GUNK fuel injector cleaner
11-28-14, 06:56 PM
#1
Racer
Thread Starter
GUNK fuel injector cleaner
Drove to Walmart today hoping to find BG44 or Techron fuel injector cleaner, but they didn't have either. Drove around to 4 auto parts stores and all I could find was Lucas. Tried Lucas a year ago and decided to buy a GUNK product for fuel injector cleaning.
I always but my gas at Shell and always use the high grade, but the car has 104,000 miles so I figured why not.
Any reason NOT to use this GUNK cleaner ? Should I keep looking for BG444 or the Techron ?
I always but my gas at Shell and always use the high grade, but the car has 104,000 miles so I figured why not.
Any reason NOT to use this GUNK cleaner ? Should I keep looking for BG444 or the Techron ?
11-29-14, 09:54 AM
#6
Racer
Thread Starter
Thought I'd tell you all I put 1/3 of the bottle of Gunk into my gas tank. Since then I am driving around the city in second gear at about 4000 rpms. Done about 75 miles already and the car is idling quite a bit smoother. It may be just the fact that I am making the engine work hard, probably for the first time in 4 years ...
Tom, thanks. I will check Costco, but I don't think they'll have it on the shelves in Canada.
Tom, thanks. I will check Costco, but I don't think they'll have it on the shelves in Canada.
11-29-14, 11:39 AM
#7
Pole Position
Stu, If you have idle issues, and if you haven't already, suggest cleaning the mass air flow sensor (with CRC mass air flow sensor cleaner) as well as the internals of the throttle body. You can clean the throttle body fairly well without removing the throttle body itself.
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11-29-14, 12:17 PM
#9
I'm an engine builder and can vouch for Marvel Mystery Oil. I use it in everything. I've used it in gas and have observed improved idle and fuel efficiency. In oil as a light cleaner and seal conditioner. Just recently I've shot it in the cylinders of my porsche 944 racecar and it's helped with oil consumption and blowby. It's got mmo in the gas and oil as well. I use it frequently as a maintenance item. Hell at work we use it in our sprint car engines before every race.
http://mobile.walmart.com/ip/16767858?wmlspartner=wlpa&adid=22222222228023727665&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=m&wl3=40839617072&wl4=&wl5=pla&wl6=78652596752&veh=sem
http://mobile.walmart.com/ip/16767858?wmlspartner=wlpa&adid=22222222228023727665&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=m&wl3=40839617072&wl4=&wl5=pla&wl6=78652596752&veh=sem
11-29-14, 12:44 PM
#10
Pole Position
I'm an engine builder and can vouch for Marvel Mystery Oil. I use it in everything. I've used it in gas and have observed improved idle and fuel efficiency. In oil as a light cleaner and seal conditioner. Just recently I've shot it in the cylinders of my porsche 944 racecar and it's helped with oil consumption and blowby. It's got mmo in the gas and oil as well. I use it frequently as a maintenance item. Hell at work we use it in our sprint car engines before every race.
http://mobile.walmart.com/ip/1676785...596752&veh=sem
http://mobile.walmart.com/ip/1676785...596752&veh=sem
12-01-14, 09:02 AM
#12
Pole Position
Ok, I'm curious about the good or bad effects of Lucas fuel cleaners. What is the collective wisdom of this group regarding Lucas? For the most part I've only heard good things about Lucas. How does it compare to Techron?
12-01-14, 09:58 AM
#14
At the "bob is the oil guy forum", most people seem to prefer Redline SI-1, BG44K and the Techron fuel system cleaner... I have used the Lucas cleaner a few times and never got any improvement in vehicle idle smoothness, etc. I assumed it was because it did not clean up any deposits in the fuel system. I then tried Redline and within a hundred miles, the vehicle performed like new. I have used Redline and BG44K in many vehicles and they have worked as advertised. Some of the cleaners actually work and others do not.
Last edited by XJSFan; 12-01-14 at 10:04 AM.
12-01-14, 12:27 PM
#15
Instructor
1) Gumout, a manufacturer of fuel injector cleaners, answered some user-submitted questions at BITOG. The key takeways are:
* Fuel additives without PEA (polyether amines) often contain PIBA (polyisobutylene) that clean carburetors and indirect port injectors. At high concentrations, PIBA can clean intake valves, but does not clean combustion chambers. PEA is good at cleaning intake valve deposits (IVD) in port fuel injected engines because the treated fuel is sprayed directly onto the intake valve. You need PEA to clean all three areas: fuel injectors, intake valves and combustion chambers. We continually investigate detergent chemistry to ensure we are using the most up to date and effective additives. Currently PEA is the safest and most effective technology available for cleaning the entire fuel system.
* On very short trips, the engine is not hot enough to support optimal combustion and allow the product to work its best. Longer trips are better because the vehicle runs at full operating temperature where the detergents are most effective. Overall we would favor (adding a fuel injector cleaner to an empty gas tank prior to refueling before) a long highway trip at freeway speeds.
* About Chevron Techron: Chevron doesn’t share their formulation information but independent testing that Gumout conducted does confirm presence of PEA in Chevron fuel system cleaners. The PEA levels in Gumout's formulations are proprietary information as well, but a good way to compare is to look at how many gallons each product treats. Gumout All-in-One 10oz treats 35 gallons, which is supported by industry recognized ASTM testing; Techron 16oz treats 16 gallons. Chevron doesn’t publically state how they determine their treat rates, but one would assume they have conducted legitimate testing. Gumout All-in-One also has a friction modifier to reduce internal engine friction for better fuel economy. This is an advantage that Techron does not have.
* Gumout product performance is supported through a series of industry recognized ASTM laboratory bench and engine tests such as D6201 Engine Test, D665B Rust Prevention Test, D525 fuel stability test, etc. Engines are run and disassembled and the deposits are actually measured before and after clean-up using the PEA detergent. The appearance is viewed and rated and deposits are weighed in some areas of the engine or thickness is measure in other areas. Engine test stands, chassis dynamometers and vehicle fleets are all used to evaluate performance. There is a substantial amount of testing and validation behind all Gumout Products.
Source: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/gumout-q/
2) Shell invited Autoblog to its Technology Center near Houston, Texas, to learn more about its V-Power premium gasoline. The key takeways about gasoline detergent additives are:
* In 1997, the US EPA mandated a Lowest Additive Concentration (LAC) for all gasoline. However, testing by BMW, General Motors, Honda, and Toyota showed that low concentrations of additives can actually increase deposit buildup, so in 2002, these four companies created a group called Top Tier Gas (TTG). Gas retailers who earn the TTG designation use more detergent than the LAC that the EPA mandates, but the point of TTG is not about a particular amount of detergent - it's about maintaining the higher performance standards dictated by car companies concerning their engine tolerances and cleanliness. Not being TTG certified doesn't mean a producer uses the bare minimum federally-mandated Lowest Additive Concentration, but TTG certification gives buyers a way to know what they're buying. And if you think TTG is just another arm of the conspiracy to get you to buy 'name brand' gas, you'll have to include the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) among the corrupt, since they recommend it, too.
* Gasoline producers can use more detergent in a blend than is required by Top Tier, though, and that's what Shell has done with its V-Power premium; it contains the highest detergent concentration. While all grades of Shell gasoline are designed to clean up existing deposits, the idea is that V-Power will do so faster because it has more cleaning agents. The regular- and mid-grade blends have at least twice the EPA-required levels of detergent, while V-Power has five times the Lowest Additive Concentration – but all blends are TTG-certified and have passed the performance tests.
Source: http://www.autoblog.com/2014/02/21/s...ier-gas-video/
Retailers of TTG are listed at http://www.toptiergas.com/retailers.html
Executive summary:
1) If you always use Top Tier Gas, you have a much lower risk of deposit-related engine issues and a fuel system cleaner may very well do absolutely nothing for you besides adding to your cost of gas.
2) If you are having a problem possibly related to engine deposits, fully warm up your engine, add a bottle of high-PEA fuel system cleaner prior to refueling (so that the cleaner mixes properly), and then take a long drive.
3) Do #2 and use up all of the treated gas prior to every X oil changes. Replace X with a number suitable for your personal cost/benefit situation. If deposits exist, it is conceivable that some may get washed out into the oil.
4) Gumout Regane Complete Fuel System Cleaner is $6.49CAD (1/2 off) at Canadian Tire's Cyber Monday.
* Fuel additives without PEA (polyether amines) often contain PIBA (polyisobutylene) that clean carburetors and indirect port injectors. At high concentrations, PIBA can clean intake valves, but does not clean combustion chambers. PEA is good at cleaning intake valve deposits (IVD) in port fuel injected engines because the treated fuel is sprayed directly onto the intake valve. You need PEA to clean all three areas: fuel injectors, intake valves and combustion chambers. We continually investigate detergent chemistry to ensure we are using the most up to date and effective additives. Currently PEA is the safest and most effective technology available for cleaning the entire fuel system.
* On very short trips, the engine is not hot enough to support optimal combustion and allow the product to work its best. Longer trips are better because the vehicle runs at full operating temperature where the detergents are most effective. Overall we would favor (adding a fuel injector cleaner to an empty gas tank prior to refueling before) a long highway trip at freeway speeds.
* About Chevron Techron: Chevron doesn’t share their formulation information but independent testing that Gumout conducted does confirm presence of PEA in Chevron fuel system cleaners. The PEA levels in Gumout's formulations are proprietary information as well, but a good way to compare is to look at how many gallons each product treats. Gumout All-in-One 10oz treats 35 gallons, which is supported by industry recognized ASTM testing; Techron 16oz treats 16 gallons. Chevron doesn’t publically state how they determine their treat rates, but one would assume they have conducted legitimate testing. Gumout All-in-One also has a friction modifier to reduce internal engine friction for better fuel economy. This is an advantage that Techron does not have.
* Gumout product performance is supported through a series of industry recognized ASTM laboratory bench and engine tests such as D6201 Engine Test, D665B Rust Prevention Test, D525 fuel stability test, etc. Engines are run and disassembled and the deposits are actually measured before and after clean-up using the PEA detergent. The appearance is viewed and rated and deposits are weighed in some areas of the engine or thickness is measure in other areas. Engine test stands, chassis dynamometers and vehicle fleets are all used to evaluate performance. There is a substantial amount of testing and validation behind all Gumout Products.
Source: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/gumout-q/
2) Shell invited Autoblog to its Technology Center near Houston, Texas, to learn more about its V-Power premium gasoline. The key takeways about gasoline detergent additives are:
* In 1997, the US EPA mandated a Lowest Additive Concentration (LAC) for all gasoline. However, testing by BMW, General Motors, Honda, and Toyota showed that low concentrations of additives can actually increase deposit buildup, so in 2002, these four companies created a group called Top Tier Gas (TTG). Gas retailers who earn the TTG designation use more detergent than the LAC that the EPA mandates, but the point of TTG is not about a particular amount of detergent - it's about maintaining the higher performance standards dictated by car companies concerning their engine tolerances and cleanliness. Not being TTG certified doesn't mean a producer uses the bare minimum federally-mandated Lowest Additive Concentration, but TTG certification gives buyers a way to know what they're buying. And if you think TTG is just another arm of the conspiracy to get you to buy 'name brand' gas, you'll have to include the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) among the corrupt, since they recommend it, too.
* Gasoline producers can use more detergent in a blend than is required by Top Tier, though, and that's what Shell has done with its V-Power premium; it contains the highest detergent concentration. While all grades of Shell gasoline are designed to clean up existing deposits, the idea is that V-Power will do so faster because it has more cleaning agents. The regular- and mid-grade blends have at least twice the EPA-required levels of detergent, while V-Power has five times the Lowest Additive Concentration – but all blends are TTG-certified and have passed the performance tests.
Source: http://www.autoblog.com/2014/02/21/s...ier-gas-video/
Retailers of TTG are listed at http://www.toptiergas.com/retailers.html
Executive summary:
1) If you always use Top Tier Gas, you have a much lower risk of deposit-related engine issues and a fuel system cleaner may very well do absolutely nothing for you besides adding to your cost of gas.
2) If you are having a problem possibly related to engine deposits, fully warm up your engine, add a bottle of high-PEA fuel system cleaner prior to refueling (so that the cleaner mixes properly), and then take a long drive.
3) Do #2 and use up all of the treated gas prior to every X oil changes. Replace X with a number suitable for your personal cost/benefit situation. If deposits exist, it is conceivable that some may get washed out into the oil.
4) Gumout Regane Complete Fuel System Cleaner is $6.49CAD (1/2 off) at Canadian Tire's Cyber Monday.