. I switched out the Wheels/Tires for a set of Vossen 20" with Toyo Proxies 4.

I always thought I had a slight vibration with the car before, but it wasn't anything horrible... One of those things you notice, but doesn't set off your internal annoying sensor.

However, now I have bad vibration. Originally when I first got the set it was at about 72mph it would start. So I went to NTB and had them balanced. Did not help.

I then went to Firestone where they have a Road Force unit, had it balanced and they said I had one bad tire. I had it replaced with a new tire. I then returned and had them road force balanced again. I even asked them to start from scratch with the weights.

Everything was balanced and re-tested at my request. They showed me the print outs with everything and said everything was within specs.

Back on the highway now I start to feel vibration at 65+ mph. I set my water bottle on the console and it just goes crazy. It is now enough to set off my annoying sensor.

What can I do? Is this what you have to live with to have nice wheels? I haven't had a custom set of wheels in about 15 years and don't remember having this type of situation in the past.

Help!

Brad

Tee

You might want to try High Speed Balancing and see if that will solve the issue.

Are any of your wheels bent?

Even a slight one can make it hard to balance.

jer08

Sounds like your upper and lower control arms, had the same thing at lower speeds and the dealer checked and the bushings were shot on the control arms. they also installed a new brake actuator. fixed the problem.
i had a lot less miles than you do on your car. plus the big rims and tires are magnifying the problem.
This is just my opinion ,have it checked by the dealer.

parscale

Thank you for the replies. Here is some further info.

In testing today I noticed a couple facts.

1) If I accelerate the vibration goes away, it is much worse as I coast and slow down through the problem speeds.

2) Each time I drive the car is a different severity. Sometimes it shakes my butt so much I feel like I am getting a massage, the next time I barely feel it in the wheel.

3) 72 MPH is the worse if I "coast" at that speed.

What is the difference with High Speed Balancing, where would I find this?

Brad

WBuffettjr

I think you're just hitting the natural resonant frequency of that wheel/tire combination. Every car has this at some speed. My mother's Chevy minivan did this at 65 mph with stock wheels/tires, my BMW 525i did it around 70 mph when I put on 19s with low profile tires, all cars have this issue at some speed. Before that speed and after that speed it will be smooth, but at that particular speed you hit the resonance of that diameter wheel/tire and it wobbles some. There is nothing you can do other than change either the diameter of the wheels or the diameter of your tires to a different size. This is one of the problems inherent in changing out the designed wheel/tire combination for something of your own preference merely for aesthetic reasons (I'm not criticizing - I did the same on my past car - I'm just saying).

caha14

Even many "expert" tire shops do bad balance jobs every day, either due to faulty equipment, poor mounting onto the balancer or other issues, so unless you have dealt with the same people before, "everything is within specs" may or may not be true. Believe me, I've been going through that with my LS as we speak (and have with other cars in the past), only to finally confirm what I have been saying to the dealer all along this time around: that their balancer is in rough shape.

Vibrations from tires/wheels that are out of balance will indeed trigger the resonant frequency (and its harmonics) of the front suspension and cause vibrations and a steering wheel shimmy, but a properly balanced assembly (that is reasonably round under load - this is where the road force part comes in) should not trigger vibrations of the magnitude you are describing.

You want to see a shop/dealer with a Hunter GSP9700 machine in good working order who also owns a Haweka adapter plate that will mount the wheel/tire assembly onto the balancer in exactly the same way as it goes on your car. This plate centers the wheel by the lug nut holes. This is an accessory recommended by the factory to balance Lexus and Toyota wheels. www.haweka-usa.com

parscale

Thanks for your input so far. To make things even more strange, during the same day I get absolutely no vibration and then come back and get complete vibration.

What would cause such a difference in vibration between drives?

Brad

WBuffettjr

Your lug nuts aren't loose, are they!?

caha14

Hi Brad, how did things turn out for you with this issue?

CJITTY

I was having issues too and i finally got a good balance from discount tire using their "Coates" machine that uses lasers to pinpoint exactly where the weights should go. Also, the person balancing must know what they are doing. My car is as smooth as glass. If you have aftermarket wheels and they are not hub centric, you must have hubcentric rings installed or it will never be right

caha14

Agree with you completely (see post #6). It is the intermittent nature of his vibration that is throwing me off.

My car has had vibration problems since I got it, and my dealer's balancer was on its last leg, so troubleshooting was difficult. That situation has been resolved, and the balance on my wheels is undoubtedly spot-on (verified on multiple pieces of brand new balancing equipment - all repeatable, and again, spot on). However, my car is exhibiting a similar intermittent vibration. This is why I am asking Brad, the original poster, if he has had any resolution, since once he posted about the intermittent nature of the vibration, that pushed me away from tires and wheels.

KA8

iTrader: (1)

Missing hub centric rings?

CJITTY

My balance issues were sporadic also..smooth sometimes then very annoying at other times going the same exact speed. I did pay $100 for 120mph on the car balancing that worked wonders, but wasn't trying to pay that every time. The Coates machine and someone with balancing experience took care of all that..no more issues

I8ABMR

I am kind of going through the same thing right now . I was having some vibrations, took the car in , got new tires for $1500 and now the vibration is worse than before. The "match balanced " the tire and wheel but the lubricant they put on the wheel to slide the tire on can cause the wheel to spin inside the tire therefore destroying your match balance on the freeway ride home. The shop marked the side of the wheel and the tire so that if they spun we would know. I went home and looked unde the car with a flash light and noticed that the mark on the wheel and the tire are about 8-12" apart now. The car is riding like crap now. The issue is when you return with the vibration problem they rebalance the wheel and tire when they are not match balanced. This allows them to get the better road force numbers but without having to tear everything apart and realign the low spot of the wheel with the high spot of the tire. I am pretty sure this is whats going on with my car and I am pretty sure this is why they can never get the balance done the right way no matter how many times you go back. I am going back today and going to demand that they match balance the wheels and tires again. I am going to tell the guy that even if they can get the road force numbers into an acceptable range they would be better if they repeated the match balance. I dont care what they charge me, I just want to have a smooth ride and not have to return to the shop 3-4 times before I just give up. They never get it right, only acceptable .....kind of

caha14

Funny you mention this... I had heard about tires spinning on the wheels as a theoretical possibility, but it was something I had not experienced before. Until I got this car...

I had that happen to me on the LS as part of this 6-month saga (which I share more details on in a different thread). That did make the vibrations much, much worse. Once the dealer had a brand new machine, they thoroughly removed all lubricant from the tire beads (completely dry mount), and the tires have not slipped on the wheels ever since. You may want to ask them about doing that for you.

There is a tire mounting lubricant out there that dries into a glue of sorts to prevent this, but most places do not have it. The LS has way too much torque, so this probably happens more often than people notice (except for those of us like you and me with markings on the tires and wheels ).

The tires and wheels are now perfectly balanced, and the car still shakes...