scottgolf

First let me say I think my 430 is the best car i have ever owned. I can afford a 460 easily. but I freaking love my late 05 430. I don't see it as "dated" as some people, I really see it as a classic especially the interior.

I am 39 years old, and have had many luxury cars, and been an owner and enthusiast with many brands, but with lexus its different and not in a good way. Am I the only one to notice this? surely other people must. I am not complaining or judging, just wondering if I am the only one that feels this way.

Here is what I mean by enthusiast with merc, bmw, jag, hell even corvette has a few. they improve the handling of the car and add to the appearance in a way that form follows function. For example AMG, M, Callaway. Also they use wheels that maintain or lower the unsprung weight, not add to it. When they lower a car, its done right, with coil overs, and the suspension is set to follow function, with the camber set for better handling, not "poking" or what ever it is called.

Why is it that we don't have an enthusiast outfit for lexus like this? I don't mean this in a put down way, but with lexus its like you can either leave your car stock, or you can make a lowrider / whooptie out of it. I seriously don't get it. The body kits for lexus are not good or good looking. Everything has that mexican lowrider look.

Does anybody know what I mean? like my friends have amg, m, callaway, alpine bmw, linginfelter, and so on. All we have is VIP, junction produce, and so forth.

I know bettering a car means different things to people, and with Lexus people it seems like whooptie lowrider is the only style.

Do you think if someone started a real enthusiast company their products would sell. or are these cars only mean to be suped up to be "good in the hood" or "HO runners"

caddyowner

LOL, good understatement.

Scott, I agree with you 100%. I stiffened up the rear end with the sport suspension rear stabilizer and may do something to the front end. I've always considered mods that improve handling and performance rather than the VIP and Junction Produce look. (I hope the name Junction Produce is something translated from Japanese. Whenever I see that name all I think of is a produce weighing station at a corner a few miles from my in-laws. Since they grew a lot of cukes in that area, it was called the Pickle Station.)

That said, the wide LS430 seats with little / no side bolstering aren't very conducive to speed through the twisties.

CarGuy89

There are handling mods. I've been in a 430 with coils (Milan's actually) and it totally transforms it, feels much more 5 series in the bends and still rides like a Lexus should. I do know what you're saying, not really a huge fan of the kits (though I've never really liked aftermarket kits on any car). To be totally honest, I'm not a huge Lexus fan overall. I like the LS400/430, IS-F, and LFA. I will likely move to the 750 or S550 for my next luxo barge.

Selah777

VIP looks "mexican" lowrider to you?

scottgolf

selah, Hi, yea to me it does, i don't think I have ever seen a vip car that wasn't lowered to the point of negative impact on the car.

CaddyOwner, You are a cool guy, I love to read your posts and replies, thanks for replying to mine. That is cool that you share the same enthusiast view. Also that is hilarious about the pickle station.

Carguy: i agree i have never bought a "kit" myself, but I have bought cars like a grand national that had a different body from the outfit. I also had a saleen mustang.

Yea guys here are some more of what i would call real enthusiast outfits, wish we had serious places like these for our lexus. I know the 430 isn't a performance car, but it is such a good road car, you would think it would have an enthusiast base like the s600 does.

Saleen, yenko, dinnan, asc maclearan, svo or svt, hp motorsports, doug rippie, brabas, maybach, mugen, ruf, mallot motorsports, penskie, shelby


Also, I should note that sometimes I see s class and 7 series that are "hood rats" so the bad taste is everyplace.

I also wonder if it is a generation gap. Younger people grew up with the "pimp my ride" style and that is what is cool to them. maybe 430s are owned by the younger crowd?

That "pimp my ride" gangsta rappa stuff, just wasn't cool (or invented yet) when I was growing up. It was cool because rock and roll was on MTV, then some idiots figured out how to break dance and it all went south from there, gangsta life is here to stay i am affraid.

LucidSnow

vip originated from japan so its not mexican.
its a style of modification that ppl either are in love or completed dislike. so you do or you dont, not on the fence. in japan the modifications can go a lil extreme with full bodykits as its also not my style to go that crazy.

vip is not function over form. its all for show imo. to issue your question. majority of vip cars are on air ride systems so the ride height is not a issue, can be from 1inch off ground to higher then stock height. the dislike of the outrageous stretch and poke tires rims and negative camber is understandable i agree there. but its also a method to fit 11-12inch wide rims compared to stock 7.5inch rims. aero bodykits are for looks not aerodynamics to race the car faster. most vip cars have bbk not because its needed, the stock are more then sufficient. theres 10grand turbo kits for our car to increase power by only 100hp more but thats almost no power gain for price value. to me thats still just status for bells and whistles. you buy a ferrari not because you can ever use the full extent of the car but for status.

you can mod your ls430 for improving handling, actual performance mods but the car isnt really intended for that nor will it ever out perform cars designed that way. lexus are made for the soft luxury suspension with luxury comfort fully in mind. you can add stiff coilvers/ toms bracings/ swaybars and make it handle better but your also defeating the purpose of buying the lexus to begin with as a arguement. out of the box. benz and beemers also are sporty handling and high hp as their strengths. lexus has always been the most quiet/soft comfort ride like floating on clouds when driving over potholes.

hope that explains some questions for you. they do it only because they can and have money to go a certain style of modifications they enjoy. its not for everyone. you can mod your car for the sporty style as i see those aswell, instead of vip. i personally like vip styles, it amazes me how creative and baller products ppl put into their cars. i will be lowering my car on 20s and get a lipkit for stock bumpers only to get my ideal mods. my lexus is my comfort car and my play car remains my nissan 240sx with stiff suspension handling. night and day. 2 different worlds.

votru

iTrader: (7)

LucidSnow, cheers.
LS460 Sport is an option but probably nowhere close to MB or BMW. Lexus is the daily comfy couch while save Honda/Nissan/Miata for the weekend adrenaline rush.

scottgolf

oh yea, I totally see what you guys are saying about lexus staying a comfy car. I totally agree, I am just looking for like a maybach, or callaway or serious outfitter that can make a change in the car that does more than just make the car look different.

I am all for people setting up their own cars the way they want. Its just that I am finding a void to satisfy my needs and wants of the car. I wish we had something like SVO/SVT or amg or something like that for our cars.

Stu

Nope, I'd bet it would fail - miserably.

The LS never will be a high perfprmance sports car, ( too big and heavy ) unless you're willing to spend huge money. I suspect most owners wouldn't be willing to spend big money to turbo/supercharge their Lexus.


If you want to own a road burning rocket, I think you are finding out that you simply bought the wrong car.

sojah

iTrader: (1)

scottgolf first off i am finding it very difficult at the moment (while i type this) to remain PC and to only call your initial statement something to the effect of douche thread of the year worthy on CL... now that i've gotten that out of the way i will start addressing your various arguments.

1. What about the F (F Sport line)? i know they were a little late to the party but it is there. What about TRD? Because all of our LS430's like it or not started out life as a Toyota... yeah a Toyota.

2. your comparing things that shouldn't be compared. the LS430 is better compared to a big cadillac like the DTS or deville (whatever). so if someone wrote up why don't they have a tuner version of of a DTS it would just sound silly right? why doesn't linginfelter make a tuner version for a cadi deville??? there are plenty of performance mods for a lot of lex/toyota out there, and your lack of knowledge about this proves to me that you just don't know and you don't know what you don't know so obviously you just don't know... make sense¿

3. VIP,,, where to begin. if you don't like it then its obviously not for you. you must not have seen some well done versions to compare them with hood rides or something to this effect. i'm assuming you live in a middle class caucasion neighborhood in middle america where the ford truck and chevy impala are king. in this type of environment it must be rare to see a high end lex or infiniti so this may add to the out of place looking-ness of any modded japanese car and i would think that you would immediately try to compare them with something more familiar to you, such as a 'mexican' honda or nissan since there are prolly a few of these riding around to support the customer service industry of your town.

i think this was already covered but vip is usually not associated with function and it is difficult to have vip and function and since we have already determined that the LS430 is not a performance (handling or speed) car this makes it more suited to VIP... if you know about the VIP scene then you would know that the 2 most popular VIP platforms of all time were/are the LS430 and the Q45. so to ask why on a dedicated LS430 fan section page why so many seem to be VIP'd seems a little suspect to me... there are a few on here who choose not to mod their LS430's and i completely understand.

in my opinion a VIP car should be tastefully modded. sometimes this can be extreme (jun & GATO) and sometimes can be an understated beauty such as what BNR34 has done. i think as the prices inevitably fall on this vehicle you will see more getting into the hands of individuals who do not want their car to be tasteful and this will lead to hoopties as you call it.

HiloDB1

iTrader: (3)

WoW

AlexusAnja

As Lexus lovers, we all want our cars to be as good handling or as 'sporty' looking as the German competition, but from a business model, what was Lexus built on? Luxury, and comfort, at not sky high prices. if Lexus starts building cars exactly like the competitor, what then separates them? Do you really think that Lexus would woo away the German car fans or would Lexus lose more in customers that don't like the harsher ride?

you can't be democrat and republican politician at the same time...you have to be one or the other.

Dailow

If anything, the opposite is true - 430s are owned by the older crowd. Heck, I'm 28 and my dad makes fun of me for driving "an old man's car". Not many young people can afford the (former) Lexus flagship model, nor would many want to - I doubt it offers an exciting enough ride for them. I would argue that the sportiness factor is the reason why you see so many third party outfits with the German models.

It's a problem because of a gross lack of sportiness that Toyota/Lexus has become known for. The IS/GS modding communities seem healthy enough, but other than those models, I can't think of any other sporty models in their current lineup. Seriously, something seems so wrong with seeing a fully modded, tricked out beige Corolla rolling down the street.

It used to be different with the Supra and Celica, but I digress... times are changing with the LF-A and 2013 GS (and FT-86) so we'll see what the future brings with a renewed focus towards sportiness.

Then again, none of this particularly matters to me. I'll continue to let my LS430 just absolutely spoil me

Dutchie101

Soja is spot on.
If you actually took the time to look at the history of the LS430, its roots firmly bedded in Japanese VIP/Car scene and culture, you wouldnt even be asking the questions you have proposed.

Is it just me or do 90% of US 430 owners have no idea on the roots of the LS nor the cult following of its conception and progression in the VIP scene? I dont mean that in a bad way, but it seem to me that a lot of US owners have little or no idea about the car or its performance/aero/suspension support in Japan or outside of the US?

I think Soja and i have touched on this before a while back.

I have over 10 LS430 (Celsior) 'bibles' from Japan, thick, THICK magazines, with nothing but aftermarket parts dedicated to the LS430.....

VIP 430's can still retain the opulence and luxury of the standard car, so why not create something you love... In fact i purchased my 430 specifically for its form, function, reliability, VIP status and as a platform for me to finally fulfill my VIP dream.

sojah

iTrader: (1)

you got it ^ ^ ^... why can't i write my thoughts so politely and non attackingly? i'm working on it though. i had just finished my workout when i wrote that and was trying not to be all aggro but hopefully i made my point.

like you said there is a ton of devotion to this car and some of the CELSIOR 'bibles' feature a range of everything from hot rod ready CELSIORS to track versions, to straight sex VIP rides. unbelievable to me how much is possible with this car and how much time and effort went into its design overall. i have the original LS hardcover L book that talks all about the original sedan (Lexus) that started it all. i wonder how many other cars on the road have that much heritage? its right up there with the E class Jag or Merc to me.